Best available relievers

[17 Seconds]

Ugh, I just don't think I'm ever comfortable trading for relievers. Frasor's numbers are great last year...but he was pretty ass-y most of the other years he's been with Toronto. Seems like he be more likely to go back to his crappy, high-WHIP/ERA ways.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/f/frasoja01.shtml

 

Last 5 years

 

1.24 WHIP

3.70 ERA

286.2 IP

240 H

116 BB

270 K

 

...while pitching in the AL East. How is that crappy?

[Cubswin11]

What would it take to get Frasor? Maybe Barney, Flaherty, or Watkins (Figured Hendry would start to try and trade from our MI depth)? Or would could we get away with a lesser level prospect(s)? Edited March 9, 2010 by Cubswin11

[Sammy Sofa]

Ugh, I just don't think I'm ever comfortable trading for relievers. Frasor's numbers are great last year...but he was pretty ass-y most of the other years he's been with Toronto. Seems like he be more likely to go back to his crappy, high-WHIP/ERA ways.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/f/frasoja01.shtml

 

Last 5 years

 

1.24 WHIP

3.70 ERA

286.2 IP

240 H

116 BB

270 K

 

...while pitching in the AL East. How is that crappy?

 

I don't know why you only went for his "last 5 years" when all he's got is a 6 year career.

 

In all outside of last year he seems to alternate being maybe average and just not very good. If he was out there to be signed, hey, great. Since it's a trade, eh, that's pretty underwhelming. Yeah, he was great last year, and was pretty decent his second year, but those seasons are sandwiching three seasons with an ERA+ of 101, a WHIP just above 1.3 and an ERA of 4.37. I mean, he had his worst and his best season back to back the last two seasons. Therein lies the essence of the reliever. Is that really worth overpaying for at this point?

[Little Slide Rooter]

Huh, I didn't know Weathers was out there. That's actually a guy I wouldn't mind seeing them take a chance on if he could be had for cheap.

 

I didn't either. I'm going off the article that was posted from mlbtraderumors. Him, Bell or Downs would be the guys I'd focus on if I were Hendry.

 

If were going to deal with the Pads, just go after Mike Adams. Id love Heath Bell, but at what cost? Hes a closer at the top of his game and the Pads are going to want a lot back for him. In fact I cant see the Pads sending him to us without at least Cashner in the deal. I wouldnt mind Smoltz or Weathers for cheap either. Heck, throw Smoltz in the mix for the 5th starter job.

[Sammy Sofa]

Seems pretty telling with Adams that he was terrible until he got to SD. Granted, his numbers were phenomenal last year, even for Petco, and he's not that old, but he was pretty horrendous the three years he was pitching in the NL Central.

[dew1679666265]

Huh, I didn't know Weathers was out there. That's actually a guy I wouldn't mind seeing them take a chance on if he could be had for cheap.

 

I didn't either. I'm going off the article that was posted from mlbtraderumors. Him, Bell or Downs would be the guys I'd focus on if I were Hendry.

 

If were going to deal with the Pads, just go after Mike Adams. Id love Heath Bell, but at what cost? Hes a closer at the top of his game and the Pads are going to want a lot back for him. In fact I cant see the Pads sending him to us without at least Cashner in the deal. I wouldnt mind Smoltz or Weathers for cheap either. Heck, throw Smoltz in the mix for the 5th starter job.

 

Adams will probably be cheaper for longer than Bell will (because Bell has save numbers to build up his price). That's why I think they'll be more willing to deal Bell than Adams. They're going to want a ton for either because they don't really need to trade either. If they even throw out the name Cashner or anybody in that level, Hendry needs to just sign Weathers or go with what we have.

[dew1679666265]

Seems pretty telling with Adams that he was terrible until he got to SD. Granted, his numbers were phenomenal last year, even for Petco, and he's not that old, but he was pretty horrendous the three years he was pitching in the NL Central.

 

Two of those three years combine for just 15 games. He wasn't good in those games, but that's not much of a sample at all. Why they didn't give him more of an opportunity is a good question, though.

 

His 2004 season in Milwaukee (46 games) was pretty decent and it was his only full season outside of Petco. Bell's a better bet, though.

[Sammy Sofa]

Whoops, completely forgot to check the game totals with the Brewers.

[Cubswin11]

What's Chad Bradford's situation? He's a FA, but I noticed he only pitched 10 innings last year is he still hurt? He's posted some decent numbers in the past. At least decent enough to warrant a ST invite.

[dew1679666265]

What's Chad Bradford's situation? He's a FA, but I noticed he only pitched 10 innings last year is he still hurt? He's posted some decent numbers in the past. At least decent enough to warrant a ST invite.

 

Most recent info I could find, Rotoworld from Sept. 30:

 

Chad Bradford (elbow) may not pitch again this season and is considering retirement.

"I'm leaning toward probably shutting it down," Bradford said, "but I'm definitely leaving the door open to see what happens." The 35-year-old is clearly frustrated by being injured, but he's also no doubt aware of his ineffectiveness -- Bradford has allowed 22 hits and five earned runs in 10 1/3 innings this season.

[dew1679666265]

What would it take to get Frasor? Maybe Barney, Flaherty, or Watkins (Figured Hendry would start to try and trade from our MI depth)? Or would could we get away with a lesser level prospect(s)?

 

Riccardi generally asks for quite a bit, I think. I certainly wouldn't go any higher than Barney, though I bet Riccardi would want more.

[Cubswin11]

What would it take to get Frasor? Maybe Barney, Flaherty, or Watkins (Figured Hendry would start to try and trade from our MI depth)? Or would could we get away with a lesser level prospect(s)?

 

Riccardi generally asks for quite a bit, I think. I certainly wouldn't go any higher than Barney, though I bet Riccardi would want more.

Riccardi isn't the GM anymore, Alex Anthopoulos is. But yeah, I guess I could maybe see them trying to get someone like Burke or Carpenter knowing that Hendry could be/is desperate to add bullpen arms.

[dew1679666265]

What would it take to get Frasor? Maybe Barney, Flaherty, or Watkins (Figured Hendry would start to try and trade from our MI depth)? Or would could we get away with a lesser level prospect(s)?

 

Riccardi generally asks for quite a bit, I think. I certainly wouldn't go any higher than Barney, though I bet Riccardi would want more.

Riccardi isn't the GM anymore, Alex Anthopoulos is. But yeah, I guess I could maybe see them trying to get someone like Burke or Carpenter knowing that Hendry could be/is desperate to add bullpen arms.

 

I wondered about that as I typed it, but couldn't remember that they made a change. Any trade is likely to be overpaying at this point, I'd say. That makes Weathers or a flyer on Smoltz that much more appealing.

[Cubswin11]

What's Chad Bradford's situation? He's a FA, but I noticed he only pitched 10 innings last year is he still hurt? He's posted some decent numbers in the past. At least decent enough to warrant a ST invite.

 

Most recent info I could find, Rotoworld from Sept. 30:

 

Chad Bradford (elbow) may not pitch again this season and is considering retirement.

"I'm leaning toward probably shutting it down," Bradford said, "but I'm definitely leaving the door open to see what happens." The 35-year-old is clearly frustrated by being injured, but he's also no doubt aware of his ineffectiveness -- Bradford has allowed 22 hits and five earned runs in 10 1/3 innings this season.

Thanks, doesn't really sound like he is a option...

 

With the Guzman, Lilly (meaning a bullpen arm will be in the rotation), and Gray (if it takes longer for him to heal) injuries, would they think about Cashner in the bullpen? I would prefer him to start in the minors and continue to develop as a starter and just go with guys like Stevens, Guab, Parker, Archer, Berg, or Atkins in the bullpen as internal options over him.

[dew1679666265]

Thanks, doesn't really sound like he is a option...

 

With the Guzman, Lilly (meaning a bullpen arm will be in the rotation), and Gray (if it takes longer for him to heal) injuries, would they think about Cashner in the bullpen? I would prefer him to start in the minors and continue to develop as a starter and just go with guys like Stevens, Guab, Parker, Archer, Berg, or Atkins in the bullpen as internal options over him.

 

I think they'll strongly consider Cashner. Like you, I'd prefer they leave Cashner in the minors to start since we have so many options, but they seem extremely high on him. Similarly to Shark, though, I think more seasoning in AAA would do him good.

 

I feel relatively confident that out of Caridad/Stevens/Gaub/Berg/Parker/Marshall/Gorzo, we can find 1-2 solid to very good relievers to go with Marmol.

[JonJayCutler]

Please trade for Frasor.

[MADD_DOG_31]

Thanks, doesn't really sound like he is a option...

 

With the Guzman, Lilly (meaning a bullpen arm will be in the rotation), and Gray (if it takes longer for him to heal) injuries, would they think about Cashner in the bullpen? I would prefer him to start in the minors and continue to develop as a starter and just go with guys like Stevens, Guab, Parker, Archer, Berg, or Atkins in the bullpen as internal options over him.

 

I think they'll strongly consider Cashner. Like you, I'd prefer they leave Cashner in the minors to start since we have so many options, but they seem extremely high on him. Similarly to Shark, though, I think more seasoning in AAA would do him good.

 

I feel relatively confident that out of Caridad/Stevens/Gaub/Berg/Parker/Marshall/Gorzo, we can find 1-2 solid to very good relievers to go with Marmol.

 

We have Grabow too

 

Marmol

Grabow

Caridad

Stevens

Gaub

Berg

Marshall/Gorz

[17 Seconds]

Ugh, I just don't think I'm ever comfortable trading for relievers. Frasor's numbers are great last year...but he was pretty ass-y most of the other years he's been with Toronto. Seems like he be more likely to go back to his crappy, high-WHIP/ERA ways.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/f/frasoja01.shtml

 

Last 5 years

 

1.24 WHIP

3.70 ERA

286.2 IP

240 H

116 BB

270 K

 

...while pitching in the AL East. How is that crappy?

 

I don't know why you only went for his "last 5 years" when all he's got is a 6 year career.

 

 

Because it was his rookie season and he put up 3 good years after it to show that it was probably just rookie struggles and not a true indicator of his talent.

 

It doesn't matter though, you can look at his total career numbers for all 6 season and they still aren't close to "ass-y" or crappy. At worst, he's been mediocre.

 

If you want to say he's not worth trading for and all that, fine. But when you purposely undersell an average/above average pitcher and call him crappy, it just hurts your overall arguments.

[dew1679666265]

Thanks, doesn't really sound like he is a option...

 

With the Guzman, Lilly (meaning a bullpen arm will be in the rotation), and Gray (if it takes longer for him to heal) injuries, would they think about Cashner in the bullpen? I would prefer him to start in the minors and continue to develop as a starter and just go with guys like Stevens, Guab, Parker, Archer, Berg, or Atkins in the bullpen as internal options over him.

 

I think they'll strongly consider Cashner. Like you, I'd prefer they leave Cashner in the minors to start since we have so many options, but they seem extremely high on him. Similarly to Shark, though, I think more seasoning in AAA would do him good.

 

I feel relatively confident that out of Caridad/Stevens/Gaub/Berg/Parker/Marshall/Gorzo, we can find 1-2 solid to very good relievers to go with Marmol.

 

We have Grabow too

 

Marmol

Grabow

Caridad

Stevens

Gaub

Berg

Marshall/Gorz

 

Yeah, I didn't include Grabow because I was looking at younger, less proven pitchers who could step up into a new role because of Guzman's injury. Grabow is already a veteran who isn't likely to become anything better than he's been. Marshall is probably on the fringe of that as well.

[Sammy Sofa]

It doesn't matter though, you can look at his total career numbers for all 6 season and they still aren't close to "ass-y" or crappy. At worst, he's been mediocre.

 

If you want to say he's not worth trading for and all that, fine. But when you purposely undersell an average/above average pitcher and call him crappy, it just hurts your overall arguments.

 

Meh, semantics. It's not like "ass-y" or "crappy" are quantifiable terms. It means different things to different people. To me, his numbers are more crappy than not to make me think he's worth a trade. It would be a different issue if it was a question of signing him, but such is life.

[CUBZ99]

I see that David Weathers is still unsigned. I know he isn't the best option, but he was pretty impressive with the Reds in the first half of the season last year. Wonder if he has anything left.

[CUBZ99]

It doesn't matter though, you can look at his total career numbers for all 6 season and they still aren't close to "ass-y" or crappy. At worst, he's been mediocre.

 

If you want to say he's not worth trading for and all that, fine. But when you purposely undersell an average/above average pitcher and call him crappy, it just hurts your overall arguments.

 

Meh, semantics. It's not like "ass-y" or "crappy" are quantifiable terms. It means different things to different people. To me, his numbers are more crappy than not to make me think he's worth a trade. It would be a different issue if it was a question of signing him, but such is life.

 

If you think a career 1.28 WHIP and 3.78 ERA are crappy for a reliever, your expectations are extremely unrealistic. Granted I wouldn't give up the farm for the guy, but he his stats show him to be a respectable if not above average bullpen arm.

[Sammy Sofa]

It doesn't matter though, you can look at his total career numbers for all 6 season and they still aren't close to "ass-y" or crappy. At worst, he's been mediocre.

 

If you want to say he's not worth trading for and all that, fine. But when you purposely undersell an average/above average pitcher and call him crappy, it just hurts your overall arguments.

 

Meh, semantics. It's not like "ass-y" or "crappy" are quantifiable terms. It means different things to different people. To me, his numbers are more crappy than not to make me think he's worth a trade. It would be a different issue if it was a question of signing him, but such is life.

 

If you think a career 1.28 WHIP and 3.78 ERA are crappy for a reliever, your expectations are extremely unrealistic. Granted I wouldn't give up the farm for the guy, but he his stats show him to be a respectable if not above average bullpen arm.

 

He'd be great to sign and terrible to trade for. I'm just not a fan of trading for any reliever unless they're the rare sure thing because it's going to cost way too much regardless. I'm also not a fan of using career numbers as the end-all-be-all of judging a player. Even just using the 5-year block like dexter did is propping up 3 straight unimpressive years (unimpressive meaning certainly not worth what the Cubs would likely have to give up to get him) with 2 good years on either end. He's the typical reliever gamble.

[Northside Blues]

I miss Michael Wuertz a lot.

[italianocubsfan7]

For some strange reason, I personally think we should reacquire Kerry Wood. He would definitely shore up the back end of the bullpen and middle relief. Although, I see this being more likely come June or July, especially if we are in the playoff hunt. KW in an Indians uniform just isn't right.