Ludwick?

[rchap24]

http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playernews.aspx?sport=MLB

 

The St. Louis Post Dispatch reports that the Cardinals are open to trading Rick Ankiel or Ryan Ludwick.

St. Louis has plenty of outfield depth with top prospect Colby Rasmus closing in on the majors, and is looking for both pitching and middle infield help. "We're looking at all available options to improve this club," general manager John Mozeliak said. "If that means we have to do some addition by subtraction, then we have to consider that."

 

Just a thought would be a nice 5 hitter, but I'd rather have a left handed bat. Could be kind of easy to obtain though.

[RedFlash]

http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playernews.aspx?sport=MLB

 

The St. Louis Post Dispatch reports that the Cardinals are open to trading Rick Ankiel or Ryan Ludwick.

St. Louis has plenty of outfield depth with top prospect Colby Rasmus closing in on the majors, and is looking for both pitching and middle infield help. "We're looking at all available options to improve this club," general manager John Mozeliak said. "If that means we have to do some addition by subtraction, then we have to consider that."

 

Just a thought would be a nice 5 hitter, but I'd rather have a left handed bat. Could be kind of easy to obtain though.

 

1: He reeks of Mark Bellhorn. One unexpectedly good yr, never to hear from again.

2: Cards won't trade him to the Cubs unless they get the Cubs to overpay for him.

3: I prefer Hermida, as do many on this board.

[rchap24]

http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playernews.aspx?sport=MLB

 

The St. Louis Post Dispatch reports that the Cardinals are open to trading Rick Ankiel or Ryan Ludwick.

St. Louis has plenty of outfield depth with top prospect Colby Rasmus closing in on the majors, and is looking for both pitching and middle infield help. "We're looking at all available options to improve this club," general manager John Mozeliak said. "If that means we have to do some addition by subtraction, then we have to consider that."

 

Just a thought would be a nice 5 hitter, but I'd rather have a left handed bat. Could be kind of easy to obtain though.

 

1: He reeks of Mark Bellhorn. One unexpectedly good yr, never to hear from again.

2: Cards won't trade him to the Cubs unless they get the Cubs to overpay for him.

3: I prefer Hermida, as do many on this board.

 

As I said so do I just thought I'd post it

[gflore34]

No thank you, Hermida, 25 in 09, LHB >>>> 1 year, thus far, wonder 30 yr old, RHB Ludwick - it will be interesting see if he can replicate or come close to his 08 numbers in 09 though

[fromthestretch]

 

1: He reeks of Mark Bellhorn. One unexpectedly good yr, never to hear from again.

2: Cards won't trade him to the Cubs unless they get the Cubs to overpay for him.

3: I prefer Hermida, as do many on this board.

 

 

Ask the 2004 Red Sox if they've heard of Mark Bellhorn.

[RedFlash]

 

1: He reeks of Mark Bellhorn. One unexpectedly good yr, never to hear from again.

2: Cards won't trade him to the Cubs unless they get the Cubs to overpay for him.

3: I prefer Hermida, as do many on this board.

 

 

Ask the 2004 Red Sox if they've heard of Mark Bellhorn.

 

BoSox could name you everybody from that team from Martinez to Papelbon to Mueller to Youk. So that proves nothing.

[rchap24]

 

1: He reeks of Mark Bellhorn. One unexpectedly good yr, never to hear from again.

2: Cards won't trade him to the Cubs unless they get the Cubs to overpay for him.

3: I prefer Hermida, as do many on this board.

 

 

Ask the 2004 Red Sox if they've heard of Mark Bellhorn.

 

I do agree with that statement, but Bellhorn didnt put up near the numbers Ludwick did

[fromthestretch]

 

1: He reeks of Mark Bellhorn. One unexpectedly good yr, never to hear from again.

2: Cards won't trade him to the Cubs unless they get the Cubs to overpay for him.

3: I prefer Hermida, as do many on this board.

 

 

Ask the 2004 Red Sox if they've heard of Mark Bellhorn.

 

BoSox could name you everybody from that team from Martinez to Papelbon to Mueller to Youk. So that proves nothing.

 

The point is that Bellhorn had more than one good year.

 

I'm not trying to make a case for Ludwick. I actually agree with points 2 and 3 that you made above. But your first point wasn't accurate.

[VVMattVV]

 

1: He reeks of Mark Bellhorn. One unexpectedly good yr, never to hear from again.

2: Cards won't trade him to the Cubs unless they get the Cubs to overpay for him.

3: I prefer Hermida, as do many on this board.

 

 

Ask the 2004 Red Sox if they've heard of Mark Bellhorn.

 

BoSox could name you everybody from that team from Martinez to Papelbon to Mueller to Youk. So that proves nothing.

 

If they named those four guys as being on the 2004 team, they wouldn't have known the roster very well.

[RedFlash]

 

1: He reeks of Mark Bellhorn. One unexpectedly good yr, never to hear from again.

2: Cards won't trade him to the Cubs unless they get the Cubs to overpay for him.

3: I prefer Hermida, as do many on this board.

 

 

Ask the 2004 Red Sox if they've heard of Mark Bellhorn.

 

BoSox could name you everybody from that team from Martinez to Papelbon to Mueller to Youk. So that proves nothing.

 

The point is that Bellhorn had more than one good year.

 

So he had one fluke yr in terms of power, and one decent yr in his 10 yr career. Coincidently his two best yrs ame in his first yr with the Cubs and the Sox. After the first yr, he went to crappy out. 2 decent yrs and 8 crappy ones, do not a career make. Bellhorn is a crappy player who got by on the NL not having a book on him in 2002, and the AL not having a big book in 2004, but once the book was out, Bellhorn stunk.

 

I'm not trying to make a case for Ludwick. I actually agree with points 2 and 3 that you made above. But your first point wasn't accurate.

[SouthSideRyan]

The book finally came together after Bellhorn shoulda won the MVP in the '04 WS. That series was the final piece to the puzzle.

[fromthestretch]

So he had one fluke yr in terms of power, and one decent yr in his 10 yr career. Coincidently his two best yrs ame in his first yr with the Cubs and the Sox. After the first yr, he went to crappy out. 2 decent yrs and 8 crappy ones, do not a career make. Bellhorn is a crappy player who got by on the NL not having a book on him in 2002, and the AL not having a big book in 2004, but once the book was out, Bellhorn stunk.

 

Tell me where I commented on the quality of Bellhorn's career as a whole.

 

Wait...you can't? That might be because I didn't say it. I simply pointed out that you were wrong when you said he had one good year and was never heard from again. Lighten up, Francis.

 

And I doubt that his success in 2004 had much to do with the "AL not having a big book" on him. It probably had a lot to do with his .364 BABIP. Considering interleague play, video footage, scouting, etc....I'm sure that AL pitchers were well aware of what type of hitter Bellhorn was.

[fromthestretch]

The book finally came together after Bellhorn shoulda won the MVP in the '04 WS. That series was the final piece to the puzzle.

 

Apparently, St. Louis threw away their Bellhorn book when he got traded to the AL, thinking they were never going to face him again.

 

Oops.

[SouthSideRyan]

The book finally came together after Bellhorn shoulda won the MVP in the '04 WS. That series was the final piece to the puzzle.

 

Apparently, St. Louis threw away their Bellhorn book when he got traded to the AL, thinking they were never going to face him again.

 

Oops.

 

Idiots.

[RedFlash]

So he had one fluke yr in terms of power, and one decent yr in his 10 yr career. Coincidently his two best yrs ame in his first yr with the Cubs and the Sox. After the first yr, he went to crappy out. 2 decent yrs and 8 crappy ones, do not a career make. Bellhorn is a crappy player who got by on the NL not having a book on him in 2002, and the AL not having a big book in 2004, but once the book was out, Bellhorn stunk.

 

Tell me where I commented on the quality of Bellhorn's career as a whole.

 

Wait...you can't? That might be because I didn't say it. I simply pointed out that you were wrong when you said he had one good year and was never heard from again. Lighten up, Francis.

 

And I doubt that his success in 2004 had much to do with the "AL not having a big book" on him. It probably had a lot to do with his .364 BABIP. Considering interleague play, video footage, scouting, etc....I'm sure that AL pitchers were well aware of what type of hitter Bellhorn was.

 

 

Fine, he has two yrs, and has been heard from again. And when I mean "haven't been heard from again" I mean production wise. Otherwise, he has bounce around, but as a productive player, he has been from since 2004. Is that better, is that more defined?

 

Second: No you didn't comment on Bellhorn's career, I pointed out that just because Ludwick had one extremely lucky yr, he could be compare to Bellhorn in the sesne of how unlikely his season was. I mention the unlikeliness of Ludwick repeated that success, and I used Bellhorn as a comparasion, and it's a valid comp.

[fromthestretch]

Fine, he has two yrs, and has been heard from again. And when I mean "haven't been heard from again" I mean production wise. Otherwise, he has bounce around, but as a productive player, he has been from since 2004. Is that better, is that more defined?

 

Second: No you didn't comment on, I was pointed out that just because Ludwick had one extremely lucky yr, he could be compare to Bellhorn in the sesne of how unlikely his season was. I was mention the unlikeliness of Ludwick repeated that success, and I used Bellhorn as a comparasion, and it's a valid comp.

 

I don't feel it's much of a comparison. Ludwick had success in limited action (339 PA) in 2007, and he showed more power in the minors than Bellhorn. Do I think he'll repeat his 2008? Not really. However, it's not a stretch to think he could be a 25-homer guy the next few years. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see him put up an .850 OPS next season. I could definitely see his OBP falling back to the .330-.340 range though.

 

So IDK who pissed in your corn flakes this morning, but it certainly wasn't me.

 

If you're reading my responses as hostile, then you're completely misinterpreting them.

[reggiemiller rules]

The rumors are that the Cards are talking to the Braves about Ludwick for Kelly Johnson. But the Cards want to get some pitching prospects back in the deal.

[Clem Fandango]

I wouldn't necessarily deem him a fluke, as he's always had a lot of power throughout his minor league career, but I think what makes him a better hitter is the fact that he gets to hit around Albert Pujols. Pujols missed time between June 10th and June 26th. During that time Ludwick's average dropped from .318 to .286. His OPS dropped from 1.055 to .945.

 

regardless of that, I think he'd be productive enough to smack 25HR again easily, but as far as his other peripheral stats, I don't think they'd be nearly as good without someone like Albert Pujols hitting around him.

 

So I would also say no. Plus because he's in the same division the Cubs would have to overpay for him.

[The Other 15]

BoSox could name you everybody from that team from Martinez to Papelbon to Mueller to Youk.

 

Papelbon had nothing to do with the 2004 Red Sox.

 

And Mark Bellhorn had a better 2002 with the Cubs than he did in 2004 with the Sox which makes him a bad argument as to why Ludwick wont hit again.

 

Saying that players like Ludwick and Dempster wont come close to repeating their performances just because they hadn't done it before doesn't make it so. There are plenty of examples of players who hit their stride later in their careers. As important as hitting their stride, they found the right situation for themselves. Will Demp lose his control and forget how to throw a splitter that looks like a FB for 40 feet? Could happen. Will Ludwick forget how to hit fastballs with teams pitching around Pujols? Could happen. It's not as guaranteed as some think.

[The Other 15]

The rumors are that the Cards are talking to the Braves about Ludwick for Kelly Johnson. But the Cards want to get some pitching prospects back in the deal.

I saw those rumors too. I'm not sure how one of the best offenses in the NL gets better if it replaces Ludwick with Johnson.

[Sammy Sofa]

If you're reading my responses as hostile, then you're completely misinterpreting them.

 

Are you questioning his careful consideration and research?

[17 Seconds]

 

1: He reeks of Mark Bellhorn. One unexpectedly good yr, never to hear from again.

2: Cards won't trade him to the Cubs unless they get the Cubs to overpay for him.

3: I prefer Hermida, as do many on this board.

 

 

Ask the 2004 Red Sox if they've heard of Mark Bellhorn.

 

BoSox could name you everybody from that team from Martinez to Papelbon to Mueller to Youk. So that proves nothing.

 

The point is that Bellhorn had more than one good year.

 

Yeah.. he had 2. Dude's a stud

[mul21]

The rumors are that the Cards are talking to the Braves about Ludwick for Kelly Johnson. But the Cards want to get some pitching prospects back in the deal.

I saw those rumors too. I'm not sure how one of the best offenses in the NL gets better if it replaces Ludwick with Johnson.

 

By being more balanced. If they get the production they think they can out of Rasmus and add in Johnson's numbers, you probably end up with a little more production overall plus you've added 2 guys in front of Pujols who are expected to get on base at a pretty good clip.

[fromthestretch]

 

1: He reeks of Mark Bellhorn. One unexpectedly good yr, never to hear from again.

2: Cards won't trade him to the Cubs unless they get the Cubs to overpay for him.

3: I prefer Hermida, as do many on this board.

 

 

Ask the 2004 Red Sox if they've heard of Mark Bellhorn.

 

BoSox could name you everybody from that team from Martinez to Papelbon to Mueller to Youk. So that proves nothing.

 

The point is that Bellhorn had more than one good year.

 

Yeah.. he had 2. Dude's a stud

 

Way to parse that out from absolutely nothing resembling that sentiment.

[The Other 15]

By being more balanced. If they get the production they think they can out of Rasmus and add in Johnson's numbers, you probably end up with a little more production overall plus you've added 2 guys in front of Pujols who are expected to get on base at a pretty good clip.

 

Sorry, I disagree that the minimal gain you get with Kelly Johnson playing over anything they already had playing 2B makes them a better offense simply because they added a LH hitter.

 

Ludwicks production can't be overlooked when you consider how many times teams pitched around Albert.

 

But, as a Cub fan, I'm all for them making that deal.