What to do about Cedeño?

[SouthSideRyan]

And followed by an absolute bomb by Fontenot. Mike Fontenot is not gonna hit 400 all year, but there's no reason to take ABs away from him while he is.

I think this is exactly right. Fontenot's play should be the deciding factor.

 

I'm basically with Goony on this. We've seen fast starts from Theriot and others before only to be followed by a pretty long and corrective slump. That may never come for Fontenot, but if it does, and it likely will, if Cedeno is still tearing up AAA, he should be called up.

 

Until such time, Cedeno should remain in AAA. He has only been raking at this level for 67 ABs, so he could use more time to maintain a level of consistency.

 

Cedeno's had 143 ABs in AAA this year. He also had 245 ABs of 921 OPS in '05.

[CubsWin]

And followed by an absolute bomb by Fontenot. Mike Fontenot is not gonna hit 400 all year, but there's no reason to take ABs away from him while he is.

I think this is exactly right. Fontenot's play should be the deciding factor.

 

I'm basically with Goony on this. We've seen fast starts from Theriot and others before only to be followed by a pretty long and corrective slump. That may never come for Fontenot, but if it does, and it likely will, if Cedeno is still tearing up AAA, he should be called up.

 

Until such time, Cedeno should remain in AAA. He has only been raking at this level for 67 ABs, so he could use more time to maintain a level of consistency.

 

Cedeno's had 143 ABs in AAA this year. He also had 245 ABs of 921 OPS in '05.

I don't what I was looking at. Oh, wait, that was the number of ABs Fontenot had going into today's game. You're right, he does have 143 ABs.

 

Nevertheless, I wouldn't mind seeing him maintain this level of production throughout the summer or at least until Fontenot cools off considerably.

[rabidawg900]

Can't we package izturis and jock jones in the same deal?

[apete6]

DFA Izturis

 

Call up Cedeno. Say the Cubs play 6 games/week. In those 6 games, there are a total of 24 games between 2B, SS, 3B, and RF. Here's what you do:

 

Play Fontenot 5 out of 6 games at 2B

 

Play DeRosa 4 out of 6 games at RF, or 3B (1 3B, 3 RF)

 

Play Cedeno 4 out of 6 games at SS

 

Play Ramirez 5 out of 6 games at 3B (other one is DeRosa)

 

Play Floyd 3 out of 6 games in RF

 

Play Theriot 3 out of 6 games at 2B and SS (2 at SS, 1 at 2B)

 

Done and done. Floyd might bitch a little bit, but he'll probably pinch hit in every game. Pagan might lose some playing time here, but if Pie continues to bat .200, he could pick up a few more at bats in CF.

 

You could give DeRosa some 2B time to stay sharp also.

Edited June 28, 2007 by apete6

[cjbucks]

I'd call him up. I like the idea of Cedeno and Fontenot up the middle with DeRosa playing spot duty. I'm just not confident DeRosa can continue putting up starter-worthy #s, I guess.

 

Even if you aren't confident, I think you have to keep giving DeRosa a shot. He's cooled off, but he's still getting on base.

 

Yes he is and I'm never one to abandon a good source of OBP. But I'd like to see if Cedeno can actually play the SS position at the ML level and not be a total 0 with the bat. And Fontenot has played well enough to get a long look at 2B. But I guess I don't really care which of those two (Fontenot and DeRosa) gets the starts - I'm less concerned about finding a decent 2B than SS.

 

The only point I'd make about DeRosa's OBP is he's hitting in front of guys like Pagan, Hill, Bowen, Pie and the pitcher in most of his ABs. I'm not terribly surprised that he's finding it pretty easy to patiently wait for a decent pitch and walk if he doesn't get one. His AVG is still solid at .275 and it's not like he has a huge walk total, but it's not a huge leap of faith to think either Theriot or Fontenot can match that OBP at 2B.

 

And, I guess I'd like some pop at the 5/6 spot where he's been hitting. While his OBP has held pretty firm in the .340-.360 range most of the year, his SLG has been in a slow steady decline since the end of April. It's not like he has no power at all, but his XBH appear to fewer and farther between as the season goes on (he has 4 total in June: 3 doubles, 1 HR). He's a fine player and his overall #s still look pretty good, but I don't think he's a guy we have to have in the lineup. If Fontenot can basically match the .350 OBP and hit in the 2 spot, I'd call up Cedeno just to see if we can get more than a .600 OPS out of the SS position without trading for one.

 

Edit to add: I'm in no way saying Cedeno is that source of pop. If Lee, ARam and Floyd hit 3, 4, 5, maybe DeRosa is the only source of any power and has to hit 6th. Again, I'm not that concerned about who plays 2B this year - I don't see that choice impacting our win total a great deal. But if we can give Cedeno 3 months to see if he can be a decent SS at this level, and the cost is ABs for 2 of Theriot, Fontenot or DeRosa...meh.

 

How do you feel about Paul McCartney as a source of pop??

[RynoRules]

Cedeno's career is tracking a lot like Dubois' did, IMO.

 

I really don't see this comparison at all. They're vastly different players with different abilities who struggled in the big leagues after coming up in different paths (one a college guy with major strikeout problems and no defensive position, the other a raw, much younger MIF who had problems getting on base).

 

And Dubois can only dream of matching Cedeno's K/BB ratio at AAA while keeping his production up.

 

As goony mentioned, I meant only insomuch as he starting to look like AAAA player. Dubois was an enigma b/c he did very well at the AAA level but it did not translate to the bigs. Cedeno may be following a similar path.

[CubsWin]

Well, Ronnie did it again. 2-for-4 with a HR and a BB. That's 20 walks (and just 20 strikeouts) in almost 150 ABs, not to mention his 5th HR and 18th extra base hit. Not bad for a thin, speedy SS.

[A New Era]

Well, Ronnie did it again. 2-for-4 with a HR and a BB. That's 20 walks (and just 20 strikeouts) in almost 150 ABs, not to mention his 5th HR and 18th extra base hit. Not bad for a thin, speedy SS.

 

Maybe he'll equal out to something decent afterall. Still, I'm not in any hurry atleast right now, how Derosa and Fontenot are doing.

[Amazing_Grace]

Well, Ronnie did it again. 2-for-4 with a HR and a BB. That's 20 walks (and just 20 strikeouts) in almost 150 ABs, not to mention his 5th HR and 18th extra base hit. Not bad for a thin, speedy SS.

 

Maybe he'll equal out to something decent afterall. Still, I'm not in any hurry atleast right now, how Derosa and Fontenot are doing.

 

It's good to have some different options, and a manager that will actually use them.

[A New Era]

Well, Ronnie did it again. 2-for-4 with a HR and a BB. That's 20 walks (and just 20 strikeouts) in almost 150 ABs, not to mention his 5th HR and 18th extra base hit. Not bad for a thin, speedy SS.

 

Maybe he'll equal out to something decent afterall. Still, I'm not in any hurry atleast right now, how Derosa and Fontenot are doing.

 

It's good to have some different options, and a manager that will actually use them.

 

Ain't that the truth. Here's a manager who has allowed in and given extensive playing time to the likes of Marmol, Theroit, Marshall, and Fontenot. He had to have requested certain call ups. Including ones to give rookie relievers a try. It makes me feel confident that Ronny will get another chance this year. (yes, over izturis)

[soccer10k]

Give him another shot. Whether that means sending Theriot down or DFA Izturis I don't care (preferably the latter) but Ronny deserves another shot. I know a called for his head earlier in the year when he was sucking but he's earned another chance to play at the ML level.

[Tracer Bullet]

I'd call him up. I like the idea of Cedeno and Fontenot up the middle with DeRosa playing spot duty. I'm just not confident DeRosa can continue putting up starter-worthy #s, I guess.

 

Even if you aren't confident, I think you have to keep giving DeRosa a shot. He's cooled off, but he's still getting on base.

 

...

 

Edit to add: I'm in no way saying Cedeno is that source of pop. If Lee, ARam and Floyd hit 3, 4, 5, maybe DeRosa is the only source of any power and has to hit 6th. Again, I'm not that concerned about who plays 2B this year - I don't see that choice impacting our win total a great deal. But if we can give Cedeno 3 months to see if he can be a decent SS at this level, and the cost is ABs for 2 of Theriot, Fontenot or DeRosa...meh.

 

How do you feel about Paul McCartney as a source of pop??

 

When he was a Beatle, I was a big fan. Now - not so much.

[Tracer Bullet]

Give him another shot. Whether that means sending Theriot down or DFA Izturis I don't care (preferably the latter) but Ronny deserves another shot. I know a called for his head earlier in the year when he was sucking but he's earned another chance to play at the ML level.

 

I agree. Maybe nothing has changed from last year and he's really a AAAA player, but I think he's earned 1 more chance (and I don't mean a handful of sporadic ABs or a "if you suck for 2 weeks, you're out" chance). I mean call him up and given him the starting job basically every day for 1-2 months. If he's terrible, you know what you have (nothing). If he's average, you know that you have a cheap SS that won't kill you. If he's good - that's one less hole we have to fill.

 

I guess part of the reason I'd like to do that now, rather than wait for DeRosa and/or Fontenot to cool down a lot, is if he's up now we can get a month of ABs before the trade deadline. If the Cubs can get on a little hot streak and have a shot at the WC by 7/31, I'd like to know if we should look to add a SS or whether we can live with Ronny. If we wait 2-3 more weeks, we will know no more at the trade deadline about our SS position than we do now (I don't think Fontenot is the answer there - if he can be a 2B, great, but I'd prefer to give the SS role to Ronny from a defensive standpoint).

[bobbyd20]

I like Cedeno mor than Izturis.

 

Jim Hendry would disagree.

[soccer10k]

Give him another shot. Whether that means sending Theriot down or DFA Izturis I don't care (preferably the latter) but Ronny deserves another shot. I know a called for his head earlier in the year when he was sucking but he's earned another chance to play at the ML level.

 

I agree. Maybe nothing has changed from last year and he's really a AAAA player, but I think he's earned 1 more chance (and I don't mean a handful of sporadic ABs or a "if you suck for 2 weeks, you're out" chance). I mean call him up and given him the starting job basically every day for 1-2 months. If he's terrible, you know what you have (nothing). If he's average, you know that you have a cheap SS that won't kill you. If he's good - that's one less hole we have to fill.

 

I guess part of the reason I'd like to do that now, rather than wait for DeRosa and/or Fontenot to cool down a lot, is if he's up now we can get a month of ABs before the trade deadline. If the Cubs can get on a little hot streak and have a shot at the WC by 7/31, I'd like to know if we should look to add a SS or whether we can live with Ronny. If we wait 2-3 more weeks, we will know no more at the trade deadline about our SS position than we do now (I don't think Fontenot is the answer there - if he can be a 2B, great, but I'd prefer to give the SS role to Ronny from a defensive standpoint).

 

I learned my lesson with Rich Hill last year. Obviously they aren't the same player and Ronny got way more time (a full year as compared to a handful of starts) at the ML level but both tore up AAA. Hopefully if Ronny gets called up he can tear up the majors like Hill did.