Rcal10
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That is a weak argument though. I mean tell me the last time the Dodgers signed a pitcher for 12 years before a few days ago. When was the last time anyone paid a $700M before Ohtani signed. Since Jed has been in charge what prospects did he really have to bring back someone of Cease’s ability. Also, why would he have done that previously? Ins weren’t not looking to compete. They were looking to build. So why trade prospects for proven talent? I do have my doubts that this particular idea will result in anything. But not because he hasn’t done something like this yet. I just think it is hard for 2 teams to agree on values. Maybe Jed is overvaluing the Cubs prospects too. But I don’t think he is afraid to make a deal and past years have nothing to do with now, IMO.
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Agreed. And I am not so sure he is available.
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When you plug guys into BBTV, which several guys have referenced here, to determine if trade values are equal, it looks like Cease should cost something like Brown, Wicks and Alcantara. And if the Sox wanted to move Moncada and his salary, he is actually negative value. That sort of deal would work for just Alcantara and Wicks. I know that site isn’t something that should be used to make up deals, but I would think it shouldn’t be that far off. I would do a deal with or without Moncada.
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I don’t want to lose Morel, PCA or Horton. If they can put something together without those 3 I am good with Cease. Does Wicks, Brown and Alcantara get it done. Do they need to add another guy. Not top 10 guy. If Moncada is added, I think those 3 are more than enough. .
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This is kind of my views. Sure, most free agents signed eventually end their careers hindering the team they are on for the last year or two of a deal. Sure, guys being traded shouldn’t cost as much as some do, but in order to get the players you want you have to overpay. My fear is Jed will stick to his beliefs and therefore not get much done. Just look at the couple of trades so far. Soto cost more than people thought. So did Glasnow when you realize they also took on another salary for a 4th outfielder. I agree with what people are suggesting the Cubs should trade to get guys. I know it sounds right. But I am not sure it is. Which may be why Jed hasn’t made a deal yet. As far as free agents go I am not comfortable with giving any of the top 3 a 6yr $150+ deal. And maybe Jed isn’t either. But someone will. So the Cubs don’t get any of those guys. I don’t want to give Bellinger any more than something like 6/$150-$160, or Chapman 4/$92M. But again, if Jed doesn’t someone else will. If this FO sticks to what a guy is really worth and won’t sign him for more than that, they won’t sign many. If they stick to only trading equal value of young talent for a proven talent they won’t make many trades. We can all say good for them to not overpay. But what we will be watching this year is a high 70’s to low 80’s win team unless they extend beyond their comfort to acquire additional talent.
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I would stick to the first guys you mentioned. Don’t think I would do Brown. The problem is I think someone will give more. I have said this before, but in mlb trade rumor the question was asked. Morel+ Brown and someone else(maybe Canario) for Alonso, who says no? The response was the Mets. The thought being they can get more. I think what you offered is fair. But is it because we are both Cubs fans? Or is the guy doing the mlb chat just nuts or very east coast biased?
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What would you be willing to give for 1 year of Alonso?
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It isn’t so much how many years I would go or even how many Jed is comfortable going. It is what would be needed for Bellinger. I think if you could get him for 7/$182 AND they did plan on dealing PCA to upgrade elsewhere, this is something I would consider. Yes, might be a few years more than is comfortable, but just trying to be realistic with what the market might be for him.
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Solid recap. We just don’t know what the Cubs are comfortable spending, how much minor league talent they are willing to part with and who they are truly interested in. There are all kinds of scenarios that could give the Cubs the best team in the central. I think the least likely is the trade for a high end pitcher with some years of control left. I think that cost too much prospect capital, unless they sign Bellinger and use PCA. A guy like Luzardo, Valdez or Cease is going to be expensive!
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Maybe, maybe not. But what does that have to do with upgrading 3rd base? Are you suggesting not getting Chapman? That is fine, but say that. They could just roll those guys out there instead. Maybe then they do spend more elsewhere. Maybe Imanaga or Montgomery are an option. Maybe they go pitching heavy. That is ok too. I only posted what I think they will do. Not the only thing they can do. Personally I don’t like Wisdom much. And for me they need more pop at 3rd than Madrigal. Chapman is by far, not the ideal guy. But he is a 20 homer guy who plays great defense. I think, because he isn’t a perfect fit for the Cubs people undervalue him here.
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Ok, now that Yamamoto is signed the the market start to take shape? I can see something like a Cubs trade to the Guardians for Naylor and Beiber. Maybe sign Giolitto or Stroman and then either Chapman or Hoskins. Add a pen arm or two and that is the off season. I think the signing will be Chapman because if it is Hoskins, Morel would have to play 3rd. Porbably not what most want but they would have a great infield defense if Chapman was at 3rd and Naylor at 1st. Plus great outfield defense if/when PCA comes up. Maybe there will be enough money to even get Hader as the pen arm. Not my choice to spend that on a closer, but I can see that happening if the money is there. I think if they did this they would have a decent chance of winning the division. They don’t lose many prospects either.
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Yoshinobu Yamamoto to...the Dodgers? Really? Again?
Rcal10 replied to UMFan83's topic in Chicago Cubs Talk
Than the Royals are the only small market team to win then WS in the last 20 years. Since when are the White Sox a small market team? -
Really. We are still going to bash people for speaking. Why don’t you give it a rest.
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I have no issues with him going to the Yankees. Hope he does. But I don’t see the Cubs going after any of the top 3 lefties once this is done. My sights are on Giolito or a Stroman reunion. And I am not sure Stroman is a possibility. With the FO. But I would take him.
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This is what bothers me with the supposed Cubs plan. If they are waiting on the market to dictate which way they go, it holds up other things. Using Hoskins as an example, if they did sign him wouldn’t that mean they probably don’t trade for Naylor? Of if they do is Morel then the 3rd baseman and Hoskins the DH? But if they signed Chapman they can trade for Naylor and just leave Morel at DH. If they wait and end up with Bellinger that is a whole other route. Do they keep PCA and just rotate outfielders as DH? So then is Morel the 3rd baseman? I realize PCA might start in the minors, but what about when he finally does come up? I get the waiting on a pitcher to drop. That doesn’t change the roster construction. Personally I think the top 3 will be overpriced and we will be looking at Giolito, Stoman and/or a pitcher via trade. But waiting on a hitter does alter other moves. Time to pick a lane and be a large market team and sign someone and build the roster.
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I just posted 3/$45, but I can see something like yours too.
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I think he will be more annually. Maybe 3/$45?
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Giolito does fit what I think the Cubs will spend on a pitcher. He might even take a 2 or 3 year deal. Again, what I expect the Cubs to do.
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Cubs FO answer…. Whoever signs the cheapest deal. Sorry! Personally I don’t see them signing any of them.
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I am retired as well. So I agree, it is awesome. I come here to talk Cubs, not argue.
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I think there is overreaction both ways. There is definitely a lot of complaining about the FO before things have been completed. But there is also an overreaction by some to defend Jed or to suggest a person is wrong for feeling how they feel. This happened to me a few days ago when I posted by views on how the off season would end up. I was accused of freaking out and told I need a break. Later I was told I am always coming in to post negative comments. Which, frankly, is not true. I have defended Jed and the FO plenty. I was probably one of only a few who thought he did a decent job last year and, in fact, left PSD for a bit because of so much negative talk. What people need to realize is it is ok to bitch about the team. That doesn’t mean you are some sort of an idiot who only wants to bash the FO. This site is for discussion. Someone’s belief of what is going on is discussion. Yes, not every thing that happens means Jed is an idiot. I, who was called negative, have already defended Jed not getting the Japanese relief pitcher. Put I don’t think people who get mad about it are wrong. It is their feeling at that moment. The discussion can be to agree or disagree not attack someone for posting. And, maybe people can settle down a little on everything being negative.
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Is there a point to this comment?
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There truly is not enough data to make this statement confidently. No one else offered that. So maybe he isn’t anything special. If he was he would have gotten a lot more.
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Do we know if he is any good. Not like other teams wanted him either. Everyone who signs with another team other than the Cubs, doesn’t mean the Cubs were wrong not getting him. If he went for just over $5M a year for 4 years, maybe there are real questions about him.
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I get that. And don’t disagree. But you don’t trade PCA, Brown, Triantos, Canario and Alcántara for Valdez. I would be fine dealing PCA if they got Bellinger. Maybe him, Triantos and Wesneski for Bieber, Clase and Naylor. If you have to add another prospect, it isn’t top 10 guy. That is taking advantage of his value.
