Rosenthal: Reds, Cordero Agree on Deal

[reds44]

lol @ Cubs fans talking about bad contracts.

 

Why? Because they Cubs didn't get him?

 

If the Cubs had signed him for that deal, this board would have melted down with the people who hated the deal. Many people on this board don't like committing a decent percentage of the payroll to the bullpen to the first place. They also don't like multi-year deals for relievers. They also don't like signing guys in their 30's to long-term contracts. Finally, many think the position of closer is overrated to begin with. Cordero fits under all of the above, and while he'll likely be pretty productive he's not productive enough to be that big of a percentage of the Reds overall payroll.

What? You are talking about a team that was 29th in baseball in blown saves last year.

 

A blown save can occur pretty much anytime a starter leaves the ballgame. Most are not necessarilly even the fault of the "closer."

Ya think? The Reds issue really wasn't closer last year. Weathers was 33/38 in saves.

 

However, this allows the Reds to move Burton to the 7th, Weathers to the 8th, and Cordero to the 9th. It lines up the middle innings nicely. That's the point.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Can someone find a FA closer deal that people didn't hate before it was over? Paying 11+ million for a closer is lunacy, doing it for a nearly 33 year old for 4 years is how you get people to claim you have a reliever fetish.

The difference is, Cordero isn't trash. The reason we've had to get so many relievers is because they all suck.

 

Have you seen Cordero's performance aside from 2007? He's Michael Wuertz + playing time in the 9th + service time to be a FA.

[Bruno7481]

lol @ Cubs fans talking about bad contracts.

 

Why? Because they Cubs didn't get him?

 

If the Cubs had signed him for that deal, this board would have melted down with the people who hated the deal. Many people on this board don't like committing a decent percentage of the payroll to the bullpen to the first place. They also don't like multi-year deals for relievers. They also don't like signing guys in their 30's to long-term contracts. Finally, many think the position of closer is overrated to begin with. Cordero fits under all of the above, and while he'll likely be pretty productive he's not productive enough to be that big of a percentage of the Reds overall payroll.

What? You are talking about a team that was 29th in baseball in blown saves last year.

 

A blown save can occur pretty much anytime a starter leaves the ballgame. Most are not necessarilly even the fault of the "closer."

Ya think? The Reds issue really wasn't closer last year. Weathers was 33/38 in saves.

 

However, this allows the Reds to move Burton to the 7th, Weathers to the 8th, and Cordero to the 9th. It lines up the middle innings nicely. That's the point.

 

No offense, but what makes you so confident about Stormy Weathers in the 8th inning?

[wekse]

lol @ Cubs fans talking about bad contracts.

 

Why? Because they Cubs didn't get him?

 

If the Cubs had signed him for that deal, this board would have melted down with the people who hated the deal. Many people on this board don't like committing a decent percentage of the payroll to the bullpen to the first place. They also don't like multi-year deals for relievers. They also don't like signing guys in their 30's to long-term contracts. Finally, many think the position of closer is overrated to begin with. Cordero fits under all of the above, and while he'll likely be pretty productive he's not productive enough to be that big of a percentage of the Reds overall payroll.

What? You are talking about a team that was 29th in baseball in blown saves last year.

 

A blown save can occur pretty much anytime a starter leaves the ballgame. Most are not necessarilly even the fault of the "closer."

Ya think? The Reds issue really wasn't closer last year. Weathers was 33/38 in saves.

 

However, this allows the Reds to move Burton to the 7th, Weathers to the 8th, and Cordero to the 9th. It lines up the middle innings nicely. That's the point.

 

but you're paying 12 mil a year for it! that's what makes it a bad idea.

[reds44]

lol @ Cubs fans talking about bad contracts.

 

Why? Because they Cubs didn't get him?

 

If the Cubs had signed him for that deal, this board would have melted down with the people who hated the deal. Many people on this board don't like committing a decent percentage of the payroll to the bullpen to the first place. They also don't like multi-year deals for relievers. They also don't like signing guys in their 30's to long-term contracts. Finally, many think the position of closer is overrated to begin with. Cordero fits under all of the above, and while he'll likely be pretty productive he's not productive enough to be that big of a percentage of the Reds overall payroll.

What? You are talking about a team that was 29th in baseball in blown saves last year.

 

A blown save can occur pretty much anytime a starter leaves the ballgame. Most are not necessarilly even the fault of the "closer."

Ya think? The Reds issue really wasn't closer last year. Weathers was 33/38 in saves.

 

However, this allows the Reds to move Burton to the 7th, Weathers to the 8th, and Cordero to the 9th. It lines up the middle innings nicely. That's the point.

 

No offense, but what makes you so confident about Stormy Weathers in the 8th inning?

His time with the Reds leaves me no reason to be confident with him. And it really could be Weathers in the 7th and Burton in the 8th.

[UK1679666180]

It's baseball.

 

Show me a contract handed out in the free agent market that isn't bad. The Reds just signed the best pitcher off the market, and it fills a huge hole. The Reds can line up the bullpen with Burton, Weathers, and Cordero at the back end.

 

Now, trade one of our extra outfielders for a decent starter and you are looking at a contender in the central next year.

 

While I'm not high on the NL Central as a whole (I think right now the Brewers are the team to beat at this stage of the off-season), Cincy isn't in a position to win it all and should be concentrating more on building a young offensive core (which they have) and more importantly having the ability to lock them up. Allocating that much of the payroll on a closer might prevent that from occuring. While it fills a hole, who's to say that Burton could not have become the closer and addressed a 7th inning reliever/set-up guy much cheaper.

 

Cincy isn't a team that I suspect would be successful overall trying to outspend teams for the best FA reliever avail.

[reds44]

lol @ Cubs fans talking about bad contracts.

 

Why? Because they Cubs didn't get him?

 

If the Cubs had signed him for that deal, this board would have melted down with the people who hated the deal. Many people on this board don't like committing a decent percentage of the payroll to the bullpen to the first place. They also don't like multi-year deals for relievers. They also don't like signing guys in their 30's to long-term contracts. Finally, many think the position of closer is overrated to begin with. Cordero fits under all of the above, and while he'll likely be pretty productive he's not productive enough to be that big of a percentage of the Reds overall payroll.

What? You are talking about a team that was 29th in baseball in blown saves last year.

 

A blown save can occur pretty much anytime a starter leaves the ballgame. Most are not necessarilly even the fault of the "closer."

Ya think? The Reds issue really wasn't closer last year. Weathers was 33/38 in saves.

 

However, this allows the Reds to move Burton to the 7th, Weathers to the 8th, and Cordero to the 9th. It lines up the middle innings nicely. That's the point.

 

but you're paying 12 mil a year for it! that's what makes it a bad idea.

Yeah, if we could have signed the cheap stud closer I'm sure we would have.

[reds44]

It's baseball.

 

Show me a contract handed out in the free agent market that isn't bad. The Reds just signed the best pitcher off the market, and it fills a huge hole. The Reds can line up the bullpen with Burton, Weathers, and Cordero at the back end.

 

Now, trade one of our extra outfielders for a decent starter and you are looking at a contender in the central next year.

 

While I'm not high on the NL Central as a whole (I think right now the Brewers are the team to beat at this stage of the off-season), Cincy isn't in a position to win it all and should be concentrating more on building a young offensive core (which they have) and more importantly having the ability to lock them up. Allocating that much of the payroll on a closer might prevent that from occuring. While it fills a hole, who's to say that Burton could not have become the closer and addressed a 7th inning reliever/set-up guy much cheaper.

 

Cincy isn't a team that I suspect would be successful overall trying to outspend teams for the best FA reliever avail.

Every team in the central has a chance to win it all. All you have to do is get in the playoffs and anything can happen.

[rocket]

lol @ Cubs fans talking about bad contracts.

 

Why? Because they Cubs didn't get him?

 

If the Cubs had signed him for that deal, this board would have melted down with the people who hated the deal. Many people on this board don't like committing a decent percentage of the payroll to the bullpen to the first place. They also don't like multi-year deals for relievers. They also don't like signing guys in their 30's to long-term contracts. Finally, many think the position of closer is overrated to begin with. Cordero fits under all of the above, and while he'll likely be pretty productive he's not productive enough to be that big of a percentage of the Reds overall payroll.

What? You are talking about a team that was 29th in baseball in blown saves last year.

 

A blown save can occur pretty much anytime a starter leaves the ballgame. Most are not necessarilly even the fault of the "closer."

Ya think? The Reds issue really wasn't closer last year. Weathers was 33/38 in saves.

 

However, this allows the Reds to move Burton to the 7th, Weathers to the 8th, and Cordero to the 9th. It lines up the middle innings nicely. That's the point.

 

it's also possible that a bigger problem for the reds last year was the pitcher's work from innings 1-6.

[USSoccer]

For a mid market team to commit $12m to a guy who's going to appear in maybe 60 games is a bad, bad, bad idea.

 

And for at least 4 years, maybe 5. Paying a reliever that much money is stupid. They are way too volatile a commodity to pay that much for anything less that the cream of the crop in all of the game.

[UK1679666180]

That's not true as Pitt. won't be competing next year and their GM has that in mind as far as long-term roster composition & until Cincy addresses the rotation and middle relief, they'll be lucky to get to .500. Closers on sub .500 teams matter little.

 

Cincy regressed in managers as well.

[reds44]

lol @ Cubs fans talking about bad contracts.

 

Why? Because they Cubs didn't get him?

 

If the Cubs had signed him for that deal, this board would have melted down with the people who hated the deal. Many people on this board don't like committing a decent percentage of the payroll to the bullpen to the first place. They also don't like multi-year deals for relievers. They also don't like signing guys in their 30's to long-term contracts. Finally, many think the position of closer is overrated to begin with. Cordero fits under all of the above, and while he'll likely be pretty productive he's not productive enough to be that big of a percentage of the Reds overall payroll.

What? You are talking about a team that was 29th in baseball in blown saves last year.

 

A blown save can occur pretty much anytime a starter leaves the ballgame. Most are not necessarilly even the fault of the "closer."

 

Ya think? The Reds issue really wasn't closer last year. Weathers was 33/38 in saves.

 

However, this allows the Reds to move Burton to the 7th, Weathers to the 8th, and Cordero to the 9th. It lines up the middle innings nicely. That's the point.

 

it's also possible that a bigger problem for the reds last year was the pitcher's work from innings 1-6.

It was also part of the problem, which again, is why I said we need to trade one of our surplus of outfielders for another starter. However the bullpen was also a big, if not bigger, part of the problem. I would much rather give this money to Cordero then Silva or Loshe.

[CubColtPacer]

lol @ Cubs fans talking about bad contracts.

 

Why? Because they Cubs didn't get him?

 

If the Cubs had signed him for that deal, this board would have melted down with the people who hated the deal. Many people on this board don't like committing a decent percentage of the payroll to the bullpen to the first place. They also don't like multi-year deals for relievers. They also don't like signing guys in their 30's to long-term contracts. Finally, many think the position of closer is overrated to begin with. Cordero fits under all of the above, and while he'll likely be pretty productive he's not productive enough to be that big of a percentage of the Reds overall payroll.

What? You are talking about a team that was 29th in baseball in blown saves last year.

 

A blown save can occur pretty much anytime a starter leaves the ballgame. Most are not necessarilly even the fault of the "closer."

Ya think? The Reds issue really wasn't closer last year. Weathers was 33/38 in saves.

 

However, this allows the Reds to move Burton to the 7th, Weathers to the 8th, and Cordero to the 9th. It lines up the middle innings nicely. That's the point.

 

but you're paying 12 mil a year for it! that's what makes it a bad idea.

Yeah, if we could have signed the cheap stud closer I'm sure we would have.

 

You could have traded one of your OF's though and gotten a cheap elite reliever plus probably another piece or two. Then you could have taken the money that you saved from trading that OF plus the money you had to spend this offseason and spent it on either a starting pitcher or more offense.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

However, this allows the Reds to move Burton to the 7th, Weathers to the 8th, and Cordero to the 9th. It lines up the middle innings nicely. That's the point.

 

but you're paying 12 mil a year for it! that's what makes it a bad idea.

Yeah, if we could have signed the cheap stud closer I'm sure we would have.

 

Except Cordero is hardly 2002-2004 Eric Gagne on the mound. It's all the money with none of the guaranteed production.

[reds44]

lol @ Cubs fans talking about bad contracts.

 

Why? Because they Cubs didn't get him?

 

If the Cubs had signed him for that deal, this board would have melted down with the people who hated the deal. Many people on this board don't like committing a decent percentage of the payroll to the bullpen to the first place. They also don't like multi-year deals for relievers. They also don't like signing guys in their 30's to long-term contracts. Finally, many think the position of closer is overrated to begin with. Cordero fits under all of the above, and while he'll likely be pretty productive he's not productive enough to be that big of a percentage of the Reds overall payroll.

What? You are talking about a team that was 29th in baseball in blown saves last year.

 

A blown save can occur pretty much anytime a starter leaves the ballgame. Most are not necessarilly even the fault of the "closer."

Ya think? The Reds issue really wasn't closer last year. Weathers was 33/38 in saves.

 

However, this allows the Reds to move Burton to the 7th, Weathers to the 8th, and Cordero to the 9th. It lines up the middle innings nicely. That's the point.

 

but you're paying 12 mil a year for it! that's what makes it a bad idea.

Yeah, if we could have signed the cheap stud closer I'm sure we would have.

 

You could have traded one of your OF's though and gotten a cheap elite reliever plus probably another piece or two. Then you could have taken the money that you saved from trading that OF plus the money you had to spend this offseason and spent it on either a starting pitcher or more offense.

The team doesn't need more offense and the starting pitchers are all trash.

 

What starter do you have in mind? Loshe? Silva?

[frostwyrm]

The save is a stupid stat and the closer role is an embarrassment to the sport of baseball. If the Reds want to pay this much money for a relief pitcher who only appears for one inning with empty bases and frequently against an opponent's worst hitters with multirun leads, then that can only help the rest of NL Central.

[UK1679666180]

Baker's usage pattern with relievers might end up playing a role in this when all is said and done.

[Bruno7481]

Will Cordero help the bullpen, sure. He's better than the crap the Reds have had out thre over the last few years. But he probably won't be worth that money in a few years either.

 

Again, this is the first time the Reds have landed a high priced guy like this in a long time. I understand the Reds fan's excitement here. Something is sometimes better than nothing, and nothing is what they have been used to lately.

 

(is my theory correct here reds44? Just the impression I get living in an area populated with many Reds fans).

[Outshined_One]

Baker's usage pattern with relievers might end up playing a role in this when all is said and done.

 

Oooooooooooo...good call. I forgot about that lovable attribute of Baker.

 

Who will take the Will Ohman/Cliff Bartosh role of "did the team bus take off without him again?" role with the Reds?

[nilodnayr]

Reds would have been better off using the money to get 2 or 3 relievers.

[CardsFanInChiTown]

Reds would have been better off using the money to get 2 or 3 relievers.

 

 

Who?

[reds44]

Will Cordero help the bullpen, sure. He's better than the crap the Reds have had out thre over the last few years. But he probably won't be worth that money in a few years either.

 

Again, this is the first time the Reds have landed a high priced guy like this in a long time. I understand the Reds fan's excitement here. Something is sometimes better than nothing, and nothing is what they have been used to lately.

 

(is my theory correct here reds44? Just the impression I get living in an area populated with many Reds fans).

Sounds somewhat correct.

 

The last player we opend up the bank for was, GASP, Eric Milton.

[CubFanPhilly]

Griffey and Freel for Marmol and Marshall would've been a hell of a lot smarter.

[CardsFanInChiTown]

Griffey and Freel for Marmol and Marshall would've been a hell of a lot smarter.

 

 

Jr. has a NTC and are you sure JH would have done that?

[CubFanPhilly]

Griffey and Freel for Marmol and Marshall would've been a hell of a lot smarter.

 

 

Jr. has a NTC and are you sure JH would have done that?

 

I think Jr. would waive it. He has a good relationship with Lou. His time is running out and the Cubs chances of contending are much better than the Reds' in '08.

 

And yes, I doubt Hendry would've done it.