Luis Gonzalez???

[brinoch]

2005: .304/.349/.515/.864

2003-2005: .298/.348/.507/.855

 

2005: .271/.366/.459/.825

2003-2005: .280/.381/.495/.876

 

One is Gonzalez, one is Tejada.

 

And one is a SS and the other is a corner OF. Couldn't you match up Sandbergs numbers with a corner OF guy too and make him not look as good?

 

Granted, the player cost is a big difference but I don't see how comparing a corner OF with a middle infielder stats and seeing them as the same value.

 

That's exactly what was about to point out. It's a meaningless comparison.

 

Tejada's value is really based on a comparison of shortstops; he's better than they are. That said, the point is that we can upgrade the offense an equivalent amount for a lesser player cost in trade. To me, that means acquiring Gonzalez for Patterson is a better move than acquiring Tejada for Prior.

 

You do need to consider the positions of the respective players, of course, but we don't have a hole, per se, at LF or SS. The acquisition of Gonzalez would seem to shore up the OF, hopefully making a Murton/Jones platoon (not bad) along with Pierre and Gonzalez. And you keep Prior in the rotation. Otherwise, you start the season with Tejada, but with Murton/Pierre/Jones and no Prior.

 

I think my opinion on this is evident.

[goonys evil twin]

2005: .304/.349/.515/.864

2003-2005: .298/.348/.507/.855

 

2005: .271/.366/.459/.825

2003-2005: .280/.381/.495/.876

 

One is Gonzalez, one is Tejada.

 

And one is a SS and the other is a corner OF. Couldn't you match up Sandbergs numbers with a corner OF guy too and make him not look as good?

 

Granted, the player cost is a big difference but I don't see how comparing a corner OF with a middle infielder stats and seeing them as the same value.

 

That's exactly what was about to point out. It's a meaningless comparison.

 

It's meaningless if you use it to rank the two players. It's not meaningless if you're talking about what that guy would bring to the team next year. Either Gonzo or Tejada would be fine for the 5th spot in the order, and both would bring similar production. The difference is what kind of production they would be replacing, Murton or Cedeno. Theoretically Murton would still be getting time against LHers, either replacing Gonzo or Jones, depending on the day. Gonzo would be replacing Murton vs RHP. Whereas Tejada would be replacing Cedeno vs just about everybody. Murton is likely to produce a bit more than Cedeno, but a nice chunk of that production would be against LHP. Against RHP he's not going to be as good. Without concerns for what you give up, you'd rather have Tejada, obviously. But when you take into account their similar production, you'd be insane to prefer Tejada + Murton - Prior over Gonzo + Cedeno + Prior.

 

It's not even a debate.

[BigbadB]

2005: .304/.349/.515/.864

2003-2005: .298/.348/.507/.855

 

2005: .271/.366/.459/.825

2003-2005: .280/.381/.495/.876

 

One is Gonzalez, one is Tejada.

 

And one is a SS and the other is a corner OF. Couldn't you match up Sandbergs numbers with a corner OF guy too and make him not look as good?

 

Granted, the player cost is a big difference but I don't see how comparing a corner OF with a middle infielder stats and seeing them as the same value.

 

That's exactly what was about to point out. It's a meaningless comparison.

 

It's meaningless if you use it to rank the two players. It's not meaningless if you're talking about what that guy would bring to the team next year. Either Gonzo or Tejada would be fine for the 5th spot in the order, and both would bring similar production. The difference is what kind of production they would be replacing, Murton or Cedeno. Theoretically Murton would still be getting time against LHers, either replacing Gonzo or Jones, depending on the day. Gonzo would be replacing Murton vs RHP. Whereas Tejada would be replacing Cedeno vs just about everybody. Murton is likely to produce a bit more than Cedeno, but a nice chunk of that production would be against LHP. Against RHP he's not going to be as good. Without concerns for what you give up, you'd rather have Tejada, obviously. But when you take into account their similar production, you'd be insane to prefer Tejada + Murton - Prior over Gonzo + Cedeno + Prior.

 

It's not even a debate.

 

Well put. Too bad Hendry doesn't see stuff like this.

[CuseCubFan69]

2005: .304/.349/.515/.864

2003-2005: .298/.348/.507/.855

 

2005: .271/.366/.459/.825

2003-2005: .280/.381/.495/.876

 

One is Gonzalez, one is Tejada.

 

And one is a SS and the other is a corner OF. Couldn't you match up Sandbergs numbers with a corner OF guy too and make him not look as good?

 

Granted, the player cost is a big difference but I don't see how comparing a corner OF with a middle infielder stats and seeing them as the same value.

 

That's exactly what was about to point out. It's a meaningless comparison.

 

It's meaningless if you use it to rank the two players. It's not meaningless if you're talking about what that guy would bring to the team next year. Either Gonzo or Tejada would be fine for the 5th spot in the order, and both would bring similar production. The difference is what kind of production they would be replacing, Murton or Cedeno. Theoretically Murton would still be getting time against LHers, either replacing Gonzo or Jones, depending on the day. Gonzo would be replacing Murton vs RHP. Whereas Tejada would be replacing Cedeno vs just about everybody. Murton is likely to produce a bit more than Cedeno, but a nice chunk of that production would be against LHP. Against RHP he's not going to be as good. Without concerns for what you give up, you'd rather have Tejada, obviously. But when you take into account their similar production, you'd be insane to prefer Tejada + Murton - Prior over Gonzo + Cedeno + Prior.

 

It's not even a debate.

 

Color me insane because you forgot to add a pitcher that may come over in a trade or signed as a free agent. I also look at it as not having Perez in the lineup nearly as much especially if Walker is still on the team.

[goonys evil twin]

Color me insane because you forgot to add a pitcher that may come over in a trade or signed as a free agent. I also look at it as not having Perez in the lineup nearly as much especially if Walker is still on the team.

 

They wouldn't be getting a pitcher worthwhile of being in the discussion.

[BigbadB]

Color me insane because you forgot to add a pitcher that may come over in a trade or signed as a free agent. I also look at it as not having Perez in the lineup nearly as much especially if Walker is still on the team.

 

Can they afford a pitcher after taking on Tejada? I don't think so.

 

With Dusty and Neifi on the same team, I wouldn't count on Neifi sitting all that much.

 

To make a trade for Tejada so that Neifi doesn't play as much would be masking the real problem. Dusty. A real bad masking job, IMO.

[CuseCubFan69]

Color me insane because you forgot to add a pitcher that may come over in a trade or signed as a free agent. I also look at it as not having Perez in the lineup nearly as much especially if Walker is still on the team.

 

Can they afford a pitcher after taking on Tejada? I don't think so.

 

With Dusty and Neifi on the same team, I wouldn't count on Neifi sitting all that much.

 

To make a trade for Tejada so that Neifi doesn't play as much would be masking the real problem. Dusty. A real bad masking job, IMO.

 

I agree that Baker just makes any improvement moot. Personally, I'd like to see the Cubs stay young (Murton/Cedeno) lose a bunch of games and fire Baker hire a good manager and go to the playoffs. That's my big picture dream.

[CuseCubFan69]

Color me insane because you forgot to add a pitcher that may come over in a trade or signed as a free agent. I also look at it as not having Perez in the lineup nearly as much especially if Walker is still on the team.

 

They wouldn't be getting a pitcher worthwhile of being in the discussion.

 

Bederd wouldn't be a bad replacement.

[goonys evil twin]

Color me insane because you forgot to add a pitcher that may come over in a trade or signed as a free agent. I also look at it as not having Perez in the lineup nearly as much especially if Walker is still on the team.

 

They wouldn't be getting a pitcher worthwhile of being in the discussion.

 

Bederd wouldn't be a bad replacement.

 

He would be for Prior. He's no more reliable than Williams for Hill. He's the oldest guy in the discussion and is no more accomplished than the others.

[CuseCubFan69]

Color me insane because you forgot to add a pitcher that may come over in a trade or signed as a free agent. I also look at it as not having Perez in the lineup nearly as much especially if Walker is still on the team.

 

They wouldn't be getting a pitcher worthwhile of being in the discussion.

 

Bederd wouldn't be a bad replacement.

 

He would be for Prior. He's no more reliable than Williams for Hill. He's the oldest guy in the discussion and is no more accomplished than the others.

 

You still have to factor him in there though as part of a possible package.

[dacheezwhiz]

what if we made the trade for gonzo then we could add murton in to the tejada deal and mayb enot have to give up prior.

 

Pierre

Walker(if only...)

Lee

Ramirez

Tejada

Gonzo

Barrett

Jones

 

That would be more than serviceable especialyy if your rotation has the potential our's does

[dacheezwhiz]

Color me insane because you forgot to add a pitcher that may come over in a trade or signed as a free agent. I also look at it as not having Perez in the lineup nearly as much especially if Walker is still on the team.

 

They wouldn't be getting a pitcher worthwhile of being in the discussion.

 

Bederd wouldn't be a bad replacement.

 

He would be for Prior. He's no more reliable than Williams for Hill. He's the oldest guy in the discussion and is no more accomplished than the others.

 

Well actually aren't bedard and hill both 26 and bedard has had far more time in ht eleague and has shown much upside in the majors

[goonys evil twin]

Well actually aren't bedard and hill both 26 and bedard has had far more time in ht eleague and has shown much upside in the majors

 

They are a full year apart. Bedard has more major league time than Hill, but in that time he's been no more impressive than Williams.

[CubfaninCA]

Nice addition. Can platoon Murton w/ Jones and Murton can give Gonzo some days off as well. He'll get plenty of AB's.