8/31 Dodgers (Lowe) vs. Cubs (Rusch), 1:20pm WGN

[johnnyba99]

Nobody find 3ip excessive for Wuertz especially considering we have a 12 man pitching staff?

he probably won't pitch again for 10-12 days, so it shouldn't be a big deal.

[CuseCubFan69]

JVB 92 is the top speed, curve 77 slider 89

[Knightlife_in_Lubbock]

Chan Ho Park:

 

 

C. Park  1.1 0 0 0 0 1 0       era [b]6.66 [/b]

[Outshined_One]

JVB 92 is the top speed, curve 77 slider 89

 

Also the second most entertaining pitcher on the staff to watch while on the mound. He's animated and has some crazy deliveries.

[neely crenshaw]

luckily i have time to check stats!lol

 

neifi 459 at bats

hairston 318

 

50 runs neifi 42 from hairston

.304 obp neifi

.338 for hairston

 

.397 slugging neifi

.384 hairston

 

6 stolen bases for neifi

8 for hairston

 

the only stat really in hairston favor is obp. which over the course of a season would translate to being on base about one more time every 2 weeks....

[CuseCubFan69]

JVB 92 is the top speed, curve 77 slider 89

 

Also the second most entertaining pitcher on the staff to watch while on the mound. He's animated and has some crazy deliveries.

 

He does more 360's than Dominique Wilkens!

[Tracer Bullet]

a liitle fodder to keep our minds off dlee.

neifi(our savior) .279 9hr 47 rbi

hairston .267 4 hr 26 rbi

burnitz .269 21hr 70 rbi(hitting 4-5-6) all year.

sadly, neifi has been better than hairston and comparable to burnitz...

it's really an indictment of hairston,burnitz,patterson,holla, lawton, gerut, nomar,dusty(for not playing cedeno,dubois,murton..etc) and hendry( for thinking this was a good lineup)

 

Actually, I don't think that's true. Neifi has 10 points of average and more homers and RBI than Hairston (in 150 or so more ABs). But for much of the year Neifi was asked to be a top of the order guy and he has a .300 OBP (compared to JHJr.'s .338). The 10 or so extra points in SLG are easily outweighed by Jerry's near 40 point advantage in OBP.

 

And Neifi isn't comparable to Burny either. Again, a 10 point lead in AVG is easily outweighed by the 25 point advantage Burny enjoys in OBP. Add in the 70 or so points of SLG and the homers and RBI and Burny has been better.

 

By no means have Burny or Hairston been "great" (or even good), but I don't think it's fair to say that Neifi has been better than either. Neifi is what he is - a solid utility player that would be a good backup infielder. The fact that Dusty has wildly misused him this year should not be held against him. But let's not let Pat & Ron's unfounded love for Neifi outweigh the facts. Neifi, over the whole season, has not been a good offensive player for the Cubs.

[neely crenshaw]

a liitle fodder to keep our minds off dlee.

neifi(our savior) .279 9hr 47 rbi

hairston .267 4 hr 26 rbi

burnitz .269 21hr 70 rbi(hitting 4-5-6) all year.

sadly, neifi has been better than hairston and comparable to burnitz...

it's really an indictment of hairston,burnitz,patterson,holla, lawton, gerut, nomar,dusty(for not playing cedeno,dubois,murton..etc) and hendry( for thinking this was a good lineup)

What is neifis OBP compared to Hairston? How many ABs has Neifi had compared to Hairston. How many SBs? Runs? SOrry, I dont buy that Perez has been better.

 

Even being a little better than Perez shouldn't be considered a compliment for anyone. The problem is Hairston, Perez and Macias are all too similar to be on the same team.

 

not to mention in the same starting lineup!

[YearofDaCubs]

luckily i have time to check stats!lol

 

neifi 459 at bats

hairston 318

 

50 runs neifi 42 from hairston

.304 obp neifi

.338 for hairston

 

.397 slugging neifi

.384 hairston

 

6 stolen bases for neifi

8 for hairston

 

the only stat really in hairston favor is obp. which over the course of a season would translate to being on base about one more time every 2 weeks....

I expected them to be better. Pretty crappy actually.

[CuseCubFan69]

Nice hustle by Perez on the grounder.

[sweetpeteman]

Charlie Steiner rules.

 

Follow me, Follow me to freedom!

[neely crenshaw]

a liitle fodder to keep our minds off dlee.

neifi(our savior) .279 9hr 47 rbi

hairston .267 4 hr 26 rbi

burnitz .269 21hr 70 rbi(hitting 4-5-6) all year.

sadly, neifi has been better than hairston and comparable to burnitz...

it's really an indictment of hairston,burnitz,patterson,holla, lawton, gerut, nomar,dusty(for not playing cedeno,dubois,murton..etc) and hendry( for thinking this was a good lineup)

 

Actually, I don't think that's true. Neifi has 10 points of average and more homers and RBI than Hairston (in 150 or so more ABs). But for much of the year Neifi was asked to be a top of the order guy and he has a .300 OBP (compared to JHJr.'s .338). The 10 or so extra points in SLG are easily outweighed by Jerry's near 40 point advantage in OBP.

 

And Neifi isn't comparable to Burny either. Again, a 10 point lead in AVG is easily outweighed by the 25 point advantage Burny enjoys in OBP. Add in the 70 or so points of SLG and the homers and RBI and Burny has been better.

 

By no means have Burny or Hairston been "great" (or even good), but I don't think it's fair to say that Neifi has been better than either. Neifi is what he is - a solid utility player that would be a good backup infielder. The fact that Dusty has wildly misused him this year should not be held against him. But let's not let Pat & Ron's unfounded love for Neifi outweigh the facts. Neifi, over the whole season, has not been a good offensive player for the Cubs.

 

the problem is for these cubs no one outside of lee and aram have been good. barrett has been for a catcher but that does not make him good overall!

[goonys evil twin]

ok burnitz was a stretch but neifi has outhit him most of the year and burnitz is by no means good. hairston...i don't think so, he is a better player but not this season.

 

What does that mean Neifi has outhit him most of the year? Burnitz has been better than Neifi all year.

[cubweiser03]

JVB 92 is the top speed, curve 77 slider 89

 

Also the second most entertaining pitcher on the staff to watch while on the mound. He's animated and has some crazy deliveries.

 

He does more 360's than Dominique Wilkens!

 

I havent seen him pitch yet. i saw some clips of him warming up yesterday and i was like what is he doing. he looked real hyper.

[neely crenshaw]

ok burnitz was a stretch but neifi has outhit him most of the year and burnitz is by no means good. hairston...i don't think so, he is a better player but not this season.

 

What does that mean Neifi has outhit him most of the year? Burnitz has been better than Neifi all year.

 

neifi has a better batting average than burnitz for most parts of the season and overall.

[Tracer Bullet]

a liitle fodder to keep our minds off dlee.

neifi(our savior) .279 9hr 47 rbi

hairston .267 4 hr 26 rbi

burnitz .269 21hr 70 rbi(hitting 4-5-6) all year.

sadly, neifi has been better than hairston and comparable to burnitz...

it's really an indictment of hairston,burnitz,patterson,holla, lawton, gerut, nomar,dusty(for not playing cedeno,dubois,murton..etc) and hendry( for thinking this was a good lineup)

 

Actually, I don't think that's true. Neifi has 10 points of average and more homers and RBI than Hairston (in 150 or so more ABs). But for much of the year Neifi was asked to be a top of the order guy and he has a .300 OBP (compared to JHJr.'s .338). The 10 or so extra points in SLG are easily outweighed by Jerry's near 40 point advantage in OBP.

 

And Neifi isn't comparable to Burny either. Again, a 10 point lead in AVG is easily outweighed by the 25 point advantage Burny enjoys in OBP. Add in the 70 or so points of SLG and the homers and RBI and Burny has been better.

 

By no means have Burny or Hairston been "great" (or even good), but I don't think it's fair to say that Neifi has been better than either. Neifi is what he is - a solid utility player that would be a good backup infielder. The fact that Dusty has wildly misused him this year should not be held against him. But let's not let Pat & Ron's unfounded love for Neifi outweigh the facts. Neifi, over the whole season, has not been a good offensive player for the Cubs.

 

the problem is for these cubs no one outside of lee and aram have been good. barrett has been for a catcher but that does not make him good overall!

 

I don't disagree that this is a "worse of 2 (or 3) evils" issue. I'm just disputing your claim that Neifi has been better than Hairston and comparable to Burnitz.

[CuseCubFan69]

Jermaine O'Neal...wow.

[Tracer Bullet]

ok burnitz was a stretch but neifi has outhit him most of the year and burnitz is by no means good. hairston...i don't think so, he is a better player but not this season.

 

What does that mean Neifi has outhit him most of the year? Burnitz has been better than Neifi all year.

 

neifi has a better batting average than burnitz for most parts of the season and overall.

 

True, Neifi has had a higher AVG, but there's a lot more that goes into being a hitter than AVG. Burnitz has a better OBP and a far better SLG than Neifi. You really believe that the 10 point advantage in AVG makes up for the 100 point disadvantage in OPS?

[Jon]

I like JVB's changeup. He uses the same crazy motion as he does with his fastball. His curve is okay but his delivery allows the batters to see the ball before it even leaves his hand. So when he hangs it, opposing batters can easily watch it all the way to the plate.

 

As for Williamson, he's not 100% yet and has a relatively cheap option for next season. I don't see any reason for Hendry not to pick it up.

[brfahey]

Is it illegal to criticize patterson on these boards now? So much time is spent criticizing Neifi (appropriately, to a degree) without a mention of Patterson. That is dumbfounding.

[neely crenshaw]

i think the stats certainly bare out that neifi to this point has been better than hairston. save for obp it's in neifi's favor or a wash. hairston is a better player but as of this point he has not out produced neifi. not that neifi has been good. like i said burnitz is a stretch but in the scheme of things burnitz is a 4-5 hitter with a little pop that has barely outproduced neifi. yes, he has 21 homers....neifi couldn't hit 21 homers in slowpitch softball. but for where he hit in the lineup the difference in rbi's is shockingly small especially for a guy who has played in almost every game!he has 23 more RIBS...it's tough to say but if neifi hit 4-5-6(scary) with his .279 avg he would be very close to 70 rbi, particularly if he started nearly every game(again scary)

[neely crenshaw]

ok burnitz was a stretch but neifi has outhit him most of the year and burnitz is by no means good. hairston...i don't think so, he is a better player but not this season.

 

What does that mean Neifi has outhit him most of the year? Burnitz has been better than Neifi all year.

 

neifi has a better batting average than burnitz for most parts of the season and overall.

 

True, Neifi has had a higher AVG, but there's a lot more that goes into being a hitter than AVG. Burnitz has a better OBP and a far better SLG than Neifi. You really believe that the 10 point advantage in AVG makes up for the 100 point disadvantage in OPS?

very true but i did not say neifi was a better hitter, i said he outhit him. which usually refers to batting average like when you say "who is leading the league in hitting?" you mean batting average not best all round hitter...

just a misunderstanding

Edited August 31, 2005 by neely crenshaw

[goonys evil twin]

ok burnitz was a stretch but neifi has outhit him most of the year and burnitz is by no means good. hairston...i don't think so, he is a better player but not this season.

 

What does that mean Neifi has outhit him most of the year? Burnitz has been better than Neifi all year.

 

neifi has a better batting average than burnitz for most parts of the season and overall.

 

Who cares. Batting average doesn't mean he's better. Alex Sanchez has a better batting average than Alex Rodriguez, but nobody would say he's better than ARod.

 

Neifi has sucked, there's no point in trying to make him look better than he's been. Hairston, Burnitz, Walker, Barrett, Aramis and Lee have all been better.

[goonys evil twin]

i think the stats certainly bare out that neifi to this point has been better than hairston. save for obp it's in neifi's favor or a wash.

 

Save for OBP? OBP is meaningful, it overrides the avg difference, and SLG is a wash, basically non-existent. Neifi has played a lot more than Hairston, and used differently, which explains the difference in counting stats. Throw-in Neifi's inexcusable 17 GIDPs (compared to JH's 4) and there's no debate.

[neely crenshaw]

if you don't care why did you ask the question? i answered. i did not say he was great or didn't suck. i answered your question aboout what i meant by neifi outhit him...i meant he had a higher average. i did not say he was a better player or that he was more valuable just a had a better average.