Do you think Ramirez will remain a Cub?

[CubsWin]

I am holding out hope up until the date when guys can start to negotiate with other teams. If it reaches that point, I can't see him staying.

 

I don't believe in the theory that Hendry HAS to keep Ramirez to keep his job. I do believe, however, that turning this team into a winner, without Ramirez, would be far too difficult for Hendry to accomplish at this stage of the game.

I agree. I think because it will be so much more difficult to win sooner rather than later without Ramirez, that Hendry is motivated to resign Aramis, though he won't back himself into the corner of believing he has to in order to keep his job.

 

That said, I think the great likelihood is that Aramis returns to the Cubs. If he isn't signed by the 11th, the chances of that drops, but not the point were it becomes highly unlikely that he returns.

 

I dunno, CW. I agree with XZero that if Anaheim gets the chance they'll throw a ton of money at Aramis. I don't want them involved in any bidding war.

True that. I think his chances of him remaining a Cub clearly go down if other teams have a chance to "throw a ton of money" at him, but there would still be nothing preventing Hendry from matching it.

[RichHillIsABeast]

He's gone, bye bye Jim.

 

Did anyone listen to WGN radio sports reports yesterday afternoon or Sports Central? My dad was in the car and he thinks he heard David Kaplan say that Aramis will be signed by Saturday after he gets a few more bucks.

 

Can anyone confirm?

 

Yeah, I heard that too. Very encouraging, IMO, since Kaplan has been money on his scoops lately - MacPhail being the opt out clause creator and Aramis getting a full NTC for the first two years of his contract.

 

When was it confirmed that Ramirez had a full NTC?

 

Ramirez had a no-trade provision in the first two years of his four-year, $42 million deal, and he told the Tribune during the '06 season he did not want to be traded, no matter how bad it got for the Cubs. Three of the four years were guaranteed, and an $11 million mutual option for 2009 would have automatically kicked in if he made 270 combined starts in '07 and '08.

 

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/cs-061030cubs,1,187565.story?coll=cs-home-headlines

[Abe Frohman]

I think the only thing Jim Hendry screwed up on was giving Aramis Ramirez the opt out clause in his contract. He was paid WELL at that point in his career, as he was an injury prone/rock-hand/inconsistant bat who put it together and got rewarded with a solid contract.

 

When Derrek Lee went down, Aramis was not a force until after the 2nd half - when he went crazy, despite being completely out of the race. Now he is entering his prime, coming off a cold/hot season in which he had GREAT numbers, and is a top free-agent.

 

I have a feeling he will resign with the Cubs, and get about $13 million a year for 3 more, and an option year.

[cjbucks]

I am funneling all of what little optimism I have toward the hope that Aram signs this week. If he does not sign by the 11th I believe he is gone and it is going to be a long cold winter.

[goonys evil twin]

He's gone, bye bye Jim.

 

Did anyone listen to WGN radio sports reports yesterday afternoon or Sports Central? My dad was in the car and he thinks he heard David Kaplan say that Aramis will be signed by Saturday after he gets a few more bucks.

 

Can anyone confirm?

 

Yeah, I heard that too. Very encouraging, IMO, since Kaplan has been money on his scoops lately - MacPhail being the opt out clause creator and Aramis getting a full NTC for the first two years of his contract.

 

When was it confirmed that Ramirez had a full NTC?

 

Ramirez had a no-trade provision in the first two years of his four-year, $42 million deal, and he told the Tribune during the '06 season he did not want to be traded, no matter how bad it got for the Cubs. Three of the four years were guaranteed, and an $11 million mutual option for 2009 would have automatically kicked in if he made 270 combined starts in '07 and '08.

 

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/cs-061030cubs,1,187565.story?coll=cs-home-headlines

 

 

That is not confirmation of a full no trade clause. A no-trade provision can mean many things, most common is a list of 4-5 teams where the player would refuse to be traded.

[goonys evil twin]

I am funneling all of what little optimism I have toward the hope that Aram signs this week. If he does not sign by the 11th I believe he is gone and it is going to be a long cold winter.

 

Our hope doesn't like with Ramirez resigning. It could still be a long cold winter with him returning, and the team could still suck. Resigning Ramirez does not improve the team, and this team needs to be improved. They have to resign Ramirez, then still make major improvements.

[Soul]

I'll allow my feelings to come out on this one.

 

I know Bruce says all of this is a formality. I don't agree, it feels completely different than that. I think Ramirez doesn't sign by the 2 week mark, and he hits the open market where the Cubs will be unwilling to match the biggest offer.

 

In short, I think he's leaving. Reasons? 1) It feels like it, because 2) If it was really all touch-feely "I love Chicago", he would have signed already.

 

The lack of news on the subject in recent days only bolsters it, in my opinion.

 

Lord, I do hope I'm wrong.

[RichHillIsABeast]

He's gone, bye bye Jim.

 

Did anyone listen to WGN radio sports reports yesterday afternoon or Sports Central? My dad was in the car and he thinks he heard David Kaplan say that Aramis will be signed by Saturday after he gets a few more bucks.

 

Can anyone confirm?

 

Yeah, I heard that too. Very encouraging, IMO, since Kaplan has been money on his scoops lately - MacPhail being the opt out clause creator and Aramis getting a full NTC for the first two years of his contract.

 

When was it confirmed that Ramirez had a full NTC?

 

Ramirez had a no-trade provision in the first two years of his four-year, $42 million deal, and he told the Tribune during the '06 season he did not want to be traded, no matter how bad it got for the Cubs. Three of the four years were guaranteed, and an $11 million mutual option for 2009 would have automatically kicked in if he made 270 combined starts in '07 and '08.

 

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/cs-061030cubs,1,187565.story?coll=cs-home-headlines

 

 

That is not confirmation of a full no trade clause. A no-trade provision can mean many things, most common is a list of 4-5 teams where the player would refuse to be traded.

 

Whatever. Kaplan's source was a scout who'd seen the actual contract. I don't need more confirmation than that. I'm not a reporter.

[Soul]

I am funneling all of what little optimism I have toward the hope that Aram signs this week. If he does not sign by the 11th I believe he is gone and it is going to be a long cold winter.

 

Our hope doesn't like with Ramirez resigning. It could still be a long cold winter with him returning, and the team could still suck. Resigning Ramirez does not improve the team, and this team needs to be improved. They have to resign Ramirez, then still make major improvements.

 

We certainly need to do more than just ARam. I dunno, if Ramirez doesn't sign I just see things like stormclouds gathering over Wrigley, vultures beginning to circle over Hendry's office.......the 4 horsemen riding forth.

 

you know, bad things like that.

[UBlink]

If the Cubs are willing to match any offer he gets from the open market I think ARam will return. I will be very surprised if he takes an offer from another team for less money than the Cubs are offering.

 

If the Cubs are unwilling to pony up the market price that's their way of saying they don't want him back.

[Mark_R]

I think a more relevant question is "how much is too much?" for Aramis Ramirez? 15? 16? 17? 20?

[Pinktermite]

JH might be dumb...but he's not stupid...well, maybe.

 

But Aramis will re-sign with the Cubs. Even Hendry realizes that the task becomes even MORE impossible to build a winner without proven run producers in his lineup.

 

The bank will be opened for Aram. Like I said, I think it'll be in the range of 4 years/85 million, with an option for a 5th.

 

Just guessing on that. But I will be stunned if Hendry decides not to give the guy what he has coming in the open market.

[Soul]

If the Cubs are willing to match any offer he gets from the open market I think ARam will return. I will be very surprised if he takes an offer from another team for less money than the Cubs are offering.

 

If the Cubs are unwilling to pony up the market price that's their way of saying they don't want him back.

 

Market price is what someone is willing to pay.

 

That doesn't preclude Hendry from being shocked into submission if, say........the Cubs think market price will be $10 million and someone says "I'll pay $15"

[soapy]

I'm obviously just speculating here, but I get the impression the Hendry told Lou he was going to make some moves to improve this team and give him the talent he needs to be work with a contender. It would be pretty stupid to follow that up by letting go of (arguably) your best offensive player.

 

Orrrrrrr...maybe I'm just being foolishly optimistic today.

[BigbadB]

I guess I'm having trouble seeing what the allure is here for Aramis to return.

 

1) Local media is badmouthing his work ethic.

2) Other DR players treated pretty poorly on their departures.

3) A tremendous regression by the organization since he first came here.

4) New manager and coaches.

5) Hot commodity on the free agent market, where he can pick and choose what team he signs with. As most free agents tend to do, I can see Aramis picking a team that is in a better position to be playoff bound.

6) Potential to go back to being a role player, rather than be counted on as the main producer. Well, if he signs for 15m+, I guess this is quite a stretch. But, Vlady is the main guy in Anaheim.

7) Cubs haven't exactly rolled out the red carpet to him as his days to free agency counted down.

8) Not many quality players to improve the team enough to turn a horrible season in 2006 into a winning season in 2007.

 

If the Angels, Dodgers and Cubs were all offering the same amount, I just don't see enough to inspire someone to pick the Cubs over the other two teams.

[UMFan83]

I guess I'm having trouble seeing what the allure is here for Aramis to return.

 

1) Local media is badmouthing his work ethic.

2) Other DR players treated pretty poorly on their departures.

3) A tremendous regression by the organization since he first came here.

4) New manager and coaches.

5) Hot commodity on the free agent market, where he can pick and choose what team he signs with. As most free agents tend to do, I can see Aramis picking a team that is in a better position to be playoff bound.

6) Potential to go back to being a role player, rather than be counted on as the main producer. Well, if he signs for 15m+, I guess this is quite a stretch. But, Vlady is the main guy in Anaheim.

7) Cubs haven't exactly rolled out the red carpet to him as his days to free agency counted down.

8) Not many quality players to improve the team enough to turn a horrible season in 2006 into a winning season in 2007.

 

If the Angels, Dodgers and Cubs were all offering the same amount, I just don't see enough to inspire someone to pick the Cubs over the other two teams.

 

Thank you, that is exactly what I've been saying to people for weeks. It's not as easy as saying "Aramis you will resign with us" (unless they throw a crap load more then others are offering). It's either we overpay for him, or he just bolts. I don't care what his agent is saying, thats likely a ploy to get leverage from other teams.

 

The funny thing is, a lot of people are going to be stunned when he bolts 'suddenly'

[dapert]

I think the only thing Jim Hendry screwed up on was giving Aramis Ramirez the opt out clause in his contract.

 

Well I guess he didn't screw up at all then since it's common knowledge that MacPhail is the one who put that contract together and not Hendry.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Yes, I think Ramirez will remain a Cub.

[Pinktermite]

Aramis is staying right where he is. People will come to the Cubs convention with pitchforks if he doesn't re-sign him.

[BigbadB]

The funny thing is, a lot of people are going to be stunned when he bolts 'suddenly'

 

Hendry doesn't like long term deals. Moreno probably wouldn't blink at throwing a 7 or 8 year deal at him.

[CubFanPhilly]

I guess I'm having trouble seeing what the allure is here for Aramis to return.

 

1) Local media is badmouthing his work ethic.

2) Other DR players treated pretty poorly on their departures.

3) A tremendous regression by the organization since he first came here.

4) New manager and coaches.

5) Hot commodity on the free agent market, where he can pick and choose what team he signs with. As most free agents tend to do, I can see Aramis picking a team that is in a better position to be playoff bound.

6) Potential to go back to being a role player, rather than be counted on as the main producer. Well, if he signs for 15m+, I guess this is quite a stretch. But, Vlady is the main guy in Anaheim.

7) Cubs haven't exactly rolled out the red carpet to him as his days to free agency counted down.

8) Not many quality players to improve the team enough to turn a horrible season in 2006 into a winning season in 2007.

 

If the Angels, Dodgers and Cubs were all offering the same amount, I just don't see enough to inspire someone to pick the Cubs over the other two teams.

 

Comfort and Loyalty?

 

Comfort of not having to move to a new city/new routines. Loyalty to teammates, fans, and perhaps to Hendry? I'll admit it's not much.

 

Is the rhetoric about wanting to return to the Cubs all just smoke? If it is, how does that help his cause at the negotiating table?

[goonys evil twin]

The funny thing is, a lot of people are going to be stunned when he bolts 'suddenly'

 

Hendry doesn't like long term deals. Moreno probably wouldn't blink at throwing a 7 or 8 year deal at him.

 

I believe the no longterm deals order came from MacPhail, who as president, would have the team's longterm interest at heart more than a GM.

[Abe Frohman]

I think the only thing Jim Hendry screwed up on was giving Aramis Ramirez the opt out clause in his contract.

 

Well I guess he didn't screw up at all then since it's common knowledge that MacPhail is the one who put that contract together and not Hendry.

 

Oh, my bad. Just switch Hendry's name with MacPhails, and all is set straight.

[frostwyrm]

I think Hendry will overpay if necessary. For the sake of his job security he can't afford to lose Aramis. This is primarily going to come down to Aramis's willingness to rejoin a last place team when there are offers from contenders.

[BigbadB]

Since there is no hurry on Aramis' part, is it possible that Hendry will need to show Aramis that he is serious about improving the team by signing some big names (not there are many big names to draw from) before he'll re-sign with the Cubs?

 

Just tossing some thoughts out there.