Bull
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The Cubs have Fontenant (sp) at Iowa though and he would be a decent backup. They can have Fontenot back. We'll throw in Ray Fontenot in a package deal for a bucket, sans balls. Hell, I'll settle for a bucket to be named later. Variation on a theme. High comedy. I love this place.
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I might give up Cedeno, but not Cedeno AND Hill AND oh-by-the-way Pie. I think that's why Pie is the sticking point. Of course I'm reading into it.
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I think I was the source of the confusion. My Prior reference was to previous rumors. I don't include Prior, and I don't include Pie unless Neifi is in the package. I certainly don't do both. My guess is Kaplan's reference to Pie being the hangup is in a Prior, Pie, Cedeno for Tejada + Bedard still. No Way. Neifi, Pie, Prospects for Tejada I do. Cedeno, Pie, Hill, prospects for Tejada I don't. I guess I just don't wan't Tejada that bad.
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Southside? SOUTHSIDE?!? Blasphemy!
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This is so Cub-like. They can have Tejada, but they don't want to give up Pie. Why not? So he can be the next can't-miss-Corey-Patterson? No matter how much we can sit here and say Pie is any different, we all thought Patterson was the next great thing when he was coming up. There is no guarantee that Pie will ever amount to All-Star level talent, so you have to make the deal. Sorry, if this is the case I agree. No Prior, No Pie. Wait a little, Baltimore will get desperate. If not, start Cedeno and Walker. NO pressure on the cubs to make it happen.
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Wasn't it great when we thought our favorite Cubs were the best. Ignorance was bliss. Stupid numbers are the cause of my misery.
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Manny: I'm staying in Boston
Bull replied to kroth1342's topic in MLB Draft, International Signings, Amateur Baseball
Perhaps Manny should have your login name -
Personally, I believe that clutch exists, but that MLB hitters operate at such a high mental state that there is very little margin for improvement for most of them, and therefore virtually no possibility for clutch hitting. given that, I consider anti-clutch as proof of clutch. (in other words, it has a smaller impact on hitting in the majors than other levels) Very interesting take; I like it. In essence ALL major leaguers are good under pressure or they would have been weeded in the minors or their rookie year. No situation is more pressurized than your debut. Perhap clutch stats would be valuable in evaluating prospects...except you don't know if they're facing quality prospects or carrreer minors guys. Alas, the world may never know. *sigh*
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No, I'm arguing from the team's point of view. You give yourself the opportunity to avoid his first year of free agency by guaranteeing him more up front. It's give and take. I'd love to offer just 3/15. But he's not going to sign that. He might not even take a 3/27-30, because in that time period he could earn more than 27-30 by going one year at a time. And he might not want to give the team that one year option because in 3 years he might expect to sign a 5 year deal that averages $15m per year. so on some level we almost agree. Its okay, it doesn't hurt to agree. Honest :wink:
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I'd try and sign him for around 3/27-30 with a 4th year team option around $14-15m (which could easily be a bargain for the team by then) and maybe $1-2m buyout. Too much. He's arb eligible, not a Free Agent. Ozwalt Got 2 years/16.9 last year. 3/25 is top dollar for arb. eligible pitchers and I think Prior would ask for and get 5 in arb. 3/25 is generous at this stage in his carreer. He could get 5 easily this year, 8-10 by next year, and 10+ the third year of arbitration. You give him a little more now so that he'll put off his first year of free agency. Sounds like you're arguing the agent side and I the team side. I think that given his performance the team will persue him for three near what I outlined, and being unimpressed with that, and knowing his potential, Prior will try to sign a one year deal at around 5.
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As I understand it, James is saying that due to the small sample size of 'clutch' at-bats per year and the high amount of luck involved in every at-bat, it is impossible to compare yearly 'clutch' numbers - there is too much luck involved. Exactly, there's way too much variation for performance in 'clutch' situations to be predictive or more than an afterthought in player evaluation. That's not what he's saying at all. He's saying that all studies to date have failed to prove "clutch" AND have failed to disprove it. James believes the methods used to determine if clutch exists were flawed. He seems open to the idea that someday there may be a study that proves clutch, but the right metric has yet to be discovered. Sorry, I was referring to noisesquared's comment below the quote, I had already read the article previously. Maybe I should have responded to noisesquared and not you. But my point is that James is not saying that study has disproved clutch, or that there's too small a sample size. He's saying it HAS NOT been disproven, and that there is not yet a metric to measure it. In essence -stretch- he's saying its an intangible.
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I'd try and sign him for around 3/27-30 with a 4th year team option around $14-15m (which could easily be a bargain for the team by then) and maybe $1-2m buyout. Too much. He's arb eligible, not a Free Agent. Ozwalt Got 2 years/16.9 last year. 3/25 is top dollar for arb. eligible pitchers and I think Prior would ask for and get 5 in arb. 3/25 is generous at this stage in his carreer.
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As I understand it, James is saying that due to the small sample size of 'clutch' at-bats per year and the high amount of luck involved in every at-bat, it is impossible to compare yearly 'clutch' numbers - there is too much luck involved. Exactly, there's way too much variation for performance in 'clutch' situations to be predictive or more than an afterthought in player evaluation. That's not what he's saying at all. He's saying that all studies to date have failed to prove "clutch" AND have failed to disprove it. James believes the methods used to determine if clutch exists were flawed. He seems open to the idea that someday there may be a study that proves clutch, but the right metric has yet to be discovered.
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link plz. Probably found their info in Hoops' thread.
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wilson signs with houston
Bull replied to stitchface's topic in MLB Draft, International Signings, Amateur Baseball
Agreed. I think we are distingusihing the contract Jones got from the one Wilson has apparently recieved. Regardless of money (and years for that matter) I like Jones over Wilson. Jones has at least some upside. I wouldn't wan't Wilson in my outfield next year if he signed for a nickel. -
wilson signs with houston
Bull replied to stitchface's topic in MLB Draft, International Signings, Amateur Baseball
If I recall correctly, Wilson and Encarnacion have been the "worst case" around here. We can't have it both ways. -
I can't take one more reference to Andy Sisco. :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
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Grissom signs with the Cubs.........
Bull replied to Bgbird68's topic in MLB Draft, International Signings, Amateur Baseball
Yeah, and his last good year against lefties was 2004. The last time before that was 2003. The last time before that was 2002... and so on. His last good year was '96? . how was 96 good (.838 ops) and 2002 (.831) not good? I always thought an .831 ops for a CFer was pretty good (2002) .790 in 03 and .794 in 04. League average in 2004 was .752. Good enough for a fourth OFer in my book. Add in the facts that his splits against lefties are even better, I don't think its terrible that they signed him to a minor league contract. -
Exactly. The most credible people are the dorm room GMs with the most time and the most posts. Your fault for not realizing that. If by credible you mean recognizable and memorable, then, yeah, the people who post often are memorable for what they say (whether accurate or inaccurate) There was this guy over at cubs.com named Tom27... oh skip it.
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What about those who used half their last name?
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brionch you know you're my boy, but how .950 OPS right-fielders were available this offseason? There were only 3 .950+ OPS outfielders in all of baseball last year. Brian Giles wasn't one of them. Manny, Bay, Guererro. Unless your suggesting the Cubs trade Prior for Manny. (don't do it...I got eyerolled off the board for suggesting it would be better than Tejada for Prior---still not good, but better.) Tejada at .865 is nothing to sneeze at. You were (we all were) spoiled by good Sammy into thinking that 1.100 OPS should be expected from your RF. I still don't give up Prior for Tejada. No eyerolling here MrWood, you are right on. This is what we pay Dusy for. To control uncontrollable players. Everyone was on the Bradley bandWGN. Manny is MUCH MUCH MUCH better than Bradley. Again, just look at his numbers. They speak for themselves. Difference: Bradley wouldn't have cost you Prior. I'm not suggesting trade Prior for Manny, just that its better than Prior for Tejada.
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I was looking at it the other way. The study shows what a worthless (read: luck related/teammate dependant) stat ERA is. For relievers, at least. True. Much better for starters. They finish 90+% of their innings. And if they ARE pulled in the middle of an inning (especially in th e NL) its their own darn fault, and I hope their runners DO score!
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brionch you know you're my boy, but how .950 OPS right-fielders were available this offseason? There were only 3 .950+ OPS outfielders in all of baseball last year. Brian Giles wasn't one of them. Manny, Bay, Guererro. Unless your suggesting the Cubs trade Prior for Manny. (don't do it...I got eyerolled off the board for suggesting it would be better than Tejada for Prior---still not good, but better.) Tejada at .865 is nothing to sneeze at. You were (we all were) spoiled by good Sammy into thinking that 1.100 OPS should be expected from your RF. I still don't give up Prior for Tejada.
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I was looking at it the other way. The study shows what a worthless (read: luck related/teammate dependant) stat ERA is.
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No. I hope not, but i think so... sadly, yes.