Who bats second?

[CuseCubFan69]

Just give this time and we'll see what happens. I always do what Lou is doing and having people write down my every sentence to be diagnosed is really tough to do at this stage of the game. Personally, I'm glad Lou has an open mind and is willing to look at options. I wouldn't write Murton off yet but I have to admit having Floyd around makes me a tad bit nervous. But, as long as the best 8 guys are out there I won't have a problem with who plays. Edited February 19, 2007 by CuseCubFan69

[RichHillIsABeast]

We're not going to have any clue about the lineup until we figure out if Soriano can play CF or not.

 

I hope Soriano can play CF, otherwise the Orange Dude is going to see a serious cut in playing time.

[Derwood]

do we really need two threads about this?

[moorecg]

Jones in the 2 hole is not awful. He'd surely see a TON of pitches in between Soriano and Lee...LaRussa puts that kind of guy in the 2 hole down here quite a bit and it seems to work out...I'd say Chris Duncan saw the majority of his at bats there and he did very well until the pitchers figured him out in August/Sept.

[CuseCubFan69]

Jones in the 2 hole is not awful. He'd surely see a TON of pitches in between Soriano and Lee...LaRussa puts that kind of guy in the 2 hole down here quite a bit and it seems to work out...I'd say Chris Duncan saw the majority of his at bats there and he did very well until the pitchers figured him out in August/Sept.

 

I think, at least by the way Lou put it, that if Jones bats second it would only be against rightys and DeRosa might be the guy that bats there against leftys.

[98navigator]

I started a thread about this

 

viewtopic.php?t=38510

[Derwood]

I started a thread about this

 

viewtopic.php?t=38510

 

behold the power of MERGE

[Wheelimus]

I'd say Jacque against righties, DeRosa against lefties. It's a bold move, but I think Jacque can do alrigtht there OBP wise solely against righties. Especially if he has Soriano on base and Lee on deck a lot of the time.

 

Assuming Soriano is near his 2006 numbers, I think Jacque could shock us with his production in the 2 hole.

 

My lineup on those days would be

 

Soriano

Jones

Lee

Ramirez

Barrett

Murton

DeRosa

Izturis

Pitcher

 

Although, especiall when Zambrano, Marquis, or Prior are pitching, I'd consider moving Cesar to 9th. The luxary of always having Soriano on deck might prop his numbers up a bit.

[Jon]

Jones had a .358 OBP against righties last year. That certainly isn't bad (although .339 over the past 3 years), but the .528 slugging % does not belong in the two hole.

 

Then again, it's certainly has to be a possibility. Just look who they have leading off.

[RichHillIsABeast]

Jones had a .358 OBP against righties last year. That certainly isn't bad (although .339 over the past 3 years), but the .528 slugging % does not belong in the two hole.

Then again, it's certainly has to be a possibility. Just look who they have leading off.

 

Why not? Because the stereotype is against it?

[Wheelimus]

I think we may be surprised by the Soriano->Jacque->DLee combo. Nice Righty, Lefty, Righty mixup. Jacque will see a lot of dejected pitchers that just let Soriano beat them. Great protection behind him guarantee's good pitches.

 

I want to see how it looks in the spring.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Jones had a .358 OBP against righties last year. That certainly isn't bad (although .339 over the past 3 years), but the .528 slugging % does not belong in the two hole.

Then again, it's certainly has to be a possibility. Just look who they have leading off.

 

Why not? Because the stereotype is against it?

 

No, because it's inefficient. DeRosa and/or Murton will still be in the lineup to put up a similar OBP with less power, making them more appropriate for the 2 spot against RHP.

[RichHillIsABeast]

Jones had a .358 OBP against righties last year. That certainly isn't bad (although .339 over the past 3 years), but the .528 slugging % does not belong in the two hole.

Then again, it's certainly has to be a possibility. Just look who they have leading off.

 

Why not? Because the stereotype is against it?

 

No, because it's inefficient. DeRosa and/or Murton will still be in the lineup to put up a similar OBP with less power, making them more appropriate for the 2 spot against RHP.

 

It's not about OBP. It's about putting your best hitters in the right spots.

 

The idea that you should just stick high OBP/low SLG guys in the first two spots is ridiculous.

 

Your best hitters should be in the 1, 2, and 4 spots. Is Jones a top 3 hitter on this team? Nope, but he's a great deal better than DeRosa/Izturis.

 

Murton, DeRosa, and Izturis probably belong 6-7-8 in our lineup as they're the 6th, 7th, and 8th ranked hitters on our team.

[Bruce Miles]

I did ask about Murton, but Lou didn't really answer it. This is all going to take time to develop, and what Lou said yesterday may have little resemblence of what things look like on March 15 or April 2. I guess that's what spring training is for.

[RichHillIsABeast]

I did ask about Murton, but Lou didn't really answer it. This is all going to take time to develop, and what Lou said yesterday may have little resemblence of what things look like on March 15 or April 2. I guess that's what spring training is for.

 

Thanks for the piece on Hill. It answered a lot of the questions I had about the situation. :)

[CuseCubFan69]

I did ask about Murton, but Lou didn't really answer it. This is all going to take time to develop, and what Lou said yesterday may have little resemblence of what things look like on March 15 or April 2. I guess that's what spring training is for.

 

Do you think that Floyd is a part of reason why he didn't answer?

[Bruce Miles]

I did ask about Murton, but Lou didn't really answer it. This is all going to take time to develop, and what Lou said yesterday may have little resemblence of what things look like on March 15 or April 2. I guess that's what spring training is for.

 

Do you think that Floyd is a part of reason why he didn't answer?

 

No, you have to understand that Lou was surrounded by reporters and that these questions sometimes come rapid fire. At this point, nobody knows how this is going to shake out yet. Floyd's health will figure into things as well as where Soriano ends up. All Lou is doing is considering all his options, as he should be doing.

[CuseCubFan69]

I did ask about Murton, but Lou didn't really answer it. This is all going to take time to develop, and what Lou said yesterday may have little resemblence of what things look like on March 15 or April 2. I guess that's what spring training is for.

 

Do you think that Floyd is a part of reason why he didn't answer?

 

No, you have to understand that Lou was surrounded by reporters and that these questions sometimes come rapid fire. At this point, nobody knows how this is going to shake out yet. Floyd's health will figure into things as well as where Soriano ends up. All Lou is doing is considering all his options, as he should be doing.

 

I agree and that's wonderful to hear. I like Lou being able to have an open mind when Spring starts.

 

Do you ever get to spend some time with Lou alone?

[Bruce Miles]

I did ask about Murton, but Lou didn't really answer it. This is all going to take time to develop, and what Lou said yesterday may have little resemblence of what things look like on March 15 or April 2. I guess that's what spring training is for.

 

Do you think that Floyd is a part of reason why he didn't answer?

 

No, you have to understand that Lou was surrounded by reporters and that these questions sometimes come rapid fire. At this point, nobody knows how this is going to shake out yet. Floyd's health will figure into things as well as where Soriano ends up. All Lou is doing is considering all his options, as he should be doing.

 

I agree and that's wonderful to hear. I like Lou being able to have an open mind when Spring starts.

 

Do you ever get to spend some time with Lou alone?

 

Yeah, Lou is pretty cool. I look forward to spending more time with him as he gets settled.

[CuseCubFan69]

Bruce...you were there when Dusty first got hired. What things do you see that are different in Lou's first couple of days than Dusty's?

[Lefty]

I think we may be surprised by the Soriano->Jacque->DLee combo. Nice Righty, Lefty, Righty mixup. Jacque will see a lot of dejected pitchers that just let Soriano beat them. Great protection behind him guarantee's good pitches.

 

I want to see how it looks in the spring.

 

Every study, including one in the WSJ last week, show that lineup protection is a myth.

 

Our challenge at #2 is interesting. With Soriano's power, his percentage of time on first base is very low. Jones and Murton are extreme groundball hitters which is normally a problem with DPs at #2. But Jones' strikeouts would make DPs even less likely. So as long as he doesn't face LHPs, Jones at #2 sounds OK. And sandwiched between Soriano and Lee might protect him from LHPs later in a game.

[CuseCubFan69]

I think we may be surprised by the Soriano->Jacque->DLee combo. Nice Righty, Lefty, Righty mixup. Jacque will see a lot of dejected pitchers that just let Soriano beat them. Great protection behind him guarantee's good pitches.

 

I want to see how it looks in the spring.

 

Every study, including one in the WSJ last week, show that lineup protection is a myth.

 

Our challenge at #2 is interesting. With Soriano's power, his percentage of time on first base is very low. Jones and Murton are extreme groundball hitters which is normally a problem with DPs at #2. But Jones' strikeouts would make DPs even less likely. So as long as he doesn't face LHPs, Jones at #2 sounds OK. And sandwiched between Soriano and Lee might protect him from LHPs later in a game.

 

Do you realize you just wrote that lineup protection was a myth and then said Soriano and Lee might protect Jones from LHP's? :D

[Bruce Miles]

Bruce...you were there when Dusty first got hired. What things do you see that are different in Lou's first couple of days than Dusty's?

 

This coaching staff here works and works and works.

[Pushfrog98]

I know this will probably get me banned from this site, but what happens if spring training rolls around, and Matt Murton doesn't play as well as cliff floyd? What happens then? do we still play murton because he has "tremendous upside potential?" or do we play the man who plays better NOW?

 

I like murton and I hope he plays well and gets the appropriate playing time, but I'm at the point where I don't care WHO plays, just as long as the cubs WIN!

[rocket]

I know this will probably get me banned from this site, but what happens if spring training rolls around, and Matt Murton doesn't play as well as cliff floyd? What happens then? do we still play murton because he has "tremendous upside potential?" or do we play the man who plays better NOW?

 

I like murton and I hope he plays well and gets the appropriate playing time, but I'm at the point where I don't care WHO plays, just as long as the cubs WIN!

 

I'm very much against using limited spring training at-bats as a deciding factor in who gets the starting job.