How would you improve the Cub defense?

[RynoRules]

I think that TC3's point here is that the current Cubs seemingly do not put the so-called "fundamentals" first, most importantly, defense and "contact-hitting". And when I say defense, I mean hitting the cutoff man with a good, accurate throw; cutting balls off in the gap; etc.

[KatJ]

Personally, I think we can do far, far worse than Hairston and Cedeno up the middle, and let's face it, the rest of the IF is set and IMO set pretty well. TWalk is a gritty player, but he runs off his mouth too much. Granted, Gracie did too, but he could walk the talk on offense and D.

 

I really want Johnny Damon at CF - he has the glove and the bat and can do leadoff. I honestly don't know what to do with Patterson - perhaps he should be shipped off like the other Cub problem children who never turned things around. (Sure, he may be great with another team, but if he runs hot and cold as a Cub, it's a distraction to the ballclub.) If we keep him, I say he patrols RF and Burnitz goes. I'd REALLY like to see what Murton can do in LF, but I'm undecided about Pie. I'd really hate to have him called up while we still have that toothpick-chomping lunatic in the dugout to mess with his head. If it weren't for being jerked around and that injury in '03, I think I wouldn't be breathing a word about dealing CPatt. Hate to see the same thing happen to Pie.

[Backtobanks]

I want to see Cedeno starting at SS, Walker let go and Hairston starting at 2B. Damon patrolling CF, Pie will probably be starting in RF and I don't know about LF and Murton. I'm not sure if he will be the everyday man next year or if they will get someone else... Barrett and Aramis are obviously going nowhere though.

 

I doubt the Cubs have much of a shot @ Damon. With the Yankees needing a cf, they'll probably offer him a long term deal. I can't see the Cubs offering Damon more than 4 years.

I'd be cool w/ giving Patterson more time to prove himself in cf. The guy has tons of talent, and could turn out to be an Andruw Jones type. However, if they can trade him for a starter or a hitter that's fine too. As for Pie, it doesn't sound like he'll be quite ready.

 

Ideally, I'd like to see the Cubs get a major upgrade in rf and a defensive upgrade @ either 2b or SS.

 

There is no way that the Cubs would offer Damon 4 years let alone more than 4 years. I think the Cubs would be hard-pressed to offer Damon 3 years since Pie will be ready by 2007 at the latest.

[TC3_Hinrich12]

If we want to shape the team differently, we should get some corner outfielders that can hit and not trade away our players that are good. That would mean keeping Todd Walker because he is the 3rd best position player we have. I am fine with keeping Hairston as the utility guy but I don't believe that he will put up the type of numbers over the course of a season that warrants a starting position. I realize that he may be better defensively than Walker but the difference isn’t big enough to offset the offensive production that he brings. And, you can't just build a team by saying let's choose defense over offense even if the guys you let go are much better hitters.

 

I'm tired of watching this team get so many errors. I want to see this offense built around speed, situational hitting and defense, not just heavily depended on power which has translated to a lot of K's and terrible clutch hitting. I know Walker is capable of the hitting part, but I want to see the D part for once. Defense is very underated, with a bad defense, you will go nowhere. I don't think I said anything about trading our good players either. Of course I want Aramis, Lee and Barrett here. I know Ramirez doesn't fit into the "great defense" but we have to have his bat. Same with Barrett, but he can keep improving behing the plate. I'd like to see Blanco back though. And I wouldn't mind seeing Damon, Jacque Jones and Pie in the OF next year. Yes, Jacque Jones. He may still be a Twin next year but it would be great to get Jones. He may K a little more than 100 times but he can win a gold glove, is a great clutch hitter, pretty good power, can still hit over 270 and a team leader, not selfish, just does what he's asked and is a team guy. Jones still has good speed, but not base stealing speed. I think all that should translate into for once, not one of the worst clutch hitting teams and RISP hitting teams. Jones, Damon, Cedeno, Pie, Hairston and Lee, that's a lot of speed. I think we would see more runs.

 

How do you plan on getting a team that is a good "situational hitting" team, when "situational hitting" numbers vary wildly and ultimately end up around the player's career numbers?

 

Free agency, trades. In case you didn't see already I mentioned Damon and Jones. That's wisful thinking for me, 2 players I want the most.

 

You're missing the point. It's basically impossible to get a good "situational hitting" team, because there's almost no such thing as a good "situational hitter". The numbers for players in those situations vary from year to year, sometimes extremely. They aren't predictive.

 

That's not 100% true. Situational hitting=clutch hitting too. Are you saying it's always different clutch hitters every year? No, not true at all. Damon just hits, any situation, he is a hitter that will drive in runs when need be. Jacque Jones has had a history during his whole career being a clutch hitter, something the Cubs have 0 of. Believe me, I have seen a lot of Jones. I have been watching as many Twins games as possible and rooting for them for a long time now. But getting Jones is just a dream because he will probably be a Twin next year anyway.

 

Someone stated it well in an above post. Fundamentals and contact is basically what I want to see. A lot of that translates to "situational hitting" and not blowing games because of defense. This offense is depending on the homerun way too heavily and it has NOT worked at all. That kind of team translates to way way way too many K's, not great contact hitting, bad situational hitting and a lot of LOB's. LOB's has KILLED the Cubs this year. We have way too many guys that can break the K record.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

If we want to shape the team differently, we should get some corner outfielders that can hit and not trade away our players that are good. That would mean keeping Todd Walker because he is the 3rd best position player we have. I am fine with keeping Hairston as the utility guy but I don't believe that he will put up the type of numbers over the course of a season that warrants a starting position. I realize that he may be better defensively than Walker but the difference isn’t big enough to offset the offensive production that he brings. And, you can't just build a team by saying let's choose defense over offense even if the guys you let go are much better hitters.

 

I'm tired of watching this team get so many errors. I want to see this offense built around speed, situational hitting and defense, not just heavily depended on power which has translated to a lot of K's and terrible clutch hitting. I know Walker is capable of the hitting part, but I want to see the D part for once. Defense is very underated, with a bad defense, you will go nowhere. I don't think I said anything about trading our good players either. Of course I want Aramis, Lee and Barrett here. I know Ramirez doesn't fit into the "great defense" but we have to have his bat. Same with Barrett, but he can keep improving behing the plate. I'd like to see Blanco back though. And I wouldn't mind seeing Damon, Jacque Jones and Pie in the OF next year. Yes, Jacque Jones. He may still be a Twin next year but it would be great to get Jones. He may K a little more than 100 times but he can win a gold glove, is a great clutch hitter, pretty good power, can still hit over 270 and a team leader, not selfish, just does what he's asked and is a team guy. Jones still has good speed, but not base stealing speed. I think all that should translate into for once, not one of the worst clutch hitting teams and RISP hitting teams. Jones, Damon, Cedeno, Pie, Hairston and Lee, that's a lot of speed. I think we would see more runs.

 

How do you plan on getting a team that is a good "situational hitting" team, when "situational hitting" numbers vary wildly and ultimately end up around the player's career numbers?

 

Free agency, trades. In case you didn't see already I mentioned Damon and Jones. That's wisful thinking for me, 2 players I want the most.

 

You're missing the point. It's basically impossible to get a good "situational hitting" team, because there's almost no such thing as a good "situational hitter". The numbers for players in those situations vary from year to year, sometimes extremely. They aren't predictive.

 

That's not 100% true. Situational hitting=clutch hitting too. Are you saying it's always different clutch hitters every year? No, not true at all. Damon just hits, any situation, he is a hitter that will drive in runs when need be. Jacque Jones has had a history during his whole career being a clutch hitter, something the Cubs have 0 of. Believe me, I have seen a lot of Jones. I have been watching as many Twins games as possible and rooting for them for a long time now. But getting Jones is just a dream because he will probably be a Twin next year anyway.

 

Someone stated it well in an above post. Fundamentals and contact is basically what I want to see. A lot of that translates to "situational hitting" and not blowing games because of defense. This offense is depending on the homerun way too heavily and it has NOT worked at all. That kind of team translates to way way way too many K's, not great contact hitting, bad situational hitting and a lot of LOB's. LOB's has KILLED the Cubs this year. We have way too many guys that can break the K record.

 

Whatever situational or "clutch" situations you want to use, they aren't predictive, they vary too much. On the whole, situational numbers reflect career numbers. If you want to see a team that makes more contact, that's entirely another thing, although I'd still say that's not a goal you shoot for(if it happens, then fine). The fundamentals that someone stated are endemic of every major league baseball player. It would be ridiculous to sign a guy for his ability to hit a cut off man.

[TC3_Hinrich12]

So what do you suggest the Cubs do? We've seen my opinions and the players I'd like to see in a Cub uniform, how about you? This style of play, having your whole offense be based on HRs does not work. The Cubs have rode the horse as far as it can go with this style. It just doesn't get you to the playoffs. I think contact and "situational hitting" is a huge part of winning games. Having the most LOBs in the MLB, one of the worst RISP averages, leading the league in K's and no clutch hitting does not win you ball games.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

So what do you suggest the Cubs do? We've seen my opinions and the players I'd like to see in a Cub uniform, how about you? This style of play, having your whole offense be based on HRs does not work. The Cubs have rode the horse as far as it can go with this style. It just doesn't get you to the playoffs. I think contact and "situational hitting" is a huge part of winning games. Having the most LOBs in the MLB, one of the worst RISP averages, leading the league in K's and no clutch hitting does not win you ball games.

 

I'll post something in a little bit, gotta get a couple things done first. Just wanted to let you know it's coming.

 

EDIT: This offseason is a tough one. The Cubs have a lot of needs and there is a pretty thin Free Agent class. Of the Free Agents, I'd go aggressively after Giles, Milwood, and Ryan. Obviously you aren't going to get all 3, but Giles is the most coveted. However, he's the one most of all you don't want to overpay for, so there's a very thin line between aggressiveness and foolishness. If Giles wants anything past 3 years, we're out of luck, same with Millwood and Ryan. They're not worth sacrificing for, since they'll all be in some stage of decline by the time their contracts are up.

 

Therefore, since the market is so thin, we'll have to be creative in the trade market. I'd love to try and exploit the OF situations in Tampa and Washington, Gomes and Wilkerson would be my favorite two targets.

 

I'd pick up Walker's option without batting an eye, and I'd try to bring Dempster back on a one year(with a team option for another perhaps) deal that is reasonable.

 

For SS I'd try and bring Nomar back to a lower base, similar total with incentives deal, with Cedeno backing up both middle infield spots. If Nomar walks I'd try and work a deal for Lugo like others have mentioned, or possibly consider Furcal if the price/years are right. If all else fails, I'm willing to give Cedeno the SS position at '06, but that means you really have to work hard to upgrade the OF, having Patterson or Murton in one of the 3 spots probably won't do if Cedeno is the starting SS.

 

If I get Millwood, I plug him in the rotation with Prior, Z, Maddux, and Wood. If I don't get them, depending on how reliable I think Kerry will be, I'd consider a lower tier SP in FA or trade(Elarton?). If we acquire no new SP's, I'm content to let Hill/Mitre/Wellemeyer/Brownlie/Nolasco try and win the 5th spot.

 

I keep Dempster, Williamson, Ohman, Rusch(assuming his option is picked up), and one of Wuertz/Novoa/Wellemeyer/Leicester in the pen. If I sign Ryan, then I'm in great shape with the pen. If not, try and find a steady reliever somewhere in the FA or trade market(Linebrink from SD is my personal fave trade target). I'd try and sign Dotel to a Dempster/Williamson deal, and if I don't get that extra proven reliever, get a few more NRI's than normal.

 

Closing up the bullpen, the darkhorse is Guzman. If he can stay healthy and pitch as he can, he could be a great boost to the pen. Depending on the situation, he could replace Wuertz/Novoa or another in the bullpen.

 

The bench. Blanco is here, I'd have Cedeno and Fontenot as my two back up infielders, and Mark Sweeney would be ideal to back up 1B/OF. If we got Wilkerson, we could look to more of an outfielder here. Hairston I'd like to use in a trade, but he would be a serviceable jack of all trades. Murton would be a good 4th OF, especially if we got Sweeney, since Murton hits LH, and Sweeney RH very well.

 

So, if things went our way, we'd have:

 

2B Walker L

SS Nomar/Lugo R

1B Lee R

RF Giles L

3B Ramirez

LF Gomes/Wilkerson R/L

C Barrett R

CF Patterson L

 

Prior, Z, Wood, Millwood/Elarton, Maddux, Hill/Mitre/Welly/Brownlie/Nolasco

 

Dempster, Williamson, Ohman, Wuertz/Novoa/Welly, Rusch, Guzman/Ryan/FA/Trade/Rehab

 

Blanco, Fontenot, Cedeno, Murton, Sweeney, Hairston/FA/Trade

Edited August 23, 2005 by Transmogrified Tiger

[UK1679666180]

The Cubs are 14th in defensive eff. over at Prospectus.

 

Typically, the best hitters in baseball are the best at clutch hitting as well as situational hitting. The reason behind that? In any situation they're typically the best hitter.

 

They have to get someone besides Walker who can get on base at the top in front of Lee, Ramirez, etc.

 

They have to upgrade at least 2 of the 3 OF'ers.

 

They can hit as many HRs, you get runners on base, you'll have the benefit of less solo HRs and runs created w/out the HR. The common thread, runners on base.

[imb]

Well, UK beat me. I dont think you can build your team around situational or clutch hitting. You can, however, build your team around good hitters. Like he said, in any situation, they are typically the best hitter.

[CubfaninCA]

Since Boston has H. Ramirez coming up soon, will they possibly deal Renteria?? I know he's had a high number of errors this yr., but that guy's had a great glove in the past. A deal of Manny, Renteria and $5 million of cash for Wood, Patterson & Walker wouldn't bother me at all. Murton can take over the 2 spot.

 

As for Giles, being that he's originally from SoCal, it will be tough to get him. I can see DePodesta going after him hard, as well as Anaheim.