Was Ozzie Guillen an intelligent player?

[RonnieWooWooSanto]

I was reading the poll at this site that asked whether you would rather have Ozzie or Dusty as manager. As I was reading, I was thinking how I don't recall hearing or reading from broadcasters/writers that Ozzie was an intelligent player.

 

When I watched him play, I watched very passively but I do remember that he was fooled by the hidden ball trick. He fell for it three times in his career. Two of the three were in the same season. This points to a unintelligent or at least a distracted player.

 

 

6-23-89 - Greg Brock, 1B MIL catches him in the 9th.

8-5-89 - Dave Bergman, 1B DET catches him in the 7th.

5-13-91 - Steve Lyons, 2B BOS catches him in the 4th.

 

Obviously, the Sox thought he was intelligent or they would have never hired him as their manager. I know that he won the World Series, but he definitely had some horses that helped in that regard. Granted he still had to manage those horses.

 

So was Ozzie an intelligent player?

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Ozzie has never been smart. His managerial days are no exception.

[Ram23]

This should absolutely answer your question:

 

http://wizbangblog.com/images/2005/10/white_sox_kiss.jpg

[SouthSideRyan]

I think Ozzie was hired primarily because he was cheap.

[Sammy Sofa]

Ozzie doesn't screw up his team half as bad as some other MLB managers do. Hey may be a jackass, but a complete moron doesn't randomly win the WS with the White Sox team he had. They were damn good, but they weren't world-beaters.

[Derwood]

This should absolutely answer your question:

 

A photo of Ozzie kissing his son in a traditional Venezuelan manner answers what now?

[Ram23]

This should absolutely answer your question:

 

A photo of Ozzie kissing his son in a traditional Venezuelan manner answers what now?

 

It was a joke.

[Derwood]

This should absolutely answer your question:

 

A photo of Ozzie kissing his son in a traditional Venezuelan manner answers what now?

 

It was a joke.

 

One that was told numerous times last October. I'm not sure the implication of his sexual orientation would have anything to do with intelligence anyways. But that's a can of worms we don't want to open again, right?

[Ram23]

This should absolutely answer your question:

 

A photo of Ozzie kissing his son in a traditional Venezuelan manner answers what now?

 

It was a joke.

 

One that was told numerous times last October. I'm not sure the implication of his sexual orientation would have anything to do with intelligence anyways. But that's a can of worms we don't want to open again, right?

 

Killjoy.

[Derwood]

To get back on the thread topic, I can't say I watched too many Sox games when Guillen played. I certainly remember him, but mostly as a #9 hitter with bad numbers. I'm pretty sure he was hired for his ties to the team and his reputation among the players he has coached.

[Mark Priors Calves]

I think Ozzie was hired primarily because he was cheap.

word. and he signed only a 2 year deal and he didn't get to pick his own coaches.

 

the sox went cheap on the radio broadcast and it shows.

[Andy]

The most intelligent thing about Ozzie is that he throws the same lineup out consistently, doesn't overwork his pitchers, and generally doesn't try to make himself look like a genius by pulling the usual overmanaging crap (sac-bunts, hit and runs, three pitching changes in an inning).

[K-Town]

The guy has been in this country for what............ 30 years? And still can't speak the language?

 

I'd have to question his intelligence.

[Derwood]

The guy has been in this country for what............ 30 years? And still can't speak the language?

 

I'd have to question his intelligence.

 

That's not a lack of intelligence. That's laziness. My wife's family are all hispanic immigrants, and some of them literally don't speak English AT ALL (despite living in the country for 30+ years). If you're a housewife who always speaks Spanish at home with the family....

[K-Town]

The guy has been in this country for what............ 30 years? And still can't speak the language?

 

I'd have to question his intelligence.

 

That's not a lack of intelligence. That's laziness. My wife's family are all hispanic immigrants, and some of them literally don't speak English AT ALL (despite living in the country for 30+ years). If you're a housewife who always speaks Spanish at home with the family....

 

Call it laziness, then. There's no excuse for it, in my opinion.

[CubsBullsBears]

Ozzie speaks good english. He needs to stop making enemies, but I would take him over Dusty any day.

[Derwood]

The guy has been in this country for what............ 30 years? And still can't speak the language?

 

I'd have to question his intelligence.

 

That's not a lack of intelligence. That's laziness. My wife's family are all hispanic immigrants, and some of them literally don't speak English AT ALL (despite living in the country for 30+ years). If you're a housewife who always speaks Spanish at home with the family....

 

Call it laziness, then. There's no excuse for it, in my opinion.

 

I'm not excusing it, just explaining it :wink:

[CubinNY]

Ozzie doesn't screw up his team half as bad as some other MLB managers do. Hey may be a jackass, but a complete moron doesn't randomly win the WS with the White Sox team he had. They were damn good, but they weren't world-beaters.

 

Managing in the AL is much easier than managing in the NL.

 

The WS were extremely lucky last year in terms of the health of their team. I give Williams credit for brining in a lot of those players but they already had a pretty good nucleous of talent to begin with.

 

Making stupid comments in the press and yelling obsenities doesn't make one a good manager.

[TB_11]

FWIW you don't really need to be intelligent to be a good manager, or a good player for that matter.

[K-Town]

Ozzie speaks good english. He needs to stop making enemies, but I would take him over Dusty any day.

 

Speaks good English???

 

Are you serious? Most people can't understand a word he says. He does pronounce the vulgarities surprisingly well, however.

[cubbyvirus00]

Ozzie speaks good english. He needs to stop making enemies, but I would take him over Dusty any day.

 

Speaks good English???

 

Are you serious? Most people can't understand a word he says. He does pronounce the vulgarities surprisingly well, however.

 

 

Dont look at Ozzie for bad English, look at the inner city kids and the surburban kids who use ebonics, and say "dude" and "gay" in every other sentence. These kids are going through our educational system.

 

But politics and sports don't go hand in hand, right? :sunny:

[K-Town]

Ozzie speaks good english. He needs to stop making enemies, but I would take him over Dusty any day.

 

Speaks good English???

 

Are you serious? Most people can't understand a word he says. He does pronounce the vulgarities surprisingly well, however.

 

 

Dont look at Ozzie for bad English, look at the inner city kids and the surburban kids who use ebonics, and say "dude" and "gay" in every other sentence. These kids are going through our educational system.

 

But politics and sports don't go hand in hand, right? :sunny:

 

 

I'm not sure what your point is. Are you saying that Ozzie's English is good, because the inner-city English is bad? Can't they BOTH be bad?

 

As for the inner-city kids, I doubt if the educational system is teaching them "dude" and "gay". Lack of parents and parenting is probably a bigger issue.

[RonnieWooWooSanto]

FWIW you don't really need to be intelligent to be a good manager, or a good player for that matter.

 

I was asking if he was an "intelligent player". I'm not looking for ACT/SAT/IQ scores or anything of the sort.

Edited June 3, 2006 by RonnieWooWooSanto

[CubsBullsBears]

Ozzie speaks good english. He needs to stop making enemies, but I would take him over Dusty any day.

 

Speaks good English???

 

Are you serious? Most people can't understand a word he says. He does pronounce the vulgarities surprisingly well, however.

 

 

Dont look at Ozzie for bad English, look at the inner city kids and the surburban kids who use ebonics, and say "dude" and "gay" in every other sentence. These kids are going through our educational system.

 

But politics and sports don't go hand in hand, right? :sunny:

 

 

I'm not sure what your point is. Are you saying that Ozzie's English is good, because the inner-city English is bad? Can't they BOTH be bad?

 

As for the inner-city kids, I doubt if the educational system is teaching them "dude" and "gay". Lack of parents and parenting is probably a bigger issue.

I can understand guys who speak english 10x worse than Ozzie at my work. He has good english. He just needs to stop pissing people off like calling Magglio Ordonez a Venezuelan Mo-Fo.

[Illini Iceman]

Ozzie doesn't screw up his team half as bad as some other MLB managers do. Hey may be a jackass, but a complete moron doesn't randomly win the WS with the White Sox team he had. They were damn good, but they weren't world-beaters.

 

Managing in the AL is much easier than managing in the NL.

 

The WS were extremely lucky last year in terms of the health of their team. I give Williams credit for brining in a lot of those players but they already had a pretty good nucleous of talent to begin with.

 

Making stupid comments in the press and yelling obsenities doesn't make one a good manager.

 

It also pretty easy to manage when your pitching is giving up no runs. It is the same as Baker in '03. When your pitching is shutting down the opponent every night you have a lot of room for error. If Prior and Wood had not faltered Baker could also have a WS title but that would not make him any better of a manager.