Props to Lou

[Warren Brusstar]

I know the Matt Murton fan club doesn't agree (irrationally so, I believe), but Lou has done a tremendous job playing the most deserving players, young or old. We've gotten tremendous contributions from Theriot, Pie, Fontenot, Hill, Marshall, Pagan, and Marmol.

 

Dusty never would have given Marmol high-leverage opportunties, preferring instead to trot Bob Novoa out there every other day

 

Dusty never would have given Fontenot an every day job, preferring instead to play Izturis every day (batting him second).

 

And Dusty would have stuck with Wade Miller for at least 80 games.

[seanimal]

what in god's name happened to this thread?

[Soriano12]

what in god's name happened to this thread?

[cubweiser03]

Time warp

[Soriano12]

I was trying to find out how to get into the Matt M. Butt Kissing Club too!

 

:o

[seanimal]

I already made t-shirts. 10 bucks.

[TruffleShuffle]

hooray for arbitrary moderating

[cubfan]

I'm BUMmed, I had a real witty commit that has now disappeared :( Now I just have an ill conceived play on words to add to this thread.

[Outshined_One]

How cheeky of the mods! :o

[Guest]

hooray for arbitrary moderating

What would you do with a thread that starts off that way if you're limited in time? All the mods here have other constraints on their time and sometimes have to make a quick decision on whether to let something go or not. I fully support the decision to remove the previous thread.

 

Please return the discussion the the points made here, not the crude manner in which they were originally made.

[ctcf]

On that note...

 

I'm extremely happy with the time Lou has given the younger players. If this were Dusty's team Izzy and Jones would probably start every day and Pie and Fontenot would be in the minors.

[BigbadB]

On that note...

 

I'm extremely happy with the time Lou has given the younger players. If this were Dusty's team Izzy and Jones would probably start every day and Pie and Fontenot would be in the minors.

 

I'd like to see the trend continue. I'm not sure how they should handle the Hill situation (being he is out of options), but I'd like to see Patterson, Cedeno, Soto and Murton brought up.

 

If they could form a good supporting cast for Ramirez, Lee and Soriano, along with Pie, Fontenot, Theriot and DeRosa, might as well get them playing together sooner rather than later.

 

Send Jones, Eyre, Izturis packing and figure out what to do with Koyie Hill, and it would be a done deal. Of course, that pushes the pitching staff back to 11, but I think that's where they should be anyway.

 

You have to figure the Cubs will need to go cheap with new ownership coming in. That's what a lot of new owners do. If they could get Zambrano signed for what it costed for Barrett, Eyre, Jones and Izturis, they wouldn't necessarily be upping salary that much for 2008.

[CubColtPacer]

On that note...

 

I'm extremely happy with the time Lou has given the younger players. If this were Dusty's team Izzy and Jones would probably start every day and Pie and Fontenot would be in the minors.

 

I'd like to see the trend continue. I'm not sure how they should handle the Hill situation (being he is out of options), but I'd like to see Patterson, Cedeno, Soto and Murton brought up.

 

If they could form a good supporting cast for Ramirez, Lee and Soriano, along with Pie, Fontenot, Theriot and DeRosa, might as well get them playing together sooner rather than later.

 

Send Jones, Eyre, Izturis packing and figure out what to do with Koyie Hill, and it would be a done deal. Of course, that pushes the pitching staff back to 11, but I think that's where they should be anyway.

 

You have to figure the Cubs will need to go cheap with new ownership coming in. That's what a lot of new owners do. If they could get Zambrano signed for what it costed for Barrett, Eyre, Jones and Izturis, they wouldn't necessarily be upping salary that much for 2008.

 

You would have to find another player to get rid of-the Cubs are at 11 pitchers right now, and dropping Eyre, Jones, Izturis and Hill for Patterson, Cedeno, Soto, and Murton would only leave them at 10 pitchers. Also there would be 5 middle infielders on that roster.

[Derwood]

darnit, i come in post-moderation again. I miss all the good stuff

[Warren Brusstar]

On that note...

 

I'm extremely happy with the time Lou has given the younger players. If this were Dusty's team Izzy and Jones would probably start every day and Pie and Fontenot would be in the minors.

 

I'd like to see the trend continue. I'm not sure how they should handle the Hill situation (being he is out of options), but I'd like to see Patterson, Cedeno, Soto and Murton brought up.

 

If they could form a good supporting cast for Ramirez, Lee and Soriano, along with Pie, Fontenot, Theriot and DeRosa, might as well get them playing together sooner rather than later.

 

Send Jones, Eyre, Izturis packing and figure out what to do with Koyie Hill, and it would be a done deal. Of course, that pushes the pitching staff back to 11, but I think that's where they should be anyway.

 

You have to figure the Cubs will need to go cheap with new ownership coming in. That's what a lot of new owners do. If they could get Zambrano signed for what it costed for Barrett, Eyre, Jones and Izturis, they wouldn't necessarily be upping salary that much for 2008.

 

That's the direction that I've wanted them to go for 20 years. 8-10 highly paid core veterans, surrounded by talented young players making the minimum.

 

I really hope the days of signing mediocre veterans are over. There's just no good reason to go out and sign Jock or Floyd or Burnitz or Izturis or DeRosa or Hawkins or Howry or Eyre or Remlinger or Blauser or Bere or Tavarez. It eats payroll and it adds marginal value.

[BigbadB]

You would have to find another player to get rid of-the Cubs are at 11 pitchers right now, and dropping Eyre, Jones, Izturis and Hill for Patterson, Cedeno, Soto, and Murton would only leave them at 10 pitchers. Also there would be 5 middle infielders on that roster.

 

True. But, the point remains.

[Amazing_Grace]

darnit, i come in post-moderation again. I miss all the good stuff

 

It was more a tactless choice of words. Nothing horribly offensive was said, nor were any curse words used. It was, however, cubs.com-esque. The mods did him a favor as otherwise this thread would have ended up two or three pages of responses that basically said "what a lousy insulting way to present your argument" in one form or another. That's what I was going to post when the thread mysteriously vanished. Props to the moderators for keeping this site free of silly name calling.

 

But on the actual point made, I agree. Dusty would never have played Theriot, Fontenot, and would have only very reluctantly played Pie. I don't know what Murton did to piss Lou off, but whatever the reason, I don't think it's because Lou has intense favoritism for veteran players. With Dusty, we'd have had Jones and Izturis every day from opening day. Soriano would probably never have even been tried at CF, and Pagan would probably be starting at least half the games in CF, assuming that is, that Dusty wouldn't have convinced Hendry to acquire Steve Finley or Darin Erstad in the offseason. Hill and Marshall would be throwing 120 pitches when they were pitching well. We would be hearing excuses about how the weather in April, the fans booing Jones, or the injury to Prior being the reason we were losing. Need I go on?

[TruffleShuffle]

darnit, i come in post-moderation again. I miss all the good stuff

 

It was more a tactless choice of words. Nothing horribly offensive was said, nor were any curse words used. It was, however, cubs.com-esque. The mods did him a favor as otherwise this thread would have ended up two or three pages of responses that basically said "what a lousy insulting way to present your argument" in one form or another. That's what I was going to post when the thread mysteriously vanished. Props to the moderators for keeping this site free of silly name calling.

 

But on the actual point made, I agree. Dusty would never have played Theriot, Fontenot, and would have only very reluctantly played Pie. I don't know what Murton did to piss Lou off, but whatever the reason, I don't think it's because Lou has intense favoritism for veteran players. With Dusty, we'd have had Jones and Izturis every day from opening day. Soriano would probably never have even been tried at CF, and Pagan would probably be starting at least half the games in CF, assuming that is, that Dusty wouldn't have convinced Hendry to acquire Steve Finley or Darin Erstad in the offseason. Hill and Marshall would be throwing 120 pitches when they were pitching well. We would be hearing excuses about how the weather in April, the fans booing Jones, or the injury to Prior being the reason we were losing. Need I go on?

 

i'll repeat my point again. Lou has proven that he's not Dusty Baker, and that he can get a $100M payroll team within four games of .500. I remain underwhelmed.

[Soriano12]

darnit, i come in post-moderation again. I miss all the good stuff

 

It was more a tactless choice of words. Nothing horribly offensive was said, nor were any curse words used. It was, however, cubs.com-esque. The mods did him a favor as otherwise this thread would have ended up two or three pages of responses that basically said "what a lousy insulting way to present your argument" in one form or another. That's what I was going to post when the thread mysteriously vanished. Props to the moderators for keeping this site free of silly name calling.

 

But on the actual point made, I agree. Dusty would never have played Theriot, Fontenot, and would have only very reluctantly played Pie. I don't know what Murton did to piss Lou off, but whatever the reason, I don't think it's because Lou has intense favoritism for veteran players. With Dusty, we'd have had Jones and Izturis every day from opening day. Soriano would probably never have even been tried at CF, and Pagan would probably be starting at least half the games in CF, assuming that is, that Dusty wouldn't have convinced Hendry to acquire Steve Finley or Darin Erstad in the offseason. Hill and Marshall would be throwing 120 pitches when they were pitching well. We would be hearing excuses about how the weather in April, the fans booing Jones, or the injury to Prior being the reason we were losing. Need I go on?

 

Who knows if Marshall would have even been the 5th starter...we might have been treated to Wade Miller and his 81MPH fastball every 5 days.

[Amazing_Grace]

darnit, i come in post-moderation again. I miss all the good stuff

 

It was more a tactless choice of words. Nothing horribly offensive was said, nor were any curse words used. It was, however, cubs.com-esque. The mods did him a favor as otherwise this thread would have ended up two or three pages of responses that basically said "what a lousy insulting way to present your argument" in one form or another. That's what I was going to post when the thread mysteriously vanished. Props to the moderators for keeping this site free of silly name calling.

 

But on the actual point made, I agree. Dusty would never have played Theriot, Fontenot, and would have only very reluctantly played Pie. I don't know what Murton did to piss Lou off, but whatever the reason, I don't think it's because Lou has intense favoritism for veteran players. With Dusty, we'd have had Jones and Izturis every day from opening day. Soriano would probably never have even been tried at CF, and Pagan would probably be starting at least half the games in CF, assuming that is, that Dusty wouldn't have convinced Hendry to acquire Steve Finley or Darin Erstad in the offseason. Hill and Marshall would be throwing 120 pitches when they were pitching well. We would be hearing excuses about how the weather in April, the fans booing Jones, or the injury to Prior being the reason we were losing. Need I go on?

 

i'll repeat my point again. Lou has proven that he's not Dusty Baker, and that he can get a $100M payroll team within four games of .500. I remain underwhelmed.

 

Three months worth W-L record is not really a terribly great way to judge a manager, in my opinion. Also, his $100M dollar team includes... Izturis making 4M, Jones making 5M, Eyre making 3.5M, Howry making 4M, Prior making 3.5M, Wood making 2M, Blanco making 2M, Wade Miller making 2M, and Dempster making 5M. That's 31M on guys that are worthless because they stink and could be replaced by almost anybody (Izturis/Eyre/Jones/Howry/Blanco), are perpetually injured and not playing (Prior/Wood/Miller), or overpaid and easily replaced (Dempster).

 

Now, a manager with this record and a 68M payroll doesn't sound as bad. If you leave Dempster off, since he's both healthy and pitching decently, it's still only a 73M payroll team. Hendry and Dusty made this mess. Lou is trying to fix it, but three months isn't going to be long enough.

[TruffleShuffle]

darnit, i come in post-moderation again. I miss all the good stuff

 

It was more a tactless choice of words. Nothing horribly offensive was said, nor were any curse words used. It was, however, cubs.com-esque. The mods did him a favor as otherwise this thread would have ended up two or three pages of responses that basically said "what a lousy insulting way to present your argument" in one form or another. That's what I was going to post when the thread mysteriously vanished. Props to the moderators for keeping this site free of silly name calling.

 

But on the actual point made, I agree. Dusty would never have played Theriot, Fontenot, and would have only very reluctantly played Pie. I don't know what Murton did to piss Lou off, but whatever the reason, I don't think it's because Lou has intense favoritism for veteran players. With Dusty, we'd have had Jones and Izturis every day from opening day. Soriano would probably never have even been tried at CF, and Pagan would probably be starting at least half the games in CF, assuming that is, that Dusty wouldn't have convinced Hendry to acquire Steve Finley or Darin Erstad in the offseason. Hill and Marshall would be throwing 120 pitches when they were pitching well. We would be hearing excuses about how the weather in April, the fans booing Jones, or the injury to Prior being the reason we were losing. Need I go on?

 

i'll repeat my point again. Lou has proven that he's not Dusty Baker, and that he can get a $100M payroll team within four games of .500. I remain underwhelmed.

 

Three months worth W-L record is not really a terribly great way to judge a manager, in my opinion. Also, his $100M dollar team includes... Izturis making 4M, Jones making 5M, Eyre making 3.5M, Howry making 4M, Prior making 3.5M, Wood making 2M, Blanco making 2M, Wade Miller making 2M, and Dempster making 5M. That's 31M on guys that are worthless because they stink and could be replaced by almost anybody (Izturis/Eyre/Jones/Howry/Blanco), are perpetually injured and not playing (Prior/Wood/Miller), or overpaid and easily replaced (Dempster).

 

Now, a manager with this record and a 68M payroll doesn't sound as bad. If you leave Dempster off, since he's both healthy and pitching decently, it's still only a 73M payroll team. Hendry and Dusty made this mess. Lou is trying to fix it, but three months isn't going to be long enough.

 

every team has guys who are salary wastes due to lack of production or injuries. This team should be better than they have been. Lou's ADD method of running the team (constantly switching lineups, inane relief substitutions) isn't working out great, IMO.

[seanimal]

i'll repeat my point again. Lou has proven that he's not Dusty Baker, and that he can get a $100M payroll team within four games of .500. I remain underwhelmed.

 

I believe your original statement ended with 'lets bust out the champagne' or whatever, to which I was going to respond with something like...

 

"4 games within .500?

 

:confetti:"

 

But then I was told I needed some sort of high-level clearance to access the thread.

[SouthSideRyan]

I disagree with the notion that Dempster is either overpaid or easily replacable. He was a great closer in '05, and has been very good this year. People seem all too eager to declare his '06 his true talent level because it's funny to call him Dumpster.

[cubweiser03]

Another benefit of having guys in your system fill utility or even starting roles is payroll/roster flexibility. You control these guys for 6 years (3 non arby, 3 arby) without having to lock into 2-3 year deals. If the player hits the wall, you just send him down or DFA him depending on his service time and you dont have to eat guaranteed remaining years. Rusch, Jones, Eyre, Neifi, etc.

[SouthSideRyan]

I disagree with the notion that Dempster is either overpaid or easily replacable. He was a great closer in '05, and has been very good this year. People seem all too eager to declare his '06 his true talent level because it's funny to call him Dumpster.