Jesse Jackson's group meets with Braves over lack of blacks

[Derwood]

Curacao is an island that is a part of the Netherlands Antilles. It's a Dutch territory off of the coast of Venezuela.

 

right, i just thought he was born in the Netherlands proper

[Jehrico]

Curacao is an island that is a part of the Netherlands Antilles. It's a Dutch territory off of the coast of Venezuela.

 

right, i just thought he was born in the Netherlands proper

I did too. I had to look it up on Wikipedia before I got it straight.

[Guest]

Derwood, you do realize there are people of African descent in Latin American nations, right?

 

I think if you asked Soriano if he was black, he'd say no

 

He'd probably say he's Dominican and that's neither here nor there in this discussion. The bolded is what I was referring to:

 

In this country, "black" doesn't refer to a skin color, it refers to an ethnicity (ie those of african descent). A dark skinned latino is not black. Nor are dark skinned Spaniards, for example.

 

Saying Soriano or Sosa are black simply because of their skin color is akin to saying someone like Chris Duhon isn't black because of theirs

[DiamondMind]

This is...one of the stupidest things I have ever heard.

 

They just did more to promote racism in one stupid move than they can ever hope to stamp out.

 

Idiots.

[Derwood]

This is...one of the stupidest things I have ever heard.

 

They just did increased the Braves popularity in the South.

 

fixed

[Careless]

i don't think so

 

http://www.somos10.com/pics/0alfonsosoriano.jpg

http://cache.deadspin.com/archives/ozzieguillen.jpg

 

In this country, "black" doesn't refer to a skin color, it refers to an ethnicity (ie those of african descent). A dark skinned latino is not black. Nor are dark skinned Spaniards, for example.

 

Saying Soriano or Sosa are black simply because of their skin color is akin to saying someone like Chris Duhon isn't black because of theirs

wait, you don't think that sosa's ancestors are mostly from africa? And you don't appear to be joking? I'm not sure what to say. I'm not sure what I can say and not get banned

[Derwood]

i don't think so

 

http://www.somos10.com/pics/0alfonsosoriano.jpg

http://cache.deadspin.com/archives/ozzieguillen.jpg

 

In this country, "black" doesn't refer to a skin color, it refers to an ethnicity (ie those of african descent). A dark skinned latino is not black. Nor are dark skinned Spaniards, for example.

 

Saying Soriano or Sosa are black simply because of their skin color is akin to saying someone like Chris Duhon isn't black because of theirs

wait, you don't think that sosa's ancestors are mostly from africa? And you don't appear to be joking? I'm not sure what to say. I'm not sure what I can say and not get banned

 

I have no idea where Sosa's ancestors are from. But I make no assumptions based on what color his skin is. My wife has an adopted sister who is from Puerto Rico and looks black, but she's not. It's not as simple as someone just "looking black"

[Wilson A2000]

Not sure if my view has already been given, but I have to get this off my chest. First of all the African American community needs better representatives than Jackson and Sharpton. Jackson had an affair and paid the woman off and constantly looks for the limelight. Sharpton was caught in a hypothetical drug scheme in New York. These are your leaders? Now I know that people who are really in the trenches don't put stock in them, but the African American community deserves better leadership.

 

Second, why should there be more blacks in baseball? Basketball is cheaper, easier to form teams, and is more flashy. But the real issue is that the reason fewer blacks are in the MLB is because the sport is truly worldwide. If Jackson wants equality, then there must be equality in baseball. That means that people form Asia and Latin America are coming in. The more that come in, the less African Americans play. Thus if Jackson wants more blacks to play, he is going to have to weed out some of the other races and that is hypocritical. So I would say that the reason that there are fewer blacks (and whites) in the MLB is because other races are coming in. And if Jackson wants equality, equality for all, he should have no issue.

[Careless]

I have no idea where Sosa's ancestors are from. But I make no assumptions based on what color his skin is. My wife has an adopted sister who is from Puerto Rico and looks black, but she's not. It's not as simple as someone just "looking black"

Then you are terribly ignorant of the history of our hemisphere, as well as many other things.

there was never anyone who looked remotely like samy or alf 500 years ago or more over here.

this is akin to seeing this guy http://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en-commons/thumb/e/ee/250px-TonyLeon.jpg

and saying "yeah, he's black" because he's from south africa

because people in this thread apparently don't know history, in large parts of the americas, the natives were entirely/virtually entirely wiped out by disease/murder when the europeans colonized. This is especially true of small ecosystems like islands. They were replaced mostly with slaves brought in for their useful labor and their resistance to the diseases that killed these people.

My 5th grade history teacher would be so proud

[Derwood]

I have no idea where Sosa's ancestors are from. But I make no assumptions based on what color his skin is. My wife has an adopted sister who is from Puerto Rico and looks black, but she's not. It's not as simple as someone just "looking black"

Then you are terribly ignorant of the history of our hemisphere, as well as many other things.

 

How is it ignorant to admit that I don't know his ancestry and thus don't want to make assumptions based purely on his appearance. Wouldn't that be the opposite of ignorant?

 

And what are these other things I'm also ignorant on?

[cbbryan]

Apologies if this was posted already, I couldn't find a thread on it.

 

http://www.ajc.com/sports/content/sports/braves/stories/2007/05/07/0508bravesminority.html?imw=Y

 

Countered Beasley, "As I expected, [schuerholz?s] idea is the bottom line: I'll put the best 40 men I can get wherever I can get them from on the field, and that's fair. But the fact of the matter is if they put resources into recruiting here in the United States, and more specifically here in Atlanta, there are talented players here."

 

Isn't putting the best 40 men on the roster what Shuerholz is suppose to do?

 

This is an irritating story! It's not like the Braves, or any other MLB club tries to only sign white players and no minorities. There would obviously be an issue with that. There is a large percentage of "Minorities" in the game, but if their not "African-American" that's a problem?

[J.R.]

How on earth can you "look black" but not be "black?"

 

This is insane.

[jersey cubs fan]

I have no idea where Sosa's ancestors are from. But I make no assumptions based on what color his skin is. My wife has an adopted sister who is from Puerto Rico and looks black, but she's not. It's not as simple as someone just "looking black"

Then you are terribly ignorant of the history of our hemisphere, as well as many other things.

 

How is it ignorant to admit that I don't know his ancestry and thus don't want to make assumptions based purely on his appearance. Wouldn't that be the opposite of ignorant?

 

And what are these other things I'm also ignorant on?

 

I think you are just being overly PC. People who look black have their origins in Africa. They are black. You don't have to make an assumption. You aren't overly generalizing somebody. Just because they aren't African American doesn't mean they aren't black.

[Derwood]

I have no idea where Sosa's ancestors are from. But I make no assumptions based on what color his skin is. My wife has an adopted sister who is from Puerto Rico and looks black, but she's not. It's not as simple as someone just "looking black"

Then you are terribly ignorant of the history of our hemisphere, as well as many other things.

 

How is it ignorant to admit that I don't know his ancestry and thus don't want to make assumptions based purely on his appearance. Wouldn't that be the opposite of ignorant?

 

And what are these other things I'm also ignorant on?

 

I think you are just being overly PC. People who look black have their origins in Africa. They are black. You don't have to make an assumption. You aren't overly generalizing somebody. Just because they aren't African American doesn't mean they aren't black.

 

i'm done with this argument. Everybody is missing my point

[biittner77]

i'm done with this argument. Everybody is missing my point

 

In the interest of PC and absurd designations you're willing to ignore historical facts.

 

There are very very few people from the Caribbean, Central or South America that can claim to be pure blood native ancestry. People of mixed ancestry survived because they inherited immunity to disease from their Eastern Hemisphere ancestors.

 

The chances that Sammy Sosa isn't of African descent are about the same as Izturis winning the batting title and the Cy Young in the same season.

[RedIvyCub]

Well its simple economics, as are most things.

 

Most inner city kids play basketball or football. Why? you just have to buy a ball or know someone who has one (not talking about organized football, just fball the way you played in the street when you were a kid).

 

Priced a set of golf clubs or a baseball, bat and glove recently?

 

Doesnt take a rocket scientist to figure out why the inner city kids gravitate to bball and football.

 

Now we know why Langerhans was traded. :wink:

 

Never bought into that. There's plenty of poverty in Latin America, even moreso than in US inner cities, yet there's no shortage of latin kids finding their way onto pro baseball rosters. Simple fact is baseball is no longer very popular with young African Americans. That's why the scarcity of black players isn't going away anytime soon. Jesse Jackson can bitch about it all he wants but it won't change anything.

 

I think the bottom line here is that in the NBA and NFL these kids go straight to the big league...and the money. In MLB, that doesn't happen too often with much success and in today's society of instant gratification, kids don't want to put in a couple of years or more in the minors. They want the money and glory and they want it now.

 

So, where are the protests about the lack of diversity on the field in the NFL and NBA? And don't Jesse Jackson and his minions have better things to do with their time and other people's money?

[Backtobanks]

Well its simple economics, as are most things.

 

Most inner city kids play basketball or football. Why? you just have to buy a ball or know someone who has one (not talking about organized football, just fball the way you played in the street when you were a kid).

 

Priced a set of golf clubs or a baseball, bat and glove recently?

 

Doesnt take a rocket scientist to figure out why the inner city kids gravitate to bball and football.

 

Now we know why Langerhans was traded. :wink:

 

Never bought into that. There's plenty of poverty in Latin America, even moreso than in US inner cities, yet there's no shortage of latin kids finding their way onto pro baseball rosters. Simple fact is baseball is no longer very popular with young African Americans. That's why the scarcity of black players isn't going away anytime soon. Jesse Jackson can bitch about it all he wants but it won't change anything.

 

I think the bottom line here is that in the NBA and NFL these kids go straight to the big league...and the money. In MLB, that doesn't happen too often with much success and in today's society of instant gratification, kids don't want to put in a couple of years or more in the minors. They want the money and glory and they want it now.

 

So, where are the protests about the lack of diversity on the field in the NFL and NBA? And don't Jesse Jackson and his minions have better things to do with their time and other people's money?

 

I agree with what you said. In addition, being successful in high school, college, or the minors doesn't necessarily translate to success in the majors. The correlation between success in basketball and football at the college level is much greater than baseball. At the high school level it is even greater.

[biittner77]

Another factor in the basketball and football vs. Baseball is that in High school it's a lot easier to stay eligible for basketball and football than it is for baseball. Thus a large amount of athletes that aren't good students are much more likely to play the fall sports. Academic success usually tends to follow socio economic lines.

 

In our area at least, there just isn't as much involvement of the African American community in baseball. Our town is about 60% white but our little league is about 95% white.

[swordsman]

That's because you are a bigot.

 

See how simple that was?