2007...

UMFan83 · August 30, 2006

For those of you predicting that we got a top line FA, please name the last one that we got.

When have we had an upper echelon payroll and high fan expectations/demands?

Well we've been owned by a multibillion dollar corporation and had at least 90% stadium capacity for the year since the early 1990's. Oh also, we play in the third largest market in the United States.

No reason why we didn't have a upper echelon payroll in the past.

But then again, looking at this 95 million dollar disaster, do we really need to be throwing money around?

baseball7897 · August 30, 2006

Howry has been fine. Of course there's not much telling if it'll stay that way(like any other reliever), but he hasn't been bad.

As for the topic of the thread, the easiest thing to do is play Pie, keep Murton, trade Cedeno/Theriot, get Jones a platoon partner and get a 2B to hit at the top of the order. It's not great by any means, but it's feasible

2B/Murton
Murton/2B
Lee
Ramirez
Jones/Barrett
Barrett/Platoon
Pie
Izturis

Add a good starter, Schmidt is my favorite.

Z
Acquisition
Marshall/Marmol/Hill/Guzman
Marshall/Marmol/Hill/Guzman
Prior

Keep the pen, although if you can trade Eyre or especially Howry for something worthwhile, do it. Wuertz closes.

If that is the 07 Cubs, then we have NO chance in hell. Im going to vomit if I look at that again.
I have to disagree. I think TT's team is certainly capable of making a run in a weak NL. It's a significant upgrade offensively IF Jones is put into a proper platoon and they add a decent hitting 2B to the top of the order. Loretta?

Offensively, that team sucks. Pitching wins games people. Just by looking at that rotation, I know for a fact they will not compete.

soapy · August 30, 2006

Howry has been fine. Of course there's not much telling if it'll stay that way(like any other reliever), but he hasn't been bad.

As for the topic of the thread, the easiest thing to do is play Pie, keep Murton, trade Cedeno/Theriot, get Jones a platoon partner and get a 2B to hit at the top of the order. It's not great by any means, but it's feasible

2B/Murton
Murton/2B
Lee
Ramirez
Jones/Barrett
Barrett/Platoon
Pie
Izturis

Add a good starter, Schmidt is my favorite.

Z
Acquisition
Marshall/Marmol/Hill/Guzman
Marshall/Marmol/Hill/Guzman
Prior

Keep the pen, although if you can trade Eyre or especially Howry for something worthwhile, do it. Wuertz closes.

If that is the 07 Cubs, then we have NO chance in hell. Im going to vomit if I look at that again.
I have to disagree. I think TT's team is certainly capable of making a run in a weak NL. It's a significant upgrade offensively IF Jones is put into a proper platoon and they add a decent hitting 2B to the top of the order. Loretta?

Offensively, that team sucks. Pitching wins games people. Just by looking at that rotation, I know for a fact they will not compete.

hahahahaha...You know for a FACT?!?!?! Awesome. Thanks.

baseball7897 · August 30, 2006

Howry has been fine. Of course there's not much telling if it'll stay that way(like any other reliever), but he hasn't been bad.

As for the topic of the thread, the easiest thing to do is play Pie, keep Murton, trade Cedeno/Theriot, get Jones a platoon partner and get a 2B to hit at the top of the order. It's not great by any means, but it's feasible

2B/Murton
Murton/2B
Lee
Ramirez
Jones/Barrett
Barrett/Platoon
Pie
Izturis

Add a good starter, Schmidt is my favorite.

Z
Acquisition
Marshall/Marmol/Hill/Guzman
Marshall/Marmol/Hill/Guzman
Prior

Keep the pen, although if you can trade Eyre or especially Howry for something worthwhile, do it. Wuertz closes.

If that is the 07 Cubs, then we have NO chance in hell. Im going to vomit if I look at that again.
I have to disagree. I think TT's team is certainly capable of making a run in a weak NL. It's a significant upgrade offensively IF Jones is put into a proper platoon and they add a decent hitting 2B to the top of the order. Loretta?

Offensively, that team sucks. Pitching wins games people. Just by looking at that rotation, I know for a fact they will not compete.

hahahahaha...You know for a FACT?!?!?! Awesome. Thanks.

Have you ever watch a game of baseball? Counting on a Cf with No major league experience is crazy. Adding a 2b will not improve this team. Counting on Prior is also just crazy. Adding a 34 yr old SP in Schmidt will be a dumb idea. Trading either Howry or Eyre, just dosent make sense. The bullpen looks to be a strength next year. Why turn a strength into a weakness?????????????????????

RichHillIsABeast · August 30, 2006

For those of you predicting that we got a top line FA, please name the last one that we got.

When have we had an upper echelon payroll and high fan expectations/demands?

Well we've been owned by a multibillion dollar corporation and had at least 90% stadium capacity for the year since the early 1990's. Oh also, we play in the third largest market in the United States.

No reason why we didn't have a upper echelon payroll in the past.

But then again, looking at this 95 million dollar disaster, do we really need to be throwing money around?

Truly. This team is fatally flawed. It's pretty pathetic. We have Lee, Aramis (maybe), Barrett, and Z. Izturis would be ok if he wasn't injured every two days. 4-5 solid players don't make a playoff team, unless they're all in your starting rotation.

Hendry was all over needing more pitching this last offseason and look how that turned out. I never wanted a guy like Burnett, just as I don't want Schmidt. You can't count on them to show up healthy and effective. There aren't any good pitching options besides Zito.

But, if the Blue Jays showed anything last season, it's that more money gets the free agents irregardless of past organizational performance. If Hendry gets those purse strings open...and his butt is on the line...we could get a top FA.

CaliforniaRaisin · August 30, 2006

Have you ever watch a game of baseball?

I'm sure soapy has watched a game. Why would soapy be posting here otherwise?

Counting on a Cf with No major league experience is crazy.

You're right, no contender has ever played a rookie. Heck, the WS runner-up last season played a rookie CF.

Adding a 2b will not improve this team.

So adding a better second baseman will make the team worse?

Counting on Prior is also just crazy.

He counted him as a 5th starter. If that doesn't suit you, notice how he listed 4 potential starters for 2 spots? You could plug in one of the other two.

Adding a 34 yr old SP in Schmidt will be a dumb idea.

Schmidt is likely to get a smaller deal than someone like Zito because of his age. Schmidt also doesn't give up as many flyballs as Zito - more of which will likely be HRs when half of his games are played at Wrigley as opposed to Oakland. There certainly is a risk in signing Schmidt.

Trading either Howry or Eyre, just dosent make sense. The bullpen looks to be a strength next year. Why turn a strength into a weakness?????????????????????

The Cubs work on a limited budget and obviously cannot fill all their many holes with just FA signings. Sometimes one must trade from a strength to improve a weakness. Trading away one reliever shouldn't really make a strength into a weakness - and if it does - then the bullpen is not ready for injuries.

David · August 30, 2006

Have you ever watch a game of baseball? Counting on a Cf with No major league experience is crazy. Adding a 2b will not improve this team. Counting on Prior is also just crazy. Adding a 34 yr old SP in Schmidt will be a dumb idea. Trading either Howry or Eyre, just dosent make sense. The bullpen looks to be a strength next year. Why turn a strength into a weakness?????????????????????

Your post is so misguided it's not even funny.

You'd probably rather have Pierre in CF and leading off than Pie (who could EASILY outperform Pierre) down in the order and a legitimate on base threat at 2B and leading off.

Schmidt? A dumb idea? Not sure what to say.

Counting on Prior as a 5th starter isn't crazy. Counting on Prior as a top 2 or 3? Crazy.

I would rather pick up one more solid starter than depend on two of our rookie carousel from this year, but if there's nothing out there, there's nothing out there.

baseball7897 · August 30, 2006

Have you ever watch a game of baseball?

I'm sure soapy has watched a game. Why would soapy be posting here otherwise?

Counting on a Cf with No major league experience is crazy.

You're right, no contender has ever played a rookie. Heck, the WS runner-up last season played a rookie CF.

Adding a 2b will not improve this team.

So adding a better second baseman will make the team worse?

Counting on Prior is also just crazy.

He counted him as a 5th starter. If that doesn't suit you, notice how he listed 4 potential starters for 2 spots? You could plug in one of the other two.

Adding a 34 yr old SP in Schmidt will be a dumb idea.

Schmidt is likely to get a smaller deal than someone like Zito because of his age. Schmidt also doesn't give up as many flyballs as Zito - more of which will likely be HRs when half of his games are played at Wrigley as opposed to Oakland. There certainly is a risk in signing Schmidt.

Trading either Howry or Eyre, just dosent make sense. The bullpen looks to be a strength next year. Why turn a strength into a weakness?????????????????????

The Cubs work on a limited budget and obviously cannot fill all their many holes with just FA signings. Sometimes one must trade from a strength to improve a weakness. Trading away one reliever shouldn't really make a strength into a weakness - and if it does - then the bullpen is not ready for injuries.

People do make spelling mistakes. I should of looked over it before I posted it.

Who is the 2B man? Loretta? Thats all he is adding to his lineup. Are you kidding me? That will improve your lineup, but that is not the kind of guy who will get you over the top.

Astros went to the World Series because of their pitching.

That rotation is not good enough to win a world series.

You could deal Prior if he is packaged with someother people, for a proven starter. Lackey? Angels might be willing to deal him, considering he is not becoming their ace like they expected him to. Adding a couple of FA pitchers will improve this team. Trading Barrett for Vernon Wells would be a smart idea. Then sign Bengie Molina.

CaliforniaRaisin · August 30, 2006

People do make spelling mistakes. I should of looked over it before I posted it.

Who is the 2B man? Loretta? Thats all he is adding to his lineup. Are you kidding me? That will improve your lineup, but that is not the kind of guy who will get you over the top.

But you said a guy like Loretta wouldn't improve the team before. This makes more sense.

Astros went to the World Series because of their pitching.

Sure. But they had a rookie CF.

That rotation is not good enough to win a world series.

You could deal Prior if he is packaged with someother people, for a proven starter. Lackey? Angels might be willing to deal him, considering he is not becoming their ace like they expected him to. Adding a couple of FA pitchers will improve this team. Trading Barrett for Vernon Wells would be a smart idea. Then sign Bengie Molina.

Prior's trade value is at his lowest. For someone like Lackey who probably isn't available except for the right price, you'd have to package Prior with someone like Zambrano, etc. I don't see the Angels trading away Lackey.

Adding a couple of FA pitchers definitely will improve the team, but the Cubs do have a limited budget.

Where is this Barrett for Wells rumor coming from? Why would the Blue Jays make such a horrible trade?

snoodmonger · August 30, 2006

Just building this team through FA and the minors probably won't net a WS team (although a few of the lineups shown could be competitive in the NL). What people aren't factoring in are trades. We could (theoretically) add a nice piece or two through trades in addition to FA/minors. That's probably the only way we could really turn this around.

Ding Dong Johnson · August 30, 2006

People do make spelling mistakes. I should of looked over it before I posted it.

Yes. Yes, you should have.

RichHillIsABeast · August 30, 2006

Just building this team through FA and the minors probably won't net a WS team (although a few of the lineups shown could be competitive in the NL). What people aren't factoring in are trades. We could (theoretically) add a nice piece or two through trades in addition to FA/minors. That's probably the only way we could really turn this around.

What impact player can be had for the middling prospects in our system?

C.C. · August 30, 2006

People do make spelling mistakes. I should of looked over it before I posted it.

Yes. Yes, you should have.

Let not point out people's spelling mistakes. It's so juvenile. Stick with talking baseball...

RichHillIsABeast · August 30, 2006

The posters who want Schmidt need to wake up. Yes, he's cheaper than Zito. He's an injury concern and a lot older. The last thing we need to do is sink FA money into someone who will likely spend significant time on the DL in his contract.

We don't need to get rid of our dependence on Prior and Wood b/c of injury concerns and replace that with Schmidt. What's the definition of stupidity? Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

Edited August 30, 2006 by RichHillIsABeast

uppercase_D · August 30, 2006

Any general ideas of how much they have to spend in the off season? Edited August 30, 2006 by uppercase_D

Transmogrified Tiger · August 30, 2006

I said in that post that the offense wasn't great, but it was feasible. I really didn't want to go down the "he's not available", "he'll cost more than that"/"you overvalue our prospects" road today with regards to trade targets. Feel free to come up with how we're going to fix the corner OF without running into the problem of giving up on Murton or trading Jones or Izturis, which isn't going to happen on Hendry's watch.

Playing Pie in CF and hitting him 7th is far less crazy than keeping Pierre and having him leadoff.

Notice that I said Schmidt was my personal fave, but I simply said to acquire a "good" starter? I even wrote "Acquisition" in the rotation in an attempt to have people not get hung up on Schmidt. The same thing with 2B. Names like Durham, Loretta, Giles, maybe Castillo, etc. could be brought up to fill the role. My point was in the ideology of getting a 2B to hit at the top, not to get hung up on who exactly it is. That comes later.

I said trade Howry and Eyre if we can get something "worthwhile". I prefaced that statement by saying to keep the bullpen as it is otherwise.

And finally(and probably most importantly), the Cubs have painted themselves into a corner with regards to starting pitching. They have unproven pitching(Marshall/Marmol/Hill/Guzman/Mateo), a great starter(Z), and a wildcard(Prior). Will a rotation made up of that win? Maybe, odds are it won't be great. But you know what? That's the bed Hendry has made for himself. The Cubs have based their farm system around pitching, and have done a poor job of getting that pitching a chance when they have an opening. And since they have less in the positional prospects, they have to use the pitchers they produce somehow. Either that is in trade, or in actually playing. Since hitting is a better investment in the free agent market than pitching, and considering we have those pitchers themselves to plug the pitching holes, it's a logical fit. You can't draft pitcher after pitcher after pitcher and then not give them a chance in the major leagues, because otherwise you end up with a nightmare like now. Add in that Hendry built the worst offense in baseball, and you're left with the Cubs of 2006.

soapy · August 30, 2006

Have you ever watch a game of baseball? Counting on a Cf with No major league experience is crazy. Adding a 2b will not improve this team. Counting on Prior is also just crazy. Adding a 34 yr old SP in Schmidt will be a dumb idea. Trading either Howry or Eyre, just dosent make sense. The bullpen looks to be a strength next year. Why turn a strength into a weakness?????????????????????

Oh Jesus. Here we go. No, I've never watched a freakin' baseball game in my life. You got me. Damn. I only thought baseball was just a bunch of funny numbers on a computer. All this time, I should have been watching games and seeing that counting on a rookie is crazy and never works.

OH WAIT. I WATCH BASEBALL ALL THE FREAKING TIME!!!! GIVE ME A FREAKING BREAK!!!

Adding a 2B will not improve this team????? What. Improving at a position will not improve the overall ability of the team??????????? That doesn't even make sense.

Just because you disagree with adding Schmidt doesn't make it a dumb idea. It's not like the guy has a history of missing lots of time with injuries. He's been very effective. He's very good.

Trading away one good bullpen makes the bullpen go from a strength to a weakness? Not in my book.

Forget it. This isn't even worth my time arguing with you. You already know for a fact what's going to happen next year.

fromthestretch · August 30, 2006

You could deal Prior if he is packaged with someother people, for a proven starter. Lackey? Angels might be willing to deal him, considering he is not becoming their ace like they expected him to. Adding a couple of FA pitchers will improve this team. Trading Barrett for Vernon Wells would be a smart idea. Then sign Bengie Molina.

Let me get this straight, you continually talk about the importance of pitching, yet you think that the Angels will be willing to deal a 27-year old starting pitcher capable of pitching over 200+ innings with an ERA in the mid-3.00s, simply because they don't think he's an ace?

David · August 30, 2006

http://i.cnn.net/si/si_online/covers/images/2004/0405_large.jpg

What a long, strange trip it's been.

C.C. · August 30, 2006

I actually have that one and this one...

http://www.prosportsmemorabilia.com/Images/Product/33-39/33-39956-P.jpg

It's sitting in a bottom drawer. It pains me to even look at it...

August 30, 2006

Abreu would be absolutely perfect for our needs. I think we should get him from Philly at the deadline with 2007 in mind.

goonys evil twin · August 30, 2006

Abreu would be absolutely perfect for our needs. I think we should get him from Philly at the deadline with 2007 in mind.

Hadn't thought of that, you might be onto something there.

Two questions:

How is his clutch feeling?

How big is his intangible?

dalgreen · August 30, 2006

I'm usually one of the more optimistic ones on here, but if you think about it, I think Hendry has a tougher job to do this off-season than last off-season and he didn't even do that right. I think I'll begin looking forward to 2008.

uppercase_D · August 30, 2006

I'm usually one of the more optimistic ones on here, but if you think about it, I think Hendry has a tougher job to do this off-season than last off-season and he didn't even do that right. I think I'll begin looking forward to 2008.

Especially if Aramis decides to opt out of his contract. Thats a sure-fire lose/lose situation. We either overpay to keep him and have less for needed improvements, or let him walk and end up with Bell as our starting third baseman. Hendry will of course overpay Bell cause he's in a panic.

UMFan83 · August 30, 2006

I just don't see how a couple of Mid-tier FAs is going to bring us back into the playoffs unless the Cubs strike gold like they did in 1998, 2001 and 2003 to a lesser extent.

2007...

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