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These baseball writers now have to "invent" stories to keep their names in the news until spring training. Furcal went for the most money in the fewest years so that he could be a free agent again at 30 years old.
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Posted
Not necessarily. They reserve the right to dictate how much can be spent for individual contracts (even if the amount does not exceed the overall budget).

 

Why? It's not their job to determine a player's value, not over a GM.

 

Ultimately, the GM answers to the President and the President answers to the Board (who answers to the stock holders). The Chicago Cubs is a business with a chain of command.

 

There is no business person (not even an entrepreneur) who doesn't have to answer to some higher authority (either directly or indirectly).

Posted
Not necessarily. They reserve the right to dictate how much can be spent for individual contracts (even if the amount does not exceed the overall budget).

 

Why? It's not their job to determine a player's value, not over a GM.

 

UK: I assume that you work for a living and have a boss, who has a boss, etc. Lets say you had authority to make payments to vendors up to $200. Your boss has authority to $400, his boss to $600, and so on.

 

Doesn't it make sense that the Cubs have a similar structure with regard to player contracts, and that the Bd. does not simply hand Jim the keys to $105 mill and say, "use it however you like." (particulalrly in light of the Cubs' performance over the last two seasons). Sounds perfectly reasonable to me.

Posted

This has nothing to do with arbitration, that's a separate issue,

 

I don't care how badly Hendry could mismanage a payroll, it isn't MacPhail's job to get his hands in the cookie jar.

 

Would you have the same laissez faire attitude towards them putting their noses where they don't belong.

 

I think trying to say that Andy has no right to be involved in contract talks is rather illogical and naive. The Cubs just went through the Sammy thing, Andy was very much involved. Just like Hendry should tell Dusty, I got you this guy to be the starting LF, Andy should get involved.

 

I would be pissed if they came up $500,000 short for 3 years on a really good player like Giles who would fill a big need position, but that's because they would have failed to sign a really good player at a big need position, not because Andy "stuck his nose where it didn't belong." Talk about hyperbole. He's not the president's wife determining tax policy. He's very much involved, and should be. Everybody has different levels of input. The top guy should have final say, and get involved when he things it's necessary, that is why he is the top guy. It's not like he's muddling up every move they try to make. If Hendry was willing to trade Pie, Hill, Guzman and Pawelek for Scott Podsednik because he knew he had to "win now" or lose his job, I'd expect Andy to step in and enforce organizational philosophy.

 

Nothing naive or illogical about it. This isn't a spot for MacPhail to initiate his clause as the enforcer.

 

Furcal's contract demands would've fit under the Cubs budget, I'm sure both him and Hendry both agreed that Furcal should be the main target. Now, there would be no doubt that it would have been overpaying, but that Hendry's mistake to potentially make.

 

I also disagree with Hendry telling Dusty who he should play and who he shouldn't, leave it up to Dusty regradless of how much I disagree with it.

 

If they were in conjunction that Furcal is the prime target, whomever decided against increasing the offer crossed the line as far as interfering.

 

Called a hyperbole or whatever stupid remark you want, but that should've been a Hendry decision w/out someone stepping in. It is up to the GM to set the parameters.

 

Hoops, by saying you're glad they didn't spend extra to get Furcal, either you're content with upper management clouding the role of Hendry or you're ignoring the principle of it.

Posted

This has nothing to do with arbitration, that's a separate issue,

 

I don't care how badly Hendry could mismanage a payroll, it isn't MacPhail's job to get his hands in the cookie jar.

 

Would you have the same laissez faire attitude towards them putting their noses where they don't belong.

 

I think trying to say that Andy has no right to be involved in contract talks is rather illogical and naive. The Cubs just went through the Sammy thing, Andy was very much involved. Just like Hendry should tell Dusty, I got you this guy to be the starting LF, Andy should get involved.

 

I would be pissed if they came up $500,000 short for 3 years on a really good player like Giles who would fill a big need position, but that's because they would have failed to sign a really good player at a big need position, not because Andy "stuck his nose where it didn't belong." Talk about hyperbole. He's not the president's wife determining tax policy. He's very much involved, and should be. Everybody has different levels of input. The top guy should have final say, and get involved when he things it's necessary, that is why he is the top guy. It's not like he's muddling up every move they try to make. If Hendry was willing to trade Pie, Hill, Guzman and Pawelek for Scott Podsednik because he knew he had to "win now" or lose his job, I'd expect Andy to step in and enforce organizational philosophy.

 

Nothing naive or illogical about it. This isn't a spot for MacPhail to initiate his clause as the enforcer.

 

Furcal's contract demands would've fit under the Cubs budget, I'm sure both him and Hendry both agreed that Furcal should be the main target. Now, there would be no doubt that it would have been overpaying, but that Hendry's mistake to potentially make.

 

I also disagree with Hendry telling Dusty who he should play and who he shouldn't, leave it up to Dusty regradless of how much I disagree with it.

 

If they were in conjunction that Furcal is the prime target, whomever decided against increasing the offer crossed the line as far as interfering.

 

Called a hyperbole or whatever stupid remark you want, but that should've been a Hendry decision w/out someone stepping in. It is up to the GM to set the parameters.

 

Hoops, by saying you're glad they didn't spend extra to get Furcal, either you're content with upper management clouding the role of Hendry or you're ignoring the principle of it.

 

You seem to be basing the whole argument on the premise that little georgie is accurate. I find that a huge stretch. George guaranteed people that Maddux wouldn't sign with the Cubs, god, he even missed the Marte trade today. He is not a good source and he works for a lousy, inaccurate, biased station. I wouldn't put two cents into his claim. History shows that they aren't reliable.

Posted
Not necessarily. They reserve the right to dictate how much can be spent for individual contracts (even if the amount does not exceed the overall budget).

 

Why? It's not their job to determine a player's value, not over a GM.

 

Ultimately, the GM answers to the President and the President answers to the Board (who answers to the stock holders). The Chicago Cubs is a business with a chain of command.

 

There is no business person (not even an entrepreneur) who doesn't have to answer to some higher authority (either directly or indirectly).

 

Hendry has higher authorities above him and they set the budget for him, they should leave it at that. MacPhail should be able to make suggestions, but should not be in the role to have the final say over which players to sign and wish to pass on, which it comes down to in this case.

 

Hendry has people to answer to, they give a certain amount to allocate towards the payroll and how well he does w/that is largely how he is evaluated.

 

Hendry has a set limit in which to spend, how he spend it should be up to him.

Posted
Not necessarily. They reserve the right to dictate how much can be spent for individual contracts (even if the amount does not exceed the overall budget).

 

Why? It's not their job to determine a player's value, not over a GM.

 

Ultimately, the GM answers to the President and the President answers to the Board (who answers to the stock holders). The Chicago Cubs is a business with a chain of command.

 

There is no business person (not even an entrepreneur) who doesn't have to answer to some higher authority (either directly or indirectly).

 

Hendry has higher authorities above him and they set the budget for him, they should leave it at that. MacPhail should be able to make suggestions, but should not be in the role to have the final say over which players to sign and wish to pass on, which it comes down to in this case.

 

Hendry has people to answer to, they give a certain amount to allocate towards the payroll and how well he does w/that is largely how he is evaluated.

 

Hendry has a set limit in which to spend, how he spend it should be up to him.

 

I know that I sort of asked this in my other post, but do you work? if you do, do you work for a corp.? Do they run their business this way? It just is not (typically) how major corps. do things. If they do, there's usually trouble.

Posted
Doesn't it make sense that the Cubs have a similar structure with regard to player contracts, and that the Bd. does not simply hand Jim the keys to $105 mill and say, "use it however you like." (particulalrly in light of the Cubs' performance over the last two seasons). Sounds perfectly reasonable to me.

 

No, b/c that's not a proper delegation of duties. That chain of command never ends, there has to be a break along it.

 

(Now here's an extreme hyperbole) If you have the CEO of the Trib. wanting to play GM would he rightfully be able to say who to get?

 

I don't think so, b/c it's not area of expertise.

 

MacPhail or anyone else higher up has not talked to the scouts Hendry has or did the dirty work behind the scenes to get as accurate of a gauge as did Hendry in deciding whether to go after Furcal.

 

If it Hendry's job to all to do the research, it is his job to make the call.

 

Now, if the higher ups did all of the work that Hendry did and have the same level of experience and made a decision that's one thing.

 

There's no chance anyone besides Hendry did the nec. research that Hendry in deciding to go after Furcal.

Posted
I know that I sort of asked this in my other post, but do you work? if you do, do you work for a corp.? Do they run their business this way? It just is not (typically) how major corps. do things. If they do, there's usually trouble.

 

Comparing a F500 corp. to a sports organization is apples and oranges as far as developing and implementing effective models.

Posted
Little Georgie making up stuff again?

 

Grow up. That's a serious accusation of someone in the media. People lose careers over made-up stories.

 

He doesn't need to make up a story. All he needs is a completely unreliable source and he'll run with it.

Posted

Did any of you hear him a few hours after breaking the story? Apparently this information was not meant for public knowledge and he messed up. He apologized to Paul Kinzer and his boss.

 

That's a pretty big no-no. I wouldn't be surprised to see the Score have another reporter soon...

 

Apologies if this was already said.

Posted
One of the things Hendry said on MLB Radio yesterday was that the Cubs generally set their maximum, offer it and then hope for the best.

 

HA!

 

HENDRY: Okay, board, what's the absolute maximum amount of money you'll give me to sign a middle reliever?

MacPhail: $12m is the absolute maximum, Jim

HENDRY: Cool

...

A few minutes later...

HENDRY: Hello, Bob, glad you returned my call! Yes, I've just spoken to the board, and I would like to offer you $12m!

HOWRY: For one year?

HENDRY: Erm, sure.

HOWRY: I'm not sure that I could live with the expectations that would come with me earning that kind of money. Also, you might be fired if you make that kind of an offer, and I want to sign many contracts with you. Hey, how about you make it $12m over three years. They won't fire you for that. Then in three years time, we can do this all over again! That way I can get two $12m contracts!

HENDRY: Wow, Bob, you're good at this contract negotiating stuff.

HOWRY: So do we have a deal?

HENDRY: Let me just make a phone call. [puts Bob on hold]

 

HENDRY: Hey, Dusty, how's it going?

BAKER: Dude, I haven't caught any striped bass today. It's like batting Corey Patterson leadoff, one day you...

HENDRY: Would you like a $12m reliever in your bullpen? [Crosses fingers and hopes for the best]

BAKER: ...and then I said to him, "whaddya know, your girlfriend ends cheats on you with a black guy because he can stand the heat better, dude!" So I...

HENDRY: Dusty?

BAKER: Yeh?

HENDRY: Would you like a $12m reliever in your bullpen? [Crosses fingers and hopes for the best]

BAKER: Sure, whatever, dude. Anyway, let me finish my story, so it's like when Reggie Jackson went into hospital and excavated...

Hendry hangs up

 

HENDRY: Bob! Hey, well, I just all cleared it with Dusty! So, would you like to sign a $12m contract for one year? [Crosses fingers and hopes for best]

HOWRY: No, Jim, like I said, it's got to be three years, I can get more money in the long-run that way, and you won't get fired, only frowned upon, though only for a few weeks, because then someone will give Antonio Alfonseca a $21.5m deal and everyone will talk about what a bargain I was...

HENDRY: I really like the way you're looking out for me.

HOWRY: It's nothing.

HENDRY: So, $12m/3yrs?

HOWRY: Sure. Fax me over the contract!

 

 

According to my sources, this is exactly how the Howry deal went down. My sources are more reliable than George Offman.

Posted
One of the things Hendry said on MLB Radio yesterday was that the Cubs generally set their maximum, offer it and then hope for the best.

 

HA!

 

HENDRY: Okay, board, what's the absolute maximum amount of money you'll give me to sign a middle reliever?

MacPhail: $12m is the absolute maximum, Jim

HENDRY: Cool

...

A few minutes later...

HENDRY: Hello, Bob, glad you returned my call! Yes, I've just spoken to the board, and I would like to offer you $12m!

HOWRY: For one year?

HENDRY: Erm, sure.

HOWRY: I'm not sure that I could live with the expectations that would come with me earning that kind of money. Also, you might be fired if you make that kind of an offer, and I want to sign many contracts with you. Hey, how about you make it $12m over three years. They won't fire you for that. Then in three years time, we can do this all over again! That way I can get two $12m contracts!

HENDRY: Wow, Bob, you're good at this contract negotiating stuff.

HOWRY: So do we have a deal?

HENDRY: Let me just make a phone call. [puts Bob on hold]

 

HENDRY: Hey, Dusty, how's it going?

BAKER: Dude, I haven't caught any striped bass today. It's like batting Corey Patterson leadoff, one day you...

HENDRY: Would you like a $12m reliever in your bullpen? [Crosses fingers and hopes for the best]

BAKER: ...and then I said to him, "whaddya know, your girlfriend ends cheats on you with a black guy because he can stand the heat better, dude!" So I...

HENDRY: Dusty?

BAKER: Yeh?

HENDRY: Would you like a $12m reliever in your bullpen? [Crosses fingers and hopes for the best]

BAKER: Sure, whatever, dude. Anyway, let me finish my story, so it's like when Reggie Jackson went into hospital and excavated...

Hendry hangs up

 

HENDRY: Bob! Hey, well, I just all cleared it with Dusty! So, would you like to sign a $12m contract for one year? [Crosses fingers and hopes for best]

HOWRY: No, Jim, like I said, it's got to be three years, I can get more money in the long-run that way, and you won't get fired, only frowned upon, though only for a few weeks, because then someone will give Antonio Alfonseca a $21.5m deal and everyone will talk about what a bargain I was...

HENDRY: I really like the way you're looking out for me.

HOWRY: It's nothing.

HENDRY: So, $12m/3yrs?

HOWRY: Sure. Fax me over the contract!

 

 

According to my sources, this is exactly how the Howry deal went down. My sources are more reliable than George Offman.

Nice. The sad thing is that I think the Howry signing is my favorite offseason move so far. (Apart from DFAing Macias, that is.)

Posted
One of the things Hendry said on MLB Radio yesterday was that the Cubs generally set their maximum, offer it and then hope for the best.

 

HA!

 

HENDRY: Okay, board, what's the absolute maximum amount of money you'll give me to sign a middle reliever?

MacPhail: $12m is the absolute maximum, Jim

HENDRY: Cool

...

A few minutes later...

HENDRY: Hello, Bob, glad you returned my call! Yes, I've just spoken to the board, and I would like to offer you $12m!

HOWRY: For one year?

HENDRY: Erm, sure.

HOWRY: I'm not sure that I could live with the expectations that would come with me earning that kind of money. Also, you might be fired if you make that kind of an offer, and I want to sign many contracts with you. Hey, how about you make it $12m over three years. They won't fire you for that. Then in three years time, we can do this all over again! That way I can get two $12m contracts!

HENDRY: Wow, Bob, you're good at this contract negotiating stuff.

HOWRY: So do we have a deal?

HENDRY: Let me just make a phone call. [puts Bob on hold]

 

HENDRY: Hey, Dusty, how's it going?

BAKER: Dude, I haven't caught any striped bass today. It's like batting Corey Patterson leadoff, one day you...

HENDRY: Would you like a $12m reliever in your bullpen? [Crosses fingers and hopes for the best]

BAKER: ...and then I said to him, "whaddya know, your girlfriend ends cheats on you with a black guy because he can stand the heat better, dude!" So I...

HENDRY: Dusty?

BAKER: Yeh?

HENDRY: Would you like a $12m reliever in your bullpen? [Crosses fingers and hopes for the best]

BAKER: Sure, whatever, dude. Anyway, let me finish my story, so it's like when Reggie Jackson went into hospital and excavated...

Hendry hangs up

 

HENDRY: Bob! Hey, well, I just all cleared it with Dusty! So, would you like to sign a $12m contract for one year? [Crosses fingers and hopes for best]

HOWRY: No, Jim, like I said, it's got to be three years, I can get more money in the long-run that way, and you won't get fired, only frowned upon, though only for a few weeks, because then someone will give Antonio Alfonseca a $21.5m deal and everyone will talk about what a bargain I was...

HENDRY: I really like the way you're looking out for me.

HOWRY: It's nothing.

HENDRY: So, $12m/3yrs?

HOWRY: Sure. Fax me over the contract!

 

 

According to my sources, this is exactly how the Howry deal went down. My sources are more reliable than George Offman.

Nice. The sad thing is that I think the Howry signing is my favorite offseason move so far. (Apart from DFAing Macias, that is.)

 

Gah, I should have used Neifi. I knew I was forgetting someone. I wish I didn't.

Posted
Did any of you hear him a few hours after breaking the story? Apparently this information was not meant for public knowledge and he messed up. He apologized to Paul Kinzer and his boss.

 

That's a pretty big no-no. I wouldn't be surprised to see the Score have another reporter soon...

 

Apologies if this was already said.

 

No, I'm not sure what you mean. Are you saying that Ofman apologized later about telling this story? If so, that wouldn't surprise me. Remember, Kinzer and Hendry (and the Cubs) have an ongoing relationship to consider. Kinzer is also Aramis' agent so it's not a good idea to have a story out there that tries to make the organization look badly.

 

Also, even if the story is false, it would behoove Hendry to ignore it (rather than dispute its merits) because its a lose-lose proposition. Kinzer and JH need to maintain a positive working relationship. He certainly couldn't blast him the way Schurholtz (sp?) did.

Posted
Did any of you hear him a few hours after breaking the story? Apparently this information was not meant for public knowledge and he messed up. He apologized to Paul Kinzer and his boss.

 

That's a pretty big no-no. I wouldn't be surprised to see the Score have another reporter soon...

 

Apologies if this was already said.

 

No, I'm not sure what you mean. Are you saying that Ofman apologized later about telling this story? If so, that wouldn't surprise me. Remember, Kinzer and Hendry (and the Cubs) have an ongoing relationship to consider. Kinzer is also Aramis' agent so it's not a good idea to have a story out there that tries to make the organization look badly.

 

Also, even if the story is false, it would behoove Hendry to ignore it (rather than dispute its merits) because its a lose-lose proposition. Kinzer and JH need to maintain a positive working relationship. He certainly couldn't blast him the way Schurholtz (sp?) did.

That's exactly it. After he got the information he reported it, only to find out later that it was told to him in confidence, and that it was not meant for public knowledge.

 

Basically none of us were supposed to have found out what happened behind the scenes, and his big mouth opened up and fired away secrets he wasn't supposed to tell.

Posted
Did any of you hear him a few hours after breaking the story? Apparently this information was not meant for public knowledge and he messed up. He apologized to Paul Kinzer and his boss.

 

That's a pretty big no-no. I wouldn't be surprised to see the Score have another reporter soon...

 

Apologies if this was already said.

 

No, I'm not sure what you mean. Are you saying that Ofman apologized later about telling this story? If so, that wouldn't surprise me. Remember, Kinzer and Hendry (and the Cubs) have an ongoing relationship to consider. Kinzer is also Aramis' agent so it's not a good idea to have a story out there that tries to make the organization look badly.

 

Also, even if the story is false, it would behoove Hendry to ignore it (rather than dispute its merits) because its a lose-lose proposition. Kinzer and JH need to maintain a positive working relationship. He certainly couldn't blast him the way Schurholtz (sp?) did.

That's exactly it. After he got the information he reported it, only to find out later that it was told to him in confidence, and that it was not meant for public knowledge.

 

Basically none of us were supposed to have found out what happened behind the scenes, and his big mouth opened up and fired away secrets he wasn't supposed to tell.

 

Thanks for the information! I wish I had heard it because The Score was playing the story up for a while during Boers & Bernstein and all the updates. In their typical fashion, they were giving the Cubs the business so, it would have been nice to hear Ofman eat crow.

Posted
Did any of you hear him a few hours after breaking the story? Apparently this information was not meant for public knowledge and he messed up. He apologized to Paul Kinzer and his boss.

 

That's a pretty big no-no. I wouldn't be surprised to see the Score have another reporter soon...

 

Apologies if this was already said.

 

No, I'm not sure what you mean. Are you saying that Ofman apologized later about telling this story? If so, that wouldn't surprise me. Remember, Kinzer and Hendry (and the Cubs) have an ongoing relationship to consider. Kinzer is also Aramis' agent so it's not a good idea to have a story out there that tries to make the organization look badly.

 

Also, even if the story is false, it would behoove Hendry to ignore it (rather than dispute its merits) because its a lose-lose proposition. Kinzer and JH need to maintain a positive working relationship. He certainly couldn't blast him the way Schurholtz (sp?) did.

 

The story that George Ofman reported was also on WGN Radio(Kaplan) last night. So much for it being false and made up, if Kaplan reports it too. Big difference between reporting a false story and reporting private negotiations. The agents and Hendry are both big boys and would never be so petty to allow this story to get in their way.

 

The Cubs aren't immune to trying to float stories out there themselves. Remember the Sammy tape of him leaving early? Did anyone ever actually see that tape? If so, please speak up. Wonder if the Cubs were just calling Sammy's bluff?

 

Poor Oldcubsfan, Bruce got scooped again on a Chicago Cubs story. For someone who listens to Bristol Radio, you sure follow The Score alot. That's okay, I understand they have more than 70,000 listeners signed up to listen over the web. You have plenty of company.

Posted
Did any of you hear him a few hours after breaking the story? Apparently this information was not meant for public knowledge and he messed up. He apologized to Paul Kinzer and his boss.

 

That's a pretty big no-no. I wouldn't be surprised to see the Score have another reporter soon...

 

Apologies if this was already said.

 

No, I'm not sure what you mean. Are you saying that Ofman apologized later about telling this story? If so, that wouldn't surprise me. Remember, Kinzer and Hendry (and the Cubs) have an ongoing relationship to consider. Kinzer is also Aramis' agent so it's not a good idea to have a story out there that tries to make the organization look badly.

 

Also, even if the story is false, it would behoove Hendry to ignore it (rather than dispute its merits) because its a lose-lose proposition. Kinzer and JH need to maintain a positive working relationship. He certainly couldn't blast him the way Schurholtz (sp?) did.

 

The story that George Ofman reported was also on WGN Radio(Kaplan) last night. So much for it being false and made up, if Kaplan reports it too. Big difference between reporting a false story and reporting private negotiations. The agents and Hendry are both big boys and would never be so petty to allow this story to get in their way.

 

The Cubs aren't immune to trying to float stories out there themselves. Remember the Sammy tape of him leaving early? Did anyone ever actually see that tape? If so, please speak up. Wonder if the Cubs were just calling Sammy's bluff?

 

Poor Oldcubsfan, Bruce got scooped again on a Chicago Cubs story. For someone who listens to Bristol Radio, you sure follow The Score alot. That's okay, I understand they have more than 70,000 listeners signed up to listen over the web. You have plenty of company.

 

LOL, how predictable was this?

Posted
Secret or not this is a concern to me. It tells me that our GM does not have free reign. He is being micro-managed by his boss.

 

That's business and it doesn't surprise me if it's true. However, I think the idea that he's "micromanaged" is a bit harsh. This particular situation was a cause for concern (for lack of a better term) for his bosses because they were breaking other long held team philosophies to accomodate Furcal. The Cubs don't like to give 5 year deals and in this case, they included an option for a sixth year. All-in-all, I think they went above and beyond to get Furcal and they would have signed him if the Dodgers had not grossly overpaid.

Posted
Secret or not this is a concern to me. It tells me that our GM does not have free reign. He is being micro-managed by his boss.

 

When financial issues are concerned, most GMs do not have "free reign".

 

Boston ownership squashed the ARod deal due to finances. NYY ownership micromanages far more than Andy and the Trib. Florida ownership gets involved heavily with payroll matters, and have won 2 WS. Reinsdorf plays a huge role in every major acquisition. Arizona's ownership practically held the GM's hand for years.

 

I can't believe how overblown people are making this possibly made up or exaggerated story.

 

Schuerholz might be the only GM I can think of who gets a budget and can do as he pleases with no ownership meddling. Hendry hasn't proven he deserves an ounce of the freedom of the best GM in baseball.

Posted

Forgive me if this was mentioned before.

 

There are other costs beyond the salary that would have been paid to Furcal. For a contract of that length, there may have been insurance issues or other things. It's not inappropriate for ownership to have final approval.

 

It may have indeed been a foolish decision without merit, but we can't know that without all of the information.

Posted
Schuerholz might be the only GM I can think of who gets a budget and can do as he pleases with no ownership meddling. Hendry hasn't proven he deserves an ounce of the freedom of the best GM in baseball.

 

Something I was thinking about the other day: Could Schuerholz be convinced to leave his situation for maybe a team presidency position, or do you think his freedom in his position has made him a little too comfortable to consider a move?

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