Cedeno's Future

[UBlink]

For what it's worth, I've noticed that Cedeno is playing shortstop (exclusively so far) in Venezuela winter ball, even though the speculation on this board has been that he would be working at 2nd base, anticipating a Furcal signing. Could having him play shortstop indicate that the Cubs are wanting to increase his trade value more than prepare him to play 2nd?

[Brian]

Maybe Cedeno will take over at Short for Alex Gonzalez in Florida in the rumored Juan Pierre trade? With Florida just wanting to dump the $$$, I don't think it would take more than Ronny, maybe a throw away prospect.

[MeatampPotatoesMan]

Supposedly he is going to play both positions. Depending on what happens with Furcal/Nomar/Walker, he could be playing SS instead of 2B.

[Backtobanks]

I questioned that after the Perez signing. With all of these middle infielders (Walker, Perez, Cedeno, Hairston, and rumors of going after Furcal), I would think 2 are leaving. Assuming Walker is leaving and Hairston's ability to back up CF, that leaves Cedeno or Perez to go someplace.

[YearofDaCubs]

I questioned that after the Perez signing. With all of these middle infielders (Walker, Perez, Cedeno, Hairston, and rumors of going after Furcal), I would think 2 are leaving. Assuming Walker is leaving and Hairston's ability to back up CF, that leaves Cedeno or Perez to go someplace.

Perez isnt going anywhere and that bugs me. Why else would we sign him to a 2 year contract. I'm really worried that this offseason is going to be a huge dissapointment.

[USSoccer]

If they are going to move Ronny, this would be the offseason to do it. His value is as high as it'll get.

[MeatampPotatoesMan]

If they are going to move Ronny, this would be the offseason to do it. His value is as high as it'll get.

 

Sweet, Neifi's going to get 600 ABs this year!

[USSoccer]

If they are going to move Ronny, this would be the offseason to do it. His value is as high as it'll get.

 

Sweet, Neifi's going to get 600 ABs this year!

 

We might keep Hairston, that brings it down to about 400 AB's. :P

[MeatampPotatoesMan]

If they are going to move Ronny, this would be the offseason to do it. His value is as high as it'll get.

 

Sweet, Neifi's going to get 600 ABs this year!

 

We might keep Hairston, that brings it down to about 400 AB's. :P

 

a ray of hope.

[frostwyrm]

Furcal with a 4 year deal and Neifi signed through 2007 means Cedeno would be blocked until 2008. If we get Furcal it would be foolish not to trade Cedeno now, while his value is high, since 2 years on the bench certainly wouldn't increase his value, and who wants to wait til 2008 to see what he could do as a starter? I don't.

[TheDude]

Right now it is very difficult to predict the future of the middle infield for the Cubs. There are up to 5 players capable of playing 2B, and 3 capable of playing SS if you assume Furcal is a Cub.

 

One would have to think 2/5 are chips to be bring other parts in, and neither Furcal nor Perez would be trade chips.

 

Therefore I am guessing that 2 of Cedeno, Walker, and Hairston get dealt. I believe however that Cedeno is the one of the three that is kept, because Walker has high trade value for a young team like Cleveland or Minnesota, and Hairston isn't known to be a Dusty favorite. Meanwhile, both Hendry and Dusty speak highly of Cedeno.

[TheDude]

Furcal with a 4 year deal and Neifi signed through 2007 means Cedeno would be blocked until 2008. If we get Furcal it would be foolish not to trade Cedeno now, while his value is high, since 2 years on the bench certainly wouldn't increase his value, and who wants to wait til 2008 to see what he could do as a starter? I don't.

 

Cedeno starts over Perez according to Hendry. You can continue to espouse this belief that he won't if you like, but it gets tiring to see that you state it as fact everytime the topic emerges.

 

The fact is the GM promotes Cedeno as starting and Perez signed as a back-up super-sub for 2B, SS, and even 3B. Perez likely gets a lot of PT of the bench in that super-sub role under Dusty.

[frostwyrm]

Cedeno starts over Perez according to Hendry. You can continue to espouse this belief that he won't if you like, but it gets tiring to see that you state it as fact everytime the topic emerges.

 

Hendry says a lot of BS for public consumption. He said Sosa would our right fielder for 2005 and talked up Dubois as a Rookie of the Year candidate when Dusty had planned all along to use him as nothing more than a bench player. If we get Furcal and Cedeno still actually starts at 2B it will represent a complete departure from everything we've seen from Dusty in the past.

[Lefty]

Furcal with a 4 year deal and Neifi signed through 2007 means Cedeno would be blocked until 2008. If we get Furcal it would be foolish not to trade Cedeno now, while his value is high, since 2 years on the bench certainly wouldn't increase his value, and who wants to wait til 2008 to see what he could do as a starter? I don't.

 

Cedeno starts over Perez according to Hendry. You can continue to espouse this belief that he won't if you like, but it gets tiring to see that you state it as fact everytime the topic emerges.

 

The fact is the GM promotes Cedeno as starting and Perez signed as a back-up super-sub for 2B, SS, and even 3B. Perez likely gets a lot of PT of the bench in that super-sub role under Dusty.

 

Last year Hendry promoted the idea of DuBois starting in Left. That lasted until Baker got to fill out the Opening Day lineup.

[TheDude]

Furcal with a 4 year deal and Neifi signed through 2007 means Cedeno would be blocked until 2008. If we get Furcal it would be foolish not to trade Cedeno now, while his value is high, since 2 years on the bench certainly wouldn't increase his value, and who wants to wait til 2008 to see what he could do as a starter? I don't.

 

Cedeno starts over Perez according to Hendry. You can continue to espouse this belief that he won't if you like, but it gets tiring to see that you state it as fact everytime the topic emerges.

 

The fact is the GM promotes Cedeno as starting and Perez signed as a back-up super-sub for 2B, SS, and even 3B. Perez likely gets a lot of PT of the bench in that super-sub role under Dusty.

 

Last year Hendry promoted the idea of DuBois starting in Left. That lasted until Baker got to fill out the Opening Day lineup.

 

Dubois had a respectable shot. In April and May he had 93 at bats (Hollandsworth had 104) and he struck out 33 times with only modest power numbers. It's not like Hollandsworth was any better during those months...neither one of them stepped-up and claimed the job. In June Hollandsworth got hot, and that was it for Dubois.

 

It's true that Dubois didn't start the season as the everyday LF, but then I don't recall that he was handed the job as confidently as with Cedeno.

[UBlink]

Furcal with a 4 year deal and Neifi signed through 2007 means Cedeno would be blocked until 2008. If we get Furcal it would be foolish not to trade Cedeno now, while his value is high, since 2 years on the bench certainly wouldn't increase his value, and who wants to wait til 2008 to see what he could do as a starter? I don't.

 

Cedeno starts over Perez according to Hendry. You can continue to espouse this belief that he won't if you like, but it gets tiring to see that you state it as fact everytime the topic emerges.

 

The fact is the GM promotes Cedeno as starting and Perez signed as a back-up super-sub for 2B, SS, and even 3B. Perez likely gets a lot of PT of the bench in that super-sub role under Dusty.

 

Last year Hendry promoted the idea of DuBois starting in Left. That lasted until Baker got to fill out the Opening Day lineup.

 

Dubois had a respectable shot. In April and May he had 93 at bats (Hollandsworth had 104) and he struck out 33 times with only modest power numbers. It's not like Hollandsworth was any better during those months...neither one of them stepped-up and claimed the job. In June Hollandsworth got hot, and that was it for Dubois.

 

It's true that Dubois didn't start the season as the everyday LF, but then I don't recall that he was handed the job as confidently as with Cedeno.

 

As I recall Hendry made some noises about him starting when Hollandsworth was signed - that he was going to get a shot at being more than a bench player.

[NewUserName]

Dubois had modest power numbers? He didnt preform very well in other areas but had 12 doubles and 7 HRs in 142 ABs for the Cubs. That would translate to about 40 and 25 in full time duty. Probably close to ROY status. I also would be inclined to say he would have hit better if given more of an opportunity.

 

Hendry can say what he wants but so far with the Cubs Dusty has given the veteran more chances than the youngster. Karros over Choi, Hollandworht over Dubois and Perez over Cedeno last year. I said it before and I will say it again it is inNieffable that Neifi gets 400ABs at 2b

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Hendry can say what he wants but so far with the Cubs Dusty has given the veteran more chances than the youngster. Karros over Choi, Hollandworht over Dubois and Perez over Cedeno last year. I said it before and I will say it again it is inNieffable that Neifi gets 400ABs at 2b

 

I'm not defending his decisions to play the vets, but Karros over Choi was a pretty bad example. Karros was having a career year and Choi was slumping something horrible. Karros deserved to get the bulk of the playing time.

[BigbadB]

Career year? I think not. Karros didn't have anything close to resembling a career year.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Career year? I think not. Karros didn't have anything close to resembling a career year.

 

A career 268/325 guy who went 286/340 with back problems!?!?!? I think so.

[MeatampPotatoesMan]

Career year? I think not. Karros didn't have anything close to resembling a career year.

 

it was actually a pretty good year for Karros (best year since 1999).

 

he probably only had 3 years that were better (BA/OBP/SLG): 1998, 1999, and 1995.

 

In 2003:

Karros .286/.340/.446/.786 (336 AB)

Choi .218/.350/.421/.771 (202 AB)

[frostwyrm]

Career year? I think not. Karros didn't have anything close to resembling a career year.

 

A career 268/325 guy who went 286/340 with back problems!?!?!? I think so.

 

Karros only had decent numbers when Dusty could match him up vs. lefties and crappy righties. When Karros had to play every day his utter inability to hit any semi-competent RH pitching was exposed and his numbers plummeted. The Karros we saw was a slow runner, a below average defender, could only play 1B, had well below average power for his position, and could only hit LH pitching. If that was his career year that's a pretty sad commentary on his career.

Edited November 10, 2005 by frostwyrm

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Karros only had decent numbers when Dusty could match him up vs. lefties and crappy righties. When Karros had to play every day his utter inability any semi-competent RH pitching was exposed and his numbers plummeted. The Karros we saw was a slow runner, a below average defender, could only play 1B, had well below average power for his position, and could only hit LH pitching. If that was his career year that's a pretty sad commentary on his career.

 

How the heck did this turn out to be a commentary on his career? All I pointed out was that in this case, Dusty was right to play the veteran. I'm not campaigning for him to go into the Hall for crying out loud. The Karros we saw was all of the things you point out above, but more importantly, he was a better option than Choi.

[BigbadB]

Career year? I think not. Karros didn't have anything close to resembling a career year.

 

A career 268/325 guy who went 286/340 with back problems!?!?!? I think so.

 

Karros only had decent numbers when Dusty could match him up vs. lefties and crappy righties. When Karros had to play every day his utter inability any semi-competent RH pitching was exposed and his numbers plummeted. The Karros we saw was a slow runner, a below average defender, could only play 1B, had well below average power for his position, and could only hit LH pitching. If that was his career year that's a pretty sad commentary on his career.

 

How dare you forget that Karros hit into 14 double plays in a half a season's worth of at bats.

 

Didn't mean to hijack the thread, just wanted to point out that Karros did not have a career year in 2003. It also wasn't a career year based on how he did in the 2 previous years. He was injured those years, playing with a Bagwell-like bad shoulder.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Karros only had decent numbers when Dusty could match him up vs. lefties and crappy righties. When Karros had to play every day his utter inability any semi-competent RH pitching was exposed and his numbers plummeted. The Karros we saw was a slow runner, a below average defender, could only play 1B, had well below average power for his position, and could only hit LH pitching. If that was his career year that's a pretty sad commentary on his career.

 

How the heck did this turn out to be a commentary on his career? All I pointed out was that in this case, Dusty was right to play the veteran. I'm not campaigning for him to go into the Hall for crying out loud. The Karros we saw was all of the things you point out above, but more importantly, he was a better option than Choi.

 

Karros v. RHP in '03

 

.246/.286/.397/.683 in 237 PA's