Fish

[jjgman21]

I saw a graphic earlier today in the Fish game. There are currently 12 major league players that are making more money this year than the entire 25 man Marlin roster. Fact!

 

The graphic had the Marlins roster at 15m.

 

there really should be a rule against that. it's like the movie Major League come to life. a farce, made even more farcical by the fact that two players account for more than 2/3 of that.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Pierre has been a factor thus far even if his performance hasn't always been great. When he gets on base, the pitchers seem to lose focus on the batter and he makes things happen. In addition, his work ethic seems like a great influence on the youngsters. Thus far, he appears to be the best leadoff hitter we've had since Lofton.

 

Thus far? He's been terrible. A lot of things "seem" to be the case and aren't based in fact. It seems to me that Pierre is hitting a ton of weak ground outs at Wrigley and will continue to struggle mightily there. Does that seem to be the case? Yes. Will that happen? Probably not.

 

Given his career averages, he'll likely improve on BA and OBP and be an even bigger factor. A couple bad games can inordinately skew numbers at this point in the year. (A few days ago his BA was near .350 and his OBP was near .400.)

 

This is the point I'm making. It's far too early to make any judgment based on this year's performance, but if you are going to take this small sample, I don't know how you could conclude it's been positive.

[cjbucks]

It would seem to me that Slappy has scored 6 runs in 7 games and they all counted toward the final score.

[BigbadB]

You can say that this shouldn't happen, but realistically, the Florida Marlins team salary is in line with how much these players should really be making to play a game.

 

Ticket prices shouldn't have skyrocketed to what they have, and it most certainly shouldn't cost $5 for a lousy hot dog.

 

A $15m team salary is $600K per player. That's a lot of money. Endorsement deals can up their salary even more. Not only would these players be making more than half a million to play baseball 8 months out of the year, but they don't really accrue many expenses as a ballplayer. The team picks up the travel, daily food allowances, work out room, laundry, equipment, etc.....

 

Once their careers are over, they still have plenty of time to work a real job or even just plain retire if they managed their money wisely.

 

Do the players on the New York Yankees hustle more because they make more money than the guys on the Marlins? Sure, they are more talented players, but they don't work any harder at the game than anyone else. It is just plain ridiculous that the Yankees payroll averages nearly 10m a player.

 

This is just my little rant that it costs a middle income family nearly the entire savings to take the whole family to a single baseball game, and do it the right way, buying hot dogs, peanuts, soda, beer, baseball caps and other souvenirs.

 

I remember paying $8.00 a ticket to go see KISS in concert. I just heard the other day that Madonna is getting $400.00 a ticket to see her show (not that you actually pay me to go see her).

 

I never understood why it became acceptable to raise ticket prices so much, and nearly every year. And if that isn't enough, when the baseball players aren't happy with their salary increases, they just cancel the season and go on strike. The fans take it in the hind either way. You have your choice of super expensive baseball or no baseball at all. But, once baseball resumes, you will pay more for super expensive baseball and you'll like it. I took a long break from baseball on that last strike. They almost lost me for good. I came back, and now I'm even more hooked than I've ever been. But, baseball parks seem more interested in catering to a corporate crowd who can write off season tickets as a business expense than they do the foundation that made this game as big as it is today. There's nothing better than family bonding at a baseball game.

 

If the Marlins only want to pay 15m for their baseball team, I'm fine with that. I would hope that the ticket prices would reflect a decrease in cost considering you aren't getting as much bang for your buck. But, I have watched a couple of Florida games already this year, and they are kind of fun to watch. A bunch of young kids busting their butts trying to lock down a starting job for the next 10 years. I sure enjoy that a whole lot more than watching a multimillionaire not hustling out a ground ball.

 

I'd love to go to more baseball games, but I don't like paying $40 a ticket. My eyes bulge each time I order hot dogs, peanuts, red vines and sodas for everyone when the girl behind the counter says "that'll be $60.00, sir". I can afford it just like I can continue paying the ridiculous price for cigarettes. If I quit smoking, I'd be able to afford a game even more. But, it's the principle. There comes a point where it's just not worth it anymore. I took the wife to 2 WBC games, and between the two games, we spent somewhere in the vicinity of $700.00 to watch two baseball games. JUST THE TWO OF US. Tickets, parking, souvenirs, food and beverage, BAM!

 

The guy down the street would love to take his kids to the game, but he's struggling to make ends meet. There's no way he's taking his whole family to a baseball game without taking out a loan. And that's sad. It shouldn't be that way.

 

Over the past few years, I've actually seen smaller contracts being handed out than what they were doing in 2000. I was hoping to see a market correction, but I don't think it will really correct to the extent that I would like to see it correct. I'd like to see ticket prices reduced and a tremendous reduction in how much these privileged players who are lucky enough to play in the bigs make playing a game. I love the game, but it's definitely got its issues.

[CUBZ99]

Pierre has been a factor thus far even if his performance hasn't always been great. When he gets on base, the pitchers seem to lose focus on the batter and he makes things happen. In addition, his work ethic seems like a great influence on the youngsters. Thus far, he appears to be the best leadoff hitter we've had since Lofton.

 

Thus far? He's been terrible. A lot of things "seem" to be the case and aren't based in fact. It seems to me that Pierre is hitting a ton of weak ground outs at Wrigley and will continue to struggle mightily there. Does that seem to be the case? Yes. Will that happen? Probably not.

 

Given his career averages, he'll likely improve on BA and OBP and be an even bigger factor. A couple bad games can inordinately skew numbers at this point in the year. (A few days ago his BA was near .350 and his OBP was near .400.)

 

This is the point I'm making. It's far too early to make any judgment based on this year's performance, but if you are going to take this small sample, I don't know how you could conclude it's been positive.

 

This is where people that only use stats as an argument lose credibility. You can't watch a Cubs game this year without noticing the impact that Pierre has made on the team.

 

I'm not saying that stats aren't important, but try watching a game or two. The things Pierre has done so far has not shown up in the box score and regardless of how you classify his play, he has not been anywhere near horrible. I'm sure that he would like to get on base more, but when he has been on base he has been outstanding and runs are just as much a product of his efforts as anyone else's on the team.

[BigbadB]

Yeah, it's not really fair to grade a player this early in the season. 1 hit or walk can make a huge impact on a batting average. One ground out knocks several points off of a batting average.

[Andy]

Great post man, I completely agree with everything.

[srbin84]

So Pierre goes 0 for 9 in two games (Cubs went 1-1) and has 5 good games (Cubs went 4-1) and that equals a terrible start? He's a big part of the Cubs early success regardless of what his current OBP/OPS is.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Pierre has been a factor thus far even if his performance hasn't always been great. When he gets on base, the pitchers seem to lose focus on the batter and he makes things happen. In addition, his work ethic seems like a great influence on the youngsters. Thus far, he appears to be the best leadoff hitter we've had since Lofton.

 

Thus far? He's been terrible. A lot of things "seem" to be the case and aren't based in fact. It seems to me that Pierre is hitting a ton of weak ground outs at Wrigley and will continue to struggle mightily there. Does that seem to be the case? Yes. Will that happen? Probably not.

 

Given his career averages, he'll likely improve on BA and OBP and be an even bigger factor. A couple bad games can inordinately skew numbers at this point in the year. (A few days ago his BA was near .350 and his OBP was near .400.)

 

This is the point I'm making. It's far too early to make any judgment based on this year's performance, but if you are going to take this small sample, I don't know how you could conclude it's been positive.

 

This is where people that only use stats as an argument lose credibility. You can't watch a Cubs game this year without noticing the impact that Pierre has made on the team.

 

I'm not saying that stats aren't important, but try watching a game or two. The things Pierre has done so far has not shown up in the box score and regardless of how you classify his play, he has not been anywhere near horrible. I'm sure that he would like to get on base more, but when he has been on base he has been outstanding and runs are just as much a product of his efforts as anyone else's on the team.

 

What does he do that doesn't show up in the box score? Wreak havoc on the bases? He needs to get on base to be able to do that, and he's been terrible at it thus far.

 

If you think that Pierre is going to be the definition of a leadoff hitter and spark the offense and distract pitchers or whatever, that's fine. But he needs to get on base to do any of that stuff, and he simply hasn't done that so far. Not to say that he won't do it going forward, but claiming that he's been great so far is wrong.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

So Pierre goes 0 for 9 in two games (Cubs went 1-1) and has 5 good games (Cubs went 4-1) and that equals a terrible start? He's a big part of the Cubs early success regardless of what his current OBP/OPS is.

 

He's 4 of 24 with a walk since opening day.

[srbin84]

So Pierre goes 0 for 9 in two games (Cubs went 1-1) and has 5 good games (Cubs went 4-1) and that equals a terrible start? He's a big part of the Cubs early success regardless of what his current OBP/OPS is.

 

He's 4 of 24 with a walk since opening day.

 

Then which of these are classified as bad games:

 

1 for 4 2 runs 2 SB

 

1 for 4 1 run

 

1 for 4 1 RBI

 

1 for 3 1 BB

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Are you seriously trying to rationalize a stretch where a guy gets on base 1 in 5 times to the plate as him doing well?

[srbin84]

Are you seriously trying to rationalize a stretch where a guy gets on base 1 in 5 times to the plate as him doing well?

 

No, I'm saying he has had 5 good games (Cubs 4-1), 2 bad games (Cubs 1-1)

 

You are the one saying 5 good+2 bad=terrible start

[rocket]

Are you seriously trying to rationalize a stretch where a guy gets on base 1 in 5 times to the plate as him doing well?

 

No, I'm saying he has had 5 good games (Cubs 4-1), 2 bad games (Cubs 1-1)

 

You are the one saying 5 good+2 bad=terrible start

 

No, he's saying that those games weren't really that good.

 

And Juan Pierre hasn't hit any of the homeruns that are primarily the reason we're scoring so many runs thus far into the season. He's hindered the offense so far, not helped.

[CardsFanInChiTown]

So Pierre goes 0 for 9 in two games (Cubs went 1-1) and has 5 good games (Cubs went 4-1) and that equals a terrible start? He's a big part of the Cubs early success regardless of what his current OBP/OPS is.

 

He's 4 of 24 with a walk since opening day.

 

Then which of these are classified as bad games:

 

1 for 4 2 runs 2 SB

 

1 for 4 1 run

 

1 for 4 1 RBI

 

1 for 3 1 BB

 

Getting on base 1 out of 4 times is awful.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Are you seriously trying to rationalize a stretch where a guy gets on base 1 in 5 times to the plate as him doing well?

 

No, I'm saying he has had 5 good games (Cubs 4-1), 2 bad games (Cubs 1-1)

 

You are the one saying 5 good+2 bad=terrible start

 

5 good games? He's gotten on base more than once in 2 games. By that definition every Cub starter aside from Neifi had a "good" game today. I can't believe I have to make the argument that someone who's hitting .259/.286/.370(or .166/.200/.208 aside from opening day) is not doing well.

[srbin84]

So Pierre goes 0 for 9 in two games (Cubs went 1-1) and has 5 good games (Cubs went 4-1) and that equals a terrible start? He's a big part of the Cubs early success regardless of what his current OBP/OPS is.

 

He's 4 of 24 with a walk since opening day.

 

Then which of these are classified as bad games:

 

1 for 4 2 runs 2 SB

 

1 for 4 1 run

 

1 for 4 1 RBI

 

1 for 3 1 BB

 

Getting on base 1 out of 4 times is awful.

 

That projects to 162 runs, 54 RBI and 108 SB. That seems alright to me.

[soccer10k]

So Pierre goes 0 for 9 in two games (Cubs went 1-1) and has 5 good games (Cubs went 4-1) and that equals a terrible start? He's a big part of the Cubs early success regardless of what his current OBP/OPS is.

 

He's 4 of 24 with a walk since opening day.

 

Then which of these are classified as bad games:

 

1 for 4 2 runs 2 SB

 

1 for 4 1 run

 

1 for 4 1 RBI

 

1 for 3 1 BB

 

Getting on base 1 out of 4 times is awful.

 

Especially since he's a leadoff hitter.

[srbin84]

Which is the better season:

 

Player A: .300 BA .380 OBP .550 SLG 30 HRs 90 RBI 80 runs 1/3 SB

 

Player B: .250 BA .330 OBP .500 SLG 20 HRs 115 RBI 100 runs 55/60 SB

[jjgman21]

the most important stat in the assessment of Juan Pierre thus far

 

PA 31

[Transmogrified Tiger]

So Pierre goes 0 for 9 in two games (Cubs went 1-1) and has 5 good games (Cubs went 4-1) and that equals a terrible start? He's a big part of the Cubs early success regardless of what his current OBP/OPS is.

 

He's 4 of 24 with a walk since opening day.

 

Then which of these are classified as bad games:

 

1 for 4 2 runs 2 SB

 

1 for 4 1 run

 

1 for 4 1 RBI

 

1 for 3 1 BB

 

Getting on base 1 out of 4 times is awful.

 

That projects to 162 runs, 54 RBI and 108 SB. That seems alright to me.

 

First of all, I have no idea how you're projecting those numbers.

 

Secondly, Runs and RBI are pretty much worthless to project, because they are dependent on those around you. The true value of a player lies in what he actually does, not what his teammates do, and thus far Pierre has been downright bad. I'm not saying he'll continue this pace, but to claim that his season to date has been successful is simply incorrect.

[soccer10k]

Which is the better season:

 

Player A: .300 BA .380 OBP .550 SLG 30 HRs 90 RBI 80 runs 1/3 SB

 

Player B: .250 BA .330 OBP .500 SLG 20 HRs 115 RBI 100 runs 55/60 SB

 

Doesn't that depend on where in the order you want the player to bat?

[CardsFanInChiTown]

That projects to 162 runs, 54 RBI and 108 SB. That seems alright to me.

 

Which is the better season:

 

Player A: .300 BA .380 OBP .550 SLG 30 HRs 90 RBI 80 runs 1/3 SB

 

Player B: .250 BA .330 OBP .500 SLG 20 HRs 115 RBI 100 runs 55/60 SB

 

 

 

Player A - RBI and Runs are a team driven stat. What player would you rather pick up in the offseason?

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Which is the better season:

 

Player A: .300 BA .380 OBP .550 SLG 30 HRs 90 RBI 80 runs 1/3 SB

 

Player B: .250 BA .330 OBP .500 SLG 20 HRs 115 RBI 100 runs 55/60 SB

 

Player A, no question.

 

the most important stat in the assessment of Juan Pierre thus far

 

PA 31

 

Again, I'm not trying to forecast Pierre's season based on this, or claim that trading him was a bad idea because of this start, but the implication that he's done well in those 31 PA's is wrong.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Which is the better season:

 

Player A: .300 BA .380 OBP .550 SLG 30 HRs 90 RBI 80 runs 1/3 SB

 

Player B: .250 BA .330 OBP .500 SLG 20 HRs 115 RBI 100 runs 55/60 SB

 

Doesn't that depend on where in the order you want the player to bat?

 

No.