Ken Rosenthal on the Cubs

[cheapseats]

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/5657268?CMP=OTC-K9B140813162&ATT=49

 

Ken says Baker doesn't deserve all the blame, but he does hold Baker accountable for missed cutoff men and lack of patience at the plate.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Philosophical shifts are required.

 

Wanted: Healthy, reliable starting pitchers.

 

Wanted: Hitters who can get on base.

 

Thank you, Mr. Rosenthal.

[brinoch]

That's a pretty good piece by Rosenthal.

[soapy]

I'd say that's a very fair assesment by Rosenthal (other then suggesting the whole Lugo thing).

[cheapseats]

I'd say that's a very fair assesment by Rosenthal (other then suggesting the whole Lugo thing).

 

Actually, Rosenthal is predicting that they'll do something like that, but he's not suggesting it. He calls for "[a] more introspective, long-term view."

[Careless]

Wasn't Rosenthal the guy who gave arguably the dumbest analysis of the Cubs ever before the white sox game on Fox 2 weeks ago?

[Banedon]

Wasn't Rosenthal the guy who gave arguably the dumbest analysis of the Cubs ever before the white sox game on Fox 2 weeks ago?

 

Rosenthal is bad, this article not withstanding.

[gflore34]

Great article by Rosenthal but, hasn't Bruce Miles been making the same points for at least a month now? I saw a little piece in the Tribune the other day apparently Gary Matthews and Company are upset. Upset at the insinuation that they're at fault for the Cubs' lack of fundamental play. Taking a cue from Dusty he offered a few excuses including blaming the players. According to Matthews while they stress smart baserunning, etc. is still up to the players to execute. Funny, other teams, such as the rest of the NL, don't seem to have these problems so, what's the scope Sarge? Are Cub players uncoachable? Sadly it's quite obvious Hendry does not value OBP nor will he ever, the current state will never change with Hendry at the helm.

[cheapseats]

Wasn't Rosenthal the guy who gave arguably the dumbest analysis of the Cubs ever before the white sox game on Fox 2 weeks ago?

 

Rosenthal is bad, this article not withstanding.

 

Yeah, I was actually surprised it was worth reading.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Wasn't Rosenthal the guy who gave arguably the dumbest analysis of the Cubs ever before the white sox game on Fox 2 weeks ago?

 

Rosenthal is bad, this article not withstanding.

 

Yeah, I was actually surprised it was worth reading.

 

Same here. He usually drives me into wanting more Woody Paige. Well, maybe he's not quite that bad.

[goonys evil twin]

Great article by Rosenthal but, hasn't Bruce Miles been making the same points for at least a month now? I saw a little piece in the Tribune the other day apparently Gary Matthews and Company are upset. Upset at the insinuation that they're at fault for the Cubs' lack of fundamental play. Taking a cue from Dusty he offered a few excuses including blaming the players. According to Matthews while they stress smart baserunning, etc. is still up to the players to execute. Funny, other teams, such as the rest of the NL, don't seem to have these problems so, what's the scope Sarge? Are Cub players uncoachable? Sadly it's quite obvious Hendry does not value OBP nor will he ever, the current state will never change with Hendry at the helm.

 

I read that hack job about Mathews, written by the great apologist for everybody Fred Mitchell. The contention that the coaches have done all they can do and it's up to the players to execute is nothing more than lazy coaching. It's not just the coaches job to tell the players what to do, it's their job to make sure the players know what to do. If the players aren't executing what the coaches are coaching, then the coaches aren't doing a good enough job of coaching.

[RegulusBlue]

I noticed that he managed to take a shot at Murton in the same breath that he whines about us not having any OBP. What a total fool. LF has been the least of the Cubs' problems so far this year, especially with the recent power surge by Matt over the last four or five games. We can surely fix our OBP problems by trading for Soriano (.347 OBP) and putting Murton (.363 OBP) on the bench. Great strategy, moran.

 

He just makes it obvious that he only did some research for the article, and the rest of it is just freelanced. Cedeno can hardly be considered a huge problem either. We don't have a better shortstop right now, and he's not even that bad, although his average is taking a consistent slide as the season progresses, and he doesn't have the above average OBP of Murton.

[srbin84]

If Neifi was putting up Cedeno's exact same numbers/defense and getting paid the league min., people would be up in arms. Cendeno is not having a good season, even for a rookie of his minor league experience and history.

[goonys evil twin]

If Neifi was putting up Cedeno's exact same numbers/defense and getting paid the league min., people would be up in arms. Cendeno is not having a good season, even for a rookie of his minor league experience and history.

 

If Neifi was putting up Cedeno's numbers they'd represent a career year. If he did it at league minimum it would be more tolerable. But the biggest difference in the situation is that Ronny's doing it at 23, with lots of hope for improvement, whereas Neifi is a dead end vet who is just going to keep getting worse.

 

Ronny is having an acceptable year for a 23 year old SS making the minimum. Certainly not what you'd want, but acceptable nonetheless, as reasonable fans have to be willing to accept lesser production from cheap kids. Furcal certainly hasn't been $12 million better.

[srbin84]

If Neifi was putting up Cedeno's exact same numbers/defense and getting paid the league min., people would be up in arms. Cendeno is not having a good season, even for a rookie of his minor league experience and history.

 

If Neifi was putting up Cedeno's numbers they'd represent a career year.

 

Neifi put up the same line last year with much better defense, actually.

[goonys evil twin]

If Neifi was putting up Cedeno's exact same numbers/defense and getting paid the league min., people would be up in arms. Cendeno is not having a good season, even for a rookie of his minor league experience and history.

 

If Neifi was putting up Cedeno's numbers they'd represent a career year.

 

Neifi put up the same line last year with much better defense, actually.

 

In what fantasy world? He had a sub .300 OBP.

[YearofDaCubs]

If Neifi was putting up Cedeno's exact same numbers/defense and getting paid the league min., people would be up in arms. Cendeno is not having a good season, even for a rookie of his minor league experience and history.

 

If Neifi was putting up Cedeno's numbers they'd represent a career year.

 

Neifi put up the same line last year with much better defense, actually.

 

In what fantasy world? He had a sub .300 OBP.

Have you guys even seen how pathetic Perez's OBP has been the past couple of years? His career should have come to an end long time ago.

 

2002 .260

2003 .285

2004 .276

2004(Cubs) .400 anomaly.

2005 .298

Current .228

[Ding Dong Johnson]

His career should have come to an end long time ago.

 

I believe everyone outside of the Cubs organization agrees with you. Inside, however, they reward his ineptitude with millions.

[NewUserName]

I am more than willing to except Cedeno's production being that he is a 23 yr old player. For some reason Cub fans have this idea that players enter the major leagues as good players. There are some players that do (Pujols) most however take time to develop. The one thing that the Cubs organization has failed to do for years is let young players play thru the growing process. Basically if they are not productive when they come up they are thrown away except for a few exceptions.

 

 

I liked the article, mostly accurate. I dont think he was attacking Cedeno and Murton, just pointing out that they are young players that are inconsistent. I do think the whole article was kind of a slam on Hendry without actually saying it.

[srbin84]

If Neifi was putting up Cedeno's exact same numbers/defense and getting paid the league min., people would be up in arms. Cendeno is not having a good season, even for a rookie of his minor league experience and history.

 

If Neifi was putting up Cedeno's numbers they'd represent a career year.

 

Neifi put up the same line last year with much better defense, actually.

 

In what fantasy world? He had a sub .300 OBP.

 

Just about the same OPS....and better D. I hope Cedeno improves his game more, but it is a fact that Neifi Perez in 2005 was the better player if you are looking strictly at the stats so far.

[Andy]

If Neifi was putting up Cedeno's exact same numbers/defense and getting paid the league min., people would be up in arms. Cendeno is not having a good season, even for a rookie of his minor league experience and history.

 

If Neifi was putting up Cedeno's numbers they'd represent a career year.

 

Neifi put up the same line last year with much better defense, actually.

 

In what fantasy world? He had a sub .300 OBP.

Have you guys even seen how pathetic Perez's OBP has been the past couple of years? His career should have come to an end long time ago.

 

2002 .260

2003 .285

2004 .276

2004(Cubs) .400 anomaly.

2005 .298

Current .228

In 62 ABs, he put up a .948 OPS. :shock: In retrospect, that was the worst thing he could've possibly done, as it convinced the Cubs to keep him around ever since.

[RockTheIvy]

Neifi!'s OBP is usually near the Mendoza line, which a .200 avg!

 

Neifi sucks. There should never ever be a reason Cedeno sits for Neifi! this season. If we were in the playoff hunt, maybe Neifi! could become a late inning replacement, but since we aren't, Cedeno should play as much as possible.

[srbin84]

Nobody is suggesting he should be benched for Neifi, just that he is playing worse than Neifi did last year.

[RockTheIvy]

Nobody is suggesting he should be benched for Neifi, just that he is playing worse than Neifi did last year.

 

So far, Cedeno's OPS is a bit higher than Neifi!'s was last year. Plus Cedeno is 23 and Neifi! is, well, old. I think I'd rather have Macias back than Neifi! I like the weak swings better than the swinging bunts.

[SoonerCubFan]

If Neifi was putting up Cedeno's exact same numbers/defense and getting paid the league min., people would be up in arms. Cendeno is not having a good season, even for a rookie of his minor league experience and history.

 

If Neifi was putting up Cedeno's numbers they'd represent a career year.

 

Neifi put up the same line last year with much better defense, actually.

 

Yes, the lines project about the same overall. But, along with the afore-mentioned room for improvement, Cedeno actually plays a better game offensively in terms of advancing runners, taking pitches, etc. None of which are too helpful with the current feeble lineup, but could still be beneficial with a better team. Maybe we could call in Jim Frey to give Ronny the Sandberg talk??

 

As for D, I have to disagree. Yes, Ronny makes some poor throws, but his range is terrific and probably gets more outs over other SS's than he gives away with errors, and will easily improve. He's got Gold Glove ability once he corrects his throwing.