Verlander

[B]

throws a no-no

[Drew Doughty]

he looked incredible in the last two innings that i watched. reminded me of Kerry Wood, actually.

[SouthSideRyan]

For those who weren't watching it, Neifi made a great play ranging up the middle to first rob a hit and then start a DP.

 

If Dusty's on BT tonight, I'm guessing this might be harped on.

[Mephistopheles]

Escobar K'd 14 in 6 innings. Verlander K'd 12 in 9 innings. Escobar walked one. Verlander walked 4.

 

 

Regardless of results, 90% of the time we're talking about Escobar's start, not Verlander.

 

 

in other words.....lots of luck.

[chuckywang]

Escobar K'd 14 in 6 innings. Verlander K'd 12 in 9 innings. Escobar walked one. Verlander walked 4.

 

 

Regardless of results, 90% of the time we're talking about Escobar's start, not Verlander.

 

 

in other words.....lots of luck.

 

Wow, that's ridiculous.

[SouthSideRyan]

Escobar K'd 14 in 6 innings. Verlander K'd 12 in 9 innings. Escobar walked one. Verlander walked 4.

 

 

Regardless of results, 90% of the time we're talking about Escobar's start, not Verlander.

 

 

in other words.....lots of luck.

 

Depends what kind of doubles those were that Escobar gave up.

[Mephistopheles]

Escobar K'd 14 in 6 innings. Verlander K'd 12 in 9 innings. Escobar walked one. Verlander walked 4.

 

 

Regardless of results, 90% of the time we're talking about Escobar's start, not Verlander.

 

 

in other words.....lots of luck.

 

Wow, that's ridiculous.

Not really. You're telling me that since there were 15 balls hit into play for Verlander and all of them were recorded as outs aren't lucky? There were 9 balls hit into play for Escobar and only four of them were recorded as outs.

 

You tell me which player is more likely to have success.

[XZero771679666304]

Escobar K'd 14 in 6 innings. Verlander K'd 12 in 9 innings. Escobar walked one. Verlander walked 4.

 

 

Regardless of results, 90% of the time we're talking about Escobar's start, not Verlander.

 

 

in other words.....lots of luck.

 

Yeah, except for the 5 hits and three runs.

 

That's pretty ridiculous.

[Mephistopheles]

Escobar K'd 14 in 6 innings. Verlander K'd 12 in 9 innings. Escobar walked one. Verlander walked 4.

 

 

Regardless of results, 90% of the time we're talking about Escobar's start, not Verlander.

 

 

in other words.....lots of luck.

 

Depends what kind of doubles those were that Escobar gave up.

It doesn't matter. Even deep fly balls (the kind that wind up as doubles) end up as outs more often than groundballs.

[XZero771679666304]

Escobar K'd 14 in 6 innings. Verlander K'd 12 in 9 innings. Escobar walked one. Verlander walked 4.

 

 

Regardless of results, 90% of the time we're talking about Escobar's start, not Verlander.

 

 

in other words.....lots of luck.

 

Wow, that's ridiculous.

Not really. You're telling me that since there were 15 balls hit into play for Verlander and all of them were recorded as outs aren't lucky? There were 9 balls hit into play for Escobar and only four of them were recorded as outs.

 

You tell me which player is more likely to have success.

 

Yes, and how hard and where the balls were hit don't matter. You're right.

[Mephistopheles]

Escobar K'd 14 in 6 innings. Verlander K'd 12 in 9 innings. Escobar walked one. Verlander walked 4.

 

 

Regardless of results, 90% of the time we're talking about Escobar's start, not Verlander.

 

 

in other words.....lots of luck.

 

Yeah, except for the 5 hits and three runs.

 

That's pretty ridiculous.

Except for the extreme good luck of Verlander and the extreme bad luck of Escobar. The simple fact is that Escobar was more dominant and was more likely to outpitch Verlander.

[Mephistopheles]

Escobar K'd 14 in 6 innings. Verlander K'd 12 in 9 innings. Escobar walked one. Verlander walked 4.

 

 

Regardless of results, 90% of the time we're talking about Escobar's start, not Verlander.

 

 

in other words.....lots of luck.

 

Wow, that's ridiculous.

Not really. You're telling me that since there were 15 balls hit into play for Verlander and all of them were recorded as outs aren't lucky? There were 9 balls hit into play for Escobar and only four of them were recorded as outs.

 

You tell me which player is more likely to have success.

 

Yes, and how hard and where the balls were hit don't matter. You're right.

 

A pitcher has NO CONTROL on the directional vector of a batted ball. To argue otherwise is to be stupid. How hard? Probably, BUT most hits aren't the hardest contact off of bats. Most hits are looping liners or groundballs through the infield -- hardly hot shots.

[UK1679666180]

For novelty purposes, I've always been curious as to what kind of velo Verlander could get if he pitched out of the pen. If he's pacing himself and hitting 96-99 as a starter, imagine him letting it go for an inning while fresh.

 

I seriously think he could sit at just under 100 and top at 103 consistently.

[Mephistopheles]

I don't think he'd last long. The torque on his elbow is already at dangerous levels.

[UK1679666180]

I don't think he'd last long. The torque on his elbow is already at dangerous levels.

 

Agreed, any more effort would likely pop it espec. on the breaker but it would fun to see how hard he throws at max effort.

[XZero771679666304]

Escobar K'd 14 in 6 innings. Verlander K'd 12 in 9 innings. Escobar walked one. Verlander walked 4.

 

 

Regardless of results, 90% of the time we're talking about Escobar's start, not Verlander.

 

 

in other words.....lots of luck.

 

Wow, that's ridiculous.

Not really. You're telling me that since there were 15 balls hit into play for Verlander and all of them were recorded as outs aren't lucky? There were 9 balls hit into play for Escobar and only four of them were recorded as outs.

 

You tell me which player is more likely to have success.

 

Yes, and how hard and where the balls were hit don't matter. You're right.

 

A pitcher has NO CONTROL on the directional vector of a batted ball. To argue otherwise is to be stupid. How hard? Probably, BUT most hits aren't the hardest contact off of bats. Most hits are looping liners or groundballs through the infield -- hardly hot shots.

 

So a pitcher can't induce balls to be batted to the opposite field by pitching on the outer half, or vice versa? Or induce more ground outs by throwing stuff that breaks down and in, or fly balls by throwing stuff in, up and on the hands, or rising heat?

[Mephistopheles]

Since he's so lanky I've always thought that his effort less gas is driven by his whip-like arm action. I think he airs it out every pitch. I think if he tried to throw harder he'd lose some of the whip. I think his motion is one of those max eff guys that don't look like it.

[Mephistopheles]

Escobar K'd 14 in 6 innings. Verlander K'd 12 in 9 innings. Escobar walked one. Verlander walked 4.

 

 

Regardless of results, 90% of the time we're talking about Escobar's start, not Verlander.

 

 

in other words.....lots of luck.

 

Wow, that's ridiculous.

Not really. You're telling me that since there were 15 balls hit into play for Verlander and all of them were recorded as outs aren't lucky? There were 9 balls hit into play for Escobar and only four of them were recorded as outs.

 

You tell me which player is more likely to have success.

 

Yes, and how hard and where the balls were hit don't matter. You're right.

 

A pitcher has NO CONTROL on the directional vector of a batted ball. To argue otherwise is to be stupid. How hard? Probably, BUT most hits aren't the hardest contact off of bats. Most hits are looping liners or groundballs through the infield -- hardly hot shots.

 

So a pitcher can't induce balls to be batted to the opposite field by pitching on the outer half, or vice versa? Or induce more ground outs by throwing stuff that breaks down and in, or fly balls by throwing stuff in, up and on the hands, or rising heat?

 

I didn't say a pitcher couldn't change the trajectory of a ball up or down. Groundballs actually wind up as hits much more often than flyballs, like three times as much, and today 11 of the 15 balls in play were of the groundball variety.

 

Sure a pitcher can induce a ball to a certain side of the field, but he doesn't have control on whether it goes right to the shortstop or two feet beyond his range. ALL of that is pure luck.

[NewUserName]

My Dad is probably very happy!!!!!

 

A Tiger throws a no-hitter

 

His favorite player gets his 13 triple

 

His son is upsetting Derwood in popularity contest.

 

I may be miserable but my dad is probably exstatic.

[XZero771679666304]

Escobar K'd 14 in 6 innings. Verlander K'd 12 in 9 innings. Escobar walked one. Verlander walked 4.

 

 

Regardless of results, 90% of the time we're talking about Escobar's start, not Verlander.

 

 

in other words.....lots of luck.

 

Wow, that's ridiculous.

Not really. You're telling me that since there were 15 balls hit into play for Verlander and all of them were recorded as outs aren't lucky? There were 9 balls hit into play for Escobar and only four of them were recorded as outs.

 

You tell me which player is more likely to have success.

 

Yes, and how hard and where the balls were hit don't matter. You're right.

 

A pitcher has NO CONTROL on the directional vector of a batted ball. To argue otherwise is to be stupid. How hard? Probably, BUT most hits aren't the hardest contact off of bats. Most hits are looping liners or groundballs through the infield -- hardly hot shots.

 

So a pitcher can't induce balls to be batted to the opposite field by pitching on the outer half, or vice versa? Or induce more ground outs by throwing stuff that breaks down and in, or fly balls by throwing stuff in, up and on the hands, or rising heat?

 

I didn't say a pitcher couldn't change the trajectory of a ball up or down. Groundballs actually wind up as hits much more often than flyballs, like three times as much, and today 11 of the 15 balls in play were of the groundball variety.

 

Sure a pitcher can induce a ball to a certain side of the field, but he doesn't have control on whether it goes right to the shortstop or two feet beyond his range. ALL of that is pure luck.

 

Well, if you can induce a weakly hit ball in the direction you want (say in the direction of Perez and Polanco), then you have given yourself a good chance of getting an out. A combination of factors largely controlled by the pitcher.

 

Sure, there is a huge element of luck in involved, but to say it is all luck just doesn't jive. If Verlander doesn't have his best stuff, maybe the grounders aren't hit as hard, or he misses over the heart of the plate and a grounder goes up the middle instead of at the SS. Or if he misses up or down, grounders or fly balls turn into line drives. Or if he isn't on his game, the balls are hit harder, etc.

 

The fact that Escobar gave up 5 hits and 3 runs while Verlander gave up nothing is not a function of pure luck. Some luck, but not nearly all.

[daske17]

Dusty Baker is crediting Neifi Perez with saving the no-hitter with starting a double play on Baseball Tonight.

 

Seriously, does Neifi have pictures of Dusty or something?

[NewUserName]

Dusty Baker is crediting Neifi Perez with saving the no-hitter with starting a double play on Baseball Tonight.

 

Seriously, does Neifi have pictures of Dusty or something?

 

Would Guillen have made the play. He isnt the best SS around.

[XZero771679666304]

Dusty Baker is crediting Neifi Perez with saving the no-hitter with starting a double play on Baseball Tonight.

 

Seriously, does Neifi have pictures of Dusty or something?

 

Would Guillen have made the play. He isnt the best SS around.

 

No, Guillen doesn't get to that ball, IMO.

[chuckywang]

Escobar K'd 14 in 6 innings. Verlander K'd 12 in 9 innings. Escobar walked one. Verlander walked 4.

 

 

Regardless of results, 90% of the time we're talking about Escobar's start, not Verlander.

 

 

in other words.....lots of luck.

 

Wow, that's ridiculous.

Not really. You're telling me that since there were 15 balls hit into play for Verlander and all of them were recorded as outs aren't lucky? There were 9 balls hit into play for Escobar and only four of them were recorded as outs.

 

You tell me which player is more likely to have success.

 

I was saying that 14/18 outs were K's is ridiculous.

[BleedCubbieBlue81]

Greg Maddux made a hall of fame career out of getting guys to hit the ball mostly where he wanted them to...

 

Luck or not, a no hitter is a no hitter. With any no hitter, you're going to get help from your defense. But I have to give credit where credit is due.