2008 International Free Agent Market

[CoolHandLuke]

thanks!

[Guest]

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3736390

 

Junichi Tazawa signs a big league contract with the Boston Red Sox. Boston Globe has it as a $3 million contract.

[CoolHandLuke]

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3736390

 

Junichi Tazawa signs a big league contract with the Boston Red Sox. Boston Globe has it as a $3 million contract.

 

I have a semi-related question, that came up when me and a friend were arguing about Dayan Viciedo.

 

When an international players signs his first big league contract, do the service time rules apply? (ie he is under organizational control for 6 years [or whatever it is])

 

Ex. In 2012 when this three year deal is up, is Tazawa still under Red Sox control?

[1908]

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3736390

 

Junichi Tazawa signs a big league contract with the Boston Red Sox. Boston Globe has it as a $3 million contract.

 

I have a semi-related question, that came up when me and a friend were arguing about Dayan Viciedo.

 

When an international players signs his first big league contract, do the service time rules apply? (ie he is under organizational control for 6 years [or whatever it is])

 

Ex. In 2012 when this three year deal is up, is Tazawa still under Red Sox control?

Service-time rules apply, but high-profile free agents from Japan often have language added to their contracts that requires the team to release them after their initial contact is up -- effectively making them free agents sooner.

[Guest]

Tampa is the first MLB organization to open an academy in Brazil.

[UK1679666180]

http://www.bleedcubbieblue.com/2008/12/8/684681/bcb-interview-crane-kenney

 

And beyond the payroll what we’re doing, almost as importantly what we’re doing in the player development scouting … today we announced the hiring of a rock star scout for the Dominican, Louie Eljaua. I probably first heard about Louie about 10 months ago when Oneri Fleita came in and said we've got a shot at hiring a difference maker. Actually it’s not only the Dominican but also Asia and so we brought him on board and yesterday I met two of our Korean players. We spent a million and a half to sign two players from Korea.

 

BCB: Are these the two that just started in the system last year?

 

CK: These are two other players. But we are mining a lot of talent in Asia. Paul Weaver and Steve Wilson and our crew that are out there… anyway, the bottom line is the resources that we’re putting to bear whether it’s in Asian scouting, amateur draft, domestic amateur draft, our facility in Dominican, we’re now hawing I think 60 players for nine months – feeding them, schooling them, obviously working them out to develop them as players. We now have a state of the art facility in the Dominican, which is a far cry from where it was years ago. So, all the resources we’re putting into the system over all are presenting itself in the Marmols and the Sotos and the Theriots, the young players, we now see Samardzija coming up through the system. So it’s not just the major league payroll – gee how much is that going up??? Are you going to dedicate resources to Asia, Dominican, scouting, hiring new scouts, etc.

 

BCB: Is this all part of a plan to develop an over all organizational philosophy? Because lot of people that talk about this say that since they were kids, the Cubs have never had a top down organizational philosophy…

 

CK: Well there is. There’s the "Oriole Way." There are a number of people who have written books about this is the way our team is going to operate. I came at it, I’ve been involved in it 13, 14 years and I came at it, got control of this thing in ’03, and I’m not sure it’s a philosophy as much as it is asking a lot of questions –- how do we measure our scouts? How do we benchmark our scouts against their performance against other scouts? How do we, just like you would with a stock picker, know whether our scouts are picking players, maybe the ones that we drafted, maybe the ones that we didn’t draft, but that we scouted anyway. How do we measure performance in our scouting system? And then how do we allocate our resources toward the people that are performing well and away from the people that aren’t. How do we upgrade our staff? Hiring a Tim Wilken to come in and run our draft. I think those are just good business decisions that a group of us have gotten our heads around, but I don’t think we have a single philosophy. Certainly we need to produce more out of our system, everyone agrees with that. And that’s why John Stockstill moved on and Tim came in. And that’s why you’ve seen the changes underneath Tim. Think about this. At one point last year the Cubs were in first place, Iowa was in first place, Tennessee was in first place and Daytona was in first place.

 

I love the fact Flieta is excited about Eljaua, hopefully Eljaua can have similar success as Oneri did in that role before handing it to Serra. They were in much need of a brand facility in the DR as it was legendary how poor thier previous facility was, I've been critical of their Latin American scouting program for years amd it appears they are on the right track.

 

I bolded the last part b/c I disagree with it (beyond the Chicago Cubs obviously) b/c it's more about high end talent rather than a collective group with marginal to fringe talent that might not be age appropiate for the level they are at. Obviously, if you're only a fan of Daytona, Iowa, Boise, etc. and not the Chicago Cubs, that doesn't apply.

[Guest]

I think that last part is just fluff, I'm sure Oneri doesn't care if Daytona is in first or last as long as they have potential big leaguers improving over the course of the season.

 

The two new Korean guys are Jung Soo-min and Ha Jae-hoon who were mentioned in the Dae-Eun Rhee and Hak-Ju Lee thread.

[UK1679666180]

I think that last part is just fluff, I'm sure Oneri doesn't care if Daytona is in first or last as long as they have potential big leaguers improving over the course of the season.

 

The two new Korean guys are Jung Soo-min and Ha Jae-hoon who were mentioned in the Dae-Eun Rhee and Hak-Ju Lee thread.

 

Yes, that was just Kenney reaching for a positive spin on an overall disappointing farm right now.

[craig]

http://www.bleedcubbieblue.com/2008/12/8/684681/bcb-interview-crane-kenney

 

And beyond the payroll what we’re doing, almost as importantly what we’re doing in the player development scouting … today we announced the hiring of a rock star scout for the Dominican, Louie Eljaua. I probably first heard about Louie about 10 months ago when Oneri Fleita came in and said we've got a shot at hiring a difference maker. Actually it’s not only the Dominican but also Asia and so we brought him on board and yesterday I met two of our Korean players. We spent a million and a half to sign two players from Korea.

 

BCB: Are these the two that just started in the system last year?

 

CK: These are two other players. But we are mining a lot of talent in Asia. Paul Weaver and Steve Wilson and our crew that are out there…

 

I love the fact Flieta is excited about Eljaua, hopefully Eljaua can have similar success as Oneri did in that role before handing it to Serra. They were in much need of a brand facility in the DR as it was legendary how poor thier previous facility was, I've been critical of their Latin American scouting program for years amd it appears they are on the right track.

....

 

Questions/comments:

1. Two Koreans, 1.5 mill, "not" the "two that just started in the system last year. Guys, who is he talking about? Rhee was already in the system in 2007, so I'd think he'd be "not" in the two. Lee was sort of in the system this past season, and he listed at $700 or $750, IIRC. Is he one of the two? With Kenney considering Lee "this" season (included), and Rhee "last" season (not included)? Or is not even Lee included, since he did play in that Australian league? I've got to assume that Lee is one of the two, but even if he is, who's the other? OFer Ha and pitcher Min are the other two Koreans I recall having signed. have we gotten $$ info on them? I hadn't appreciated that either of them would have been a $750 guy, or both together. Have we signed somebody else, or which of those two is the $750-type guy, or what's your take on this? Or is Kenney just talking big and he doesn't really know what he's talking about?

 

2. Kenney's enthusaism for the international scouting is very encouraging.

 

3. Kenney's (and yours, ping) spin on the Dominican acadamy, I'm not sure I understand. MacP showed up in what, 95, and said he was going to get that done. Hasn't the Dominican facility been built and fancy for five or many more years by now? I don't quite understand how, if MacP kept talking about that, why 14 years later management should still be talking as if it's just happened and the corner will turn now. Even if it has been only within the last 6 years, I'm not sure how inspired I should be. During the 95-01 era, the system was getting Cruz, Z, Guzman, Marmol, Pie, Pinto, Beltran, Cueto. If that was pre-facility days, having the facility doesn't seem to be getting us anywhere close to getting the kind of talent we got then.

 

4. Eljaua, the rock star scout. Like you, ping, I'm very enthused that Kenney is so fired up about him. Even more so, I'm delighted that Kenney specifically refers to him as rock star scout .... "for the Dominican". His title was "special assistant", so I'd wondered whether he was really going to be digging up international talent for us, or tagging along with Hendry at GM meetings and discussing trades and free agent signings with Hendry's other special assistants, all with the purpose of training himself to be a GM down the road more than to acquire teenage Dominican talent for the Cubs. The concept that he will really be scouting the Dominican for us, and might do a "rock star" job of it, that's really exciting. If he's a star scout, I also wouldn't think he'd take a new job unless he was assured that he'd have $$ to spend on guys that he likes.

 

5. Eljaua further: Eljaua has background as an organization boss of Dominican or international scouting, with previous orgs. But he has not been given that title with the Cubs. Instead, just recently and subsequent to his hiring not Eljaua but instead Serra was announced as the Latin boss. What do you think is going on here? If Eljaua going to really be the guy on the field, charming kids and parents, networking with all the people he knows from his previous experience to get better leads and better access to real talent, possibly hiring some additional people who he knows are good from his previous operations? And Serra is getting bumped upstairs to a more office/administrative job where he doesn't need to travel as much or sell as much? Or are these titles really meaningless, that Serra's redesignation means little in terms of actual responsibilities, it's just a resume padder and with it comes a salary bump needed to keep a guy they think is effective? And Eljaua is tabbed as "special assistant" because that's the best paying job, and you couldn't get him if you designated him as "Dominican scout"? Any thoughts on what's really going on here?

[Guest]

I can't answer all your questions, Craig. Here's what I know:

 

Thus far in 2008, the Cubs have signed 3 Korean teenagers we know of: SS Hak-Ju Lee who received a $725,000 bonus, OF Jae-Hoon Ha and RHP Jung-Soo Min. I have no clue who Kenney is referring to in regards to that combined $1.5 million bonus, though. While I haven't seen any mention of bonus figures yet for Ha or Min, I had gotten the impression that Jung-Soo Min at least got a low 6-figure bonus given some of the favorable write ups after his signing. And just to note, Dae-Eun Rhee signed in 2007 for a $525,000 bonus.

 

I believe the Cubs shared facility at Baseball City (on the outskirts of Boca Chica) opened in June 2004 - note that Kenney said "years ago" which can easily be pre-June 2004. Baseball City *is* considered one of the best academies in the country though the Cubs share it with the White Sox, Diamondbacks, Reds, Orioles and Twins. According to what I've read, it lags behind only the facilities the Yankees and Padres have in the Dominican. You'd think the Cubs would be reaping any perceived benefits of having a nice academy in the DR by now since it's already been four years (the Padres opened their state of the art academy last year and weree one of the biggest spenders in Latin America this July).

[Guest]

Here's what Shinsano (East Windup Chronicle) wrote on Min:

 

The other player is a right-handed pitcher, Jung Soo-min, who went to Busan High School, the same school Choo Shin-soo went to, and also Ahn Tae-kyeong a pitcher the Rangers signed this past summer. Jung is listed as 6′0 and 192 lbs., but again, he’s bigger than that. Probably 6′2 right now. Like Ha, has very good makeup. He’s a bit of a late bloomer, and was actually behind Ahn on the Busan H.S. depth chart going into 2008. However, by the end of the season he was clearly the go to arm on the team. His fastball at the beginning of 2008 was reportedly 84-85. When I saw him in August it was usually around 86-87 and touching 88. Jung went to Arizona in September for instructional (not the AZL) and after working with coaches there for a couple weeks, is already touching 92.

 

The Rangers dropped $800,000 on Tae-Kyeong Ahn. If Min had relatively equivalent talent to Ahn by the end of his HS season, he probably got a sizable bonus too.

[Guest]

Cubans RHP Yadel Marti and OF Yasser Gomez defected last month: link.

 

And this dude needs to defect: http://worldbbtoday.blogspot.com/2008/12/cuban-pitcher-hits-102-on-radar-gun-in.html

[Guest]

Craig, Jim Callis just confirmed the bonus figures for RHP Su-Min Jung at $510,000 ($15,000 less than Dae-Eun Rhee's) and C/OF Jae-Hoon Ha at $225,000.

 

Last year at this time, I asked you about Dae-Eun Rhee and you clued us in on him. This time, I was wondering if you could fill us in on the Cubs two most recent Korean signees: Soo-Min Jung and Jae-Hoon Ha. Thank you very much!

 

A: Jim Callis: Su-Min Jung is the better of those two and checked in at No. 30 on the Top 30. He projects to pitch in the low 90s with a plus breaking ball down the road. He signed for $510,000 out of the same high school that produced Shin-Soo Choo and Cha Seung Baek. Ha, a catcher, isn't as highly regarded. He signed for $225,000.

[craig]

Thanks, cal, good question and nice to see the dollar figures in response. Earlier Kenney had alluded to "two Koreans" costing $1.5. Not sure his dollars were spot on, but it would see that Lee and Su-Min Jung were the guys he had in mind.

[Guest]

The Cubs spent $2.14 million on just these 8 guys in 2008:

 

SS Hak-Ju Lee, South Korea (age 17) - $725,000 bonus

RHP Su-Min Jung, South Korea (age 18) - $510,00 bonus

C/OF Jae-Hoon Ha, South Korea (age 18) - $225,000 bonus

LHP Cody Hams, Australia (age 18) - $150,000 bonus

OF Sean Williams, Australia (age 17) - unconfirmed $150,000 bonus

3B Joel Altagracia, Dominican Republic (age 16) - $140,000 bonus

RHP Adam Spencer, Australia (age 17) - $130,000 bonus

SS Carlos Henry, Dominican Republic (age 16) - $110,000 bonus

[craig]

When only considering bonuses that were 6 figures or greater, the Cubs spent $250,000 in Latin America this year (excluding Cuba). This does not take into account sub-six figure bonuses nor signings in the Pac Rim and Europe. This was the 8th least in MLB:

 

SPENDING SPREE

Team Money

Reds $5,705,000

A's $4,880,000

Padres $4,685,000

Yankees $4,250,000

Giants $2,750,000

Cardinals $2,685,000

Mariners $2,591,000

Braves $2,230,000

etc. .

 

"The Cubs spent $2.14 million on just these 8 guys in 2008:..."

 

That would put us up in the top10

[Guest]

When only considering bonuses that were 6 figures or greater, the Cubs spent $250,000 in Latin America this year (excluding Cuba). This does not take into account sub-six figure bonuses nor signings in the Pac Rim and Europe. This was the 8th least in MLB:

 

SPENDING SPREE

Team Money

Reds $5,705,000

A's $4,880,000

Padres $4,685,000

Yankees $4,250,000

Giants $2,750,000

Cardinals $2,685,000

Mariners $2,591,000

Braves $2,230,000

etc. .

 

"The Cubs spent $2.14 million on just these 8 guys in 2008:..."

 

That would put us up in the top10

 

To be fair, that BA list is only with Latin America. For example, if you count the Rangers $800,000 signing of Korean Tae-Kyeong Ahn, they jump the Cubs to $2.4.

 

But I think you're right that the $2.1 million is nothing to scoff at. It'd likely get the Cubs in the top 10.

 

And if you break it down, that's $1.46 million in South Korea, $430,000 in Australia and $250,000 in the Dominican. You have to hope that spending much more aggressively in the Pac Rim is a sound strategy. There do have fewer competitors and are able to wait till the players are 18 (which means the pitchers have more wear but there's obviously less guesswork on how an 18 year old will develop than a 16 year old).