Scott Williamson

[Balsa]

Hey fred, completely unrelated note, but how many runs were scored by the Cubs in "late" innings vs. the rest of the innings? Could you then compare that to the WS teams?

[Fred Hornkohl]

If the pen turns out to be as deep as it could be, I hope that Dusty starts getting away from using Dempster in non-save situations (unlike last year) unless completely necessary.

 

Well you can't just let him sit in the bullpen when there isn't a save chance. He's got to get out and use him arm like any other pitcher every once in a while.

 

I'm not advocating sitting him for long stretches. I'm talking about pitching him for a 2nd or 3rd day in a row when the Cubs are up by 5 going into the 9th. I seem to remember that happening often last year and it drives me crazy.

 

That did not happen often. Below is a listing of the games that Ryan Dempster appeared in as a reliever. There were a total of 10 games in which he appeared that the CUBS won by more than 3 runs. (a typical non-save situation). In 7 of those 10 instances, Dempster was pitching on at least 4 days rest. The 01 Jun game vs. Los Angeles was a game started by Koronka, and as you might expect, that meant Baker had to go to the bullpen early and often. While it was the third consecutive game for Dempster and not a save situation, Dempster was the 5th relief pitcher used by the CUBS in the game. In the 24 July game at St Louis, Dempster entered the game in the 9th with a 4-3 lead, and proceeded to pick up a blown save and a win, as Neifi Perez hit a grand slam in the 10th. In the 02 Sept game at Pittsburgh, Dempster entered in the 8th inning with the score 4-3 in favor of the CUBS and was the beneficiary of 3 more CUBS runs in the 9th inning.

 

 

I'm gonna have to bust you on that one. Teh Cobs have never scored 3 runs in the 9th, silly. :lol:

 

Oh, yeah ??? :wink:

 

TOP OF THE NINTH INNING

 

Gonzalez in to pitch for Pittsburgh

McClain walked

Patterson bunted to first base for an IF single, McClain to second

Meadows in to pitch for Pittsburgh

Blanco sacrificed, 5-4, McClain to third, Patterson to second

Hairston singled to left field, McClain and Patterson scored

Perez singled to right center field, Hairston to third

Walker walked, Perez to second

Garciaparra flied out to right field, Hairston scored, Perez to third, Walker to second

Burnitz walked (intentionally)

Dempster grounded out to the pitcher, 1-3

 

3 runs, 3 hits, 0 errors, 2 men left on base

 

 

           1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9    R  H E
CUBS       0 0 1 0 0 3 0 0 3    7 12 0
Pittsburgh 0 0 0 0 0 2 0 1      3  9 2

 

 

Home runs: CUBS: Garciaparra (5), Barrett (14)

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Has to be made up -- Perez singled??? :lol: :lol: :lol:

[Fred Hornkohl]

Hey fred, completely unrelated note, but how many runs were scored by the Cubs in "late" innings vs. the rest of the innings? Could you then compare that to the WS teams?

 

I only have this breakdown for the CUBS, so I can't really compare it to other teams for you.

 

            1    2    3    4    5    6    7    8    9   10   11   12   13   14   15   16   Total 											
CUBS       58   79   75  101   63  121   72   72   52    7    2    1    0    0    0    0     703
Opponents  91   88   61   71  115   65   74   85   53    0    7    4    0    0    0    0     714

[Fred Hornkohl]

Has to be made up -- Perez singled??? :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

Actually, Perez was in the middle of one of his hot streaks at the time.

 

Perez          AB   R   H  2B  3B  HR  TB RBI  BB  SO     BA    OBP    SLG    OPS
07/10 - 09/07 162  15  55  17   1   2  80  19   6  10  0.340  0.363  0.494  0.857

[stitchface]

Has to be made up -- Perez singled??? :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

its not like he walked . . .

[CubinNY]

Hey fred, completely unrelated note, but how many runs were scored by the Cubs in "late" innings vs. the rest of the innings? Could you then compare that to the WS teams?

 

I only have this breakdown for the CUBS, so I can't really compare it to other teams for you.

 

            1    2    3    4    5    6    7    8    9   10   11   12   13   14   15   16   Total 											
CUBS       58   79   75  101   63  121   72   72   52    7    2    1    0    0    0    0     703
Opponents  91   88   61   71  115   65   74   85   53    0    7    4    0    0    0    0     714

 

That first inning was a killer many a game last year.

[stitchface]

If the pen turns out to be as deep as it could be, I hope that Dusty starts getting away from using Dempster in non-save situations (unlike last year) unless completely necessary.

 

I hope for the opposite - that dusty uses his relievers to best leverage their talents. why do you care if its a save situation or not? just win the game.

 

No, I don't care if it's a save situation per say. I just don't want Dempster (and this really could apply to everyone in the pen) used three days in a row when it's not necessary.

 

Example: If Dempster pitches an inning one day, and then is brought into a game the next day when the Cubs are up five runs in the 9th, I think that's stupid. Save him for the next day. What if the next day the Cubs are in a tight game in the 9th and they feel like they need Dempster. Well, you have to pitch him for the third day in a row (when Ohman, Williamson, Weurtz, etc) probably could have closed out the previous day's game.

 

That's very poorly worded. I hope you know what I mean.

 

No, I see what you mean. You are concerned with overuse more than situational use. I think if Williamson returns to form, we ought to see he and ohman in high leverage late game situations. Let Dempster get the saves - these guys will win you the game in the 7th and 8th innings.

[Fred Hornkohl]

Hey fred, completely unrelated note, but how many runs were scored by the Cubs in "late" innings vs. the rest of the innings? Could you then compare that to the WS teams?

 

I only have this breakdown for the CUBS, so I can't really compare it to other teams for you.

 

            1    2    3    4    5    6    7    8    9   10   11   12   13   14   15   16   Total 											
CUBS       58   79   75  101   63  121   72   72   52    7    2    1    0    0    0    0     703
Opponents  91   88   61   71  115   65   74   85   53    0    7    4    0    0    0    0     714

 

That first inning was a killer many a game last year.

 

Indeed !!

 

CUBS are 26-9 when they score in the first inning,... 53-74 when they don't

[Balsa]

Hey fred, completely unrelated note, but how many runs were scored by the Cubs in "late" innings vs. the rest of the innings? Could you then compare that to the WS teams?

 

I only have this breakdown for the CUBS, so I can't really compare it to other teams for you.

 

            1    2    3    4    5    6    7    8    9   10   11   12   13   14   15   16   Total 											
CUBS       58   79   75  101   63  121   72   72   52    7    2    1    0    0    0    0     703
Opponents  91   88   61   71  115   65   74   85   53    0    7    4    0    0    0    0     714

 

That first inning was a killer many a game last year.

 

Fred: That'll do nicely...in fact that's better because it was every team the Cubs played against.

 

CubinNY: That's particularly why I think the Cubs will be better this year. Because that first inning won't involve CPatt or Neifi!, instead seeing Juan Pierre and (hopefully) Todd Walker. That's where the Cubs lost big last year, and I think we've improved that area quite a bit.

 

Anyone know where they was a huge dropoff in the 5th inning? That just seems odd. 100 runs in the 4th, 121 in the 6th, but only 63 in the 5th...

[series65cubsfan]

Anyone know where they was a huge dropoff in the 5th inning? That just seems odd. 100 runs in the 4th, 121 in the 6th, but only 63 in the 5th...

 

 

Good point Balsa, you would almost think that the fifth inning would be the highest scoring because the batters had seen the pitcher a couple of times already. Furthermore, most pitcers would be, at my guess, into 70+ pitches. You never know with last year's 'swing early and swing often' philosophy but... interesting, nontheless.(sp?)

[Fred Hornkohl]

Anyone know where they was a huge dropoff in the 5th inning? That just seems odd. 100 runs in the 4th, 121 in the 6th, but only 63 in the 5th...

 

 

Good point Balsa, you would almost think that the fifth inning would be the highest scoring because the batters had seen the pitcher a couple of times already. Furthermore, most pitcers would be, at my guess, into 70+ pitches. You never know with last year's 'swing early and swing often' philosophy but... interesting, nontheless.(sp?)

 

I've never kept track of scoring by inning before this last season, so I don't have any history to compare it to. I'll be real insterested to see how this plays out in the coming year. Is there something of a trend to this, or is it completely random ?

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Hey fred, completely unrelated note, but how many runs were scored by the Cubs in "late" innings vs. the rest of the innings? Could you then compare that to the WS teams?

 

I only have this breakdown for the CUBS, so I can't really compare it to other teams for you.

 

            1    2    3    4    5    6    7    8    9   10   11   12   13   14   15   16   Total 											
CUBS       58   79   75  101   63  121   72   72   52    7    2    1    0    0    0    0     703
Opponents  91   88   61   71  115   65   74   85   53    0    7    4    0    0    0    0     714

 

Too bad we didn't get to the 10th every game.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Anyone know where they was a huge dropoff in the 5th inning? That just seems odd. 100 runs in the 4th, 121 in the 6th, but only 63 in the 5th...

 

Len: "And as we head into the 5th, it'll be Maddux, Perez, and Patterson."

[fromthestretch]

Anyone know where they was a huge dropoff in the 5th inning? That just seems odd. 100 runs in the 4th, 121 in the 6th, but only 63 in the 5th...

 

Len: "And as we head into the 5th, it'll be Maddux, Perez, and Patterson."

 

That's probably the best answer to a question I've ever seen on here.

[Balsa]

Anyone know where they was a huge dropoff in the 5th inning? That just seems odd. 100 runs in the 4th, 121 in the 6th, but only 63 in the 5th...

 

Len: "And as we head into the 5th, it'll be Maddux, Perez, and Patterson."

 

A funny answer, but wouldn't that be the 3rd or 4th inning?

[bmkhawk]

The fact that the bullpen next year could be very, very good...that is one of the reasons I think it is unfair to say Hendry has had an bad offseason. Eyre and Howry really solidify that pen. It could be a very special unit.

 

People are ripping on Hendry must be doing so essentially because they aren't happy about who will be the starting RF. Not that I necessarily am happy about Jones, but there is more to the offseason than just one position.

[Magnetic Curses]

The fact that the bullpen next year could be very, very good...that is one of the reasons I think it is unfair to say Hendry has had an bad offseason. Eyre and Howry really solidify that pen. It could be a very special unit.

 

People are ripping on Hendry must be doing so essentially because they aren't happy about who will be the starting RF. Not that I necessarily am happy about Jones, but there is more to the offseason than just one position.

 

i've been telling people this all along, although not with the same meaning as you.

 

we needed to upgrade OBP at several positions. i'd say that focusing on position-holes is stupid. if we decrease the rate that the team makes outs at, we will succeed. RF was a key ingredient in fixing team OBP, however, and management went after subpar solutions.

 

yes, he may have spent a lot of money to fix a perceived problem, but he didn't fix the biggest problem, which is team OBP.

 

if i were a GM, my motto would be: "I like guys who don't make outs".

[CubinNY]

The fact that the bullpen next year could be very, very good...that is one of the reasons I think it is unfair to say Hendry has had an bad offseason. Eyre and Howry really solidify that pen. It could be a very special unit.

 

Nothing, and I mean nothing that they have done in their respective careers makes either Eyre or Howry special. In fact, they are so unspecial that they are middle relievers. Middle relievers are middle releivers for a reason. I am sorry, I cannot get excited that Hendry went out and spent too much on middle relief. Middle relief is a crap shoot.

 

I hope they are special, but middle relief is not why the Cubs were a medicore team last year.

[Tim]

The fact that the bullpen next year could be very, very good...that is one of the reasons I think it is unfair to say Hendry has had an bad offseason. Eyre and Howry really solidify that pen. It could be a very special unit.

 

People are ripping on Hendry must be doing so essentially because they aren't happy about who will be the starting RF. Not that I necessarily am happy about Jones, but there is more to the offseason than just one position.

Looks to me like the Cubs outscored the opponents by 47 runs from the 6th inning and on (not counting extras). What's wrong with that?

[frostwyrm]

Hey fred, completely unrelated note, but how many runs were scored by the Cubs in "late" innings vs. the rest of the innings? Could you then compare that to the WS teams?

 

I only have this breakdown for the CUBS, so I can't really compare it to other teams for you.

 

            1    2    3    4    5    6    7    8    9   10   11   12   13   14   15   16   Total 											
CUBS       58   79   75  101   63  121   72   72   52    7    2    1    0    0    0    0     703
Opponents  91   88   61   71  115   65   74   85   53    0    7    4    0    0    0    0     714

 

 

 

That first inning was a killer many a game last year.

 

Check it out, the Cubs were DEAD LAST in the majors in runs scored in the 1st inning with 58. There were only 2 other teams with less than 73. It's also worth noting that this milestone was achieved with Derrek Lee batting in the 1st inning of all but 18 games. Just underscores what an absolute sack of crap Neifi Perez is.

[bmkhawk]

The fact that the bullpen next year could be very, very good...that is one of the reasons I think it is unfair to say Hendry has had an bad offseason. Eyre and Howry really solidify that pen. It could be a very special unit.

 

People are ripping on Hendry must be doing so essentially because they aren't happy about who will be the starting RF. Not that I necessarily am happy about Jones, but there is more to the offseason than just one position.

Looks to me like the Cubs outscored the opponents by 47 runs from the 6th inning and on (not counting extras). What's wrong with that?

 

That's 12 runs an inning over the course of a year. What's wrong with improving that number? Or, to put it in other words, what is wrong with going from having an average to good pen to a good to great pen? It still improves the team, correct?

[frostwyrm]

The fact that the bullpen next year could be very, very good...that is one of the reasons I think it is unfair to say Hendry has had an bad offseason. Eyre and Howry really solidify that pen. It could be a very special unit.

 

People are ripping on Hendry must be doing so essentially because they aren't happy about who will be the starting RF. Not that I necessarily am happy about Jones, but there is more to the offseason than just one position.

Looks to me like the Cubs outscored the opponents by 47 runs from the 6th inning and on (not counting extras). What's wrong with that?

 

What was it you said a while back, IIRC it was "relief pitching is one third of 35% of the game"?

[bmkhawk]

edit

[Diffusion]

Check it out, the Cubs were DEAD LAST in the majors in runs scored in the 1st inning with 58. There were only 2 other teams with less than 73. It's also worth noting that this milestone was achieved with Derrek Lee batting in the 1st inning of all but 18 games. Just underscores what an absolute sack of crap Neifi Perez is.

 

Using those numbers, average team scored 93 runs in the first inning. Cubs scored 58, allowed 91.