early start on the excuses for grissom...

[sonofsamiam]

While I generally agree with what's being said here, I think people are vastly underrating Grissom's career. He was a very good player at his peak, and had value as recently as '02-'04. This is not Hollandsworth or Goodwin we're talking about here.

 

Grissom was never a very good player. He had a reasonably successful career. He had a couple good years, but he was never very good. His OPS+ was only above average 5 times in his career.

 

But most importantly, while the guy was a servicable player in his day, his day is past. He's 39. He was god awful last season. He can't be counted on for anything this year.

 

In 2003, Grissom had 22 Win Shares, and 16 in '04. In '02 (albeit not a full season), he had an OPS+ of 124. He's always had value in the field and on the bases and, while those things aren't as valuable as OPS, they're not worthless. I guess I just disagree with the notion that OPS+ is the defining measure of a player's total worth, important as it obviously is.

 

My point was, he's not that far off of some pretty good years. He could be a pretty valuable bench player, if used properly. Which, of course, is the source of everyone's worry, including my own.

 

I'm not denying he had a good year. I just don't think you're being realistic when you say people are underrating his career. He was below average most of the time. If he was on your team his entire career, you would have been pissed if he started the whole time. Sure he had his moments, but his career was highly unimpressive. And now he's at the end of his career, so nobody should be expecting much out of him.

 

I'm not arguing that his OPS+ isn't that good -- and his OBP in fact is what held him back from being better, IMO. But there are more ways to skin a cat.

 

For example, look at WARP3 -- Grissom's career number is 70.7, with yearly highs of 8.3/7.9/7.4/7.1/6.6.

 

For comparision, Moises Alou (a guy who broke in at about the same time) has a career WARP3 of 70.1, with yearly highs of 9.0/6.9/6.5/5.9/5.8.

 

Alou is certainly a better hitter than Grissom, of course, but Grissom closes the gap when you take in everything else. And I think it's worth something to take in everything else, when you're assessing a career.

[dalgreen]

Well this discussion is definitely a step up from last year, which means we have a better roster this year than last. At least we're now debating on whether a guy should be a fourth, fifth or sixth outfielder instead of, "Why in the world is that guy (or those guys)starting?"

[Derwood]

Here is Dusty's brilliant analysis of Pagan vs Grissom (from today's Herald):

 

“Maybe there’s room for both,” Baker said. “Why not? We’ll see. One brings some things. The other brings some other things.”

 

Deep, Dusty....deep.

[biittner77]

Here is Dusty's brilliant analysis of Pagan vs Grissom (from today's Herald):

 

“Maybe there’s room for both,” Baker said. “Why not? We’ll see. One brings some things. The other brings some other things.”

 

Deep, Dusty....deep.

 

Why not? Because that would mean that Baker couldn't carry the all important 12th pitcher.

 

Duh

[frostwyrm]

Here is Dusty's brilliant analysis of Pagan vs Grissom (from today's Herald):

 

“Maybe there’s room for both,” Baker said. “Why not? We’ll see. One brings some things. The other brings some other things.”

 

Deep, Dusty....deep.

 

It is what it is.