Rcal10

I get this. And I like the idea of Lopez, Minter and Yates. But even after that there should be some cash for a bench bat. We are using $40M like it is this line in the sand. I think at that number they are $10M+ short of the line. I don’t expect Flaherty or Scott. I don’t see the Cubs going long term in a pen arm. And I am skeptical of Flaherty for the reasons you provided above. I also don’t think Castillo is possible unless another team is involved. Seattle wants major league talent back. If you like the idea of Hoffman converted then something like Hoffman, Yates and Minter should be good for you. And that would definitely leave several million to add one bat who can play 1st and 3rd. Since you put a few scenarios together, how would one of these look: Cease/Kirby/Gilbert/Keller/King/Ober Beuhler with Yates and Minter. There is also some pitchers in Tampa like Baz, and Bradley they can trade for. I can see $15M to $20M for a starter and that same number for the pen. But if you go $20M on one the second will be closer to $15. That would leave plenty for a bench bat. I agree with you, the arms come first. I just think there are ways to get those arms without spending all the $40M and be able to get at least 1 guy who can fill in at 1st and 3rd who has major league experience.

I don’t think they are going to get a starting pitcher they have to pay for several years. I really think they plan on extending Tucker and I am not sure they can carry him for $40m, Swanson for $27M and a pitcher they pay $23M a year too. Maybe why I don’t expect all $40M going to the staff. Same thing with a relief arm. I doubt they sign one long term, like Scott. And to me the Tucker extension is most important. I do agree with you about the outfield. My original thought was just one bat to cover 1st and 3rd. Either switch hit or right handed. Others jumped in for a 2nd bat who is an outfielder. I see that point, but I am more in favor of 2 pen arms and a starting pitcher and one bench. So we really are close to the same here. The last point I will make is I don’t think throwing money at pen arms automatically means the pen is good. I think people suggesting this really don’t realize how unstable a pen is. From one year to the next guys are good than bad. Unless they go with an elite closer(and that would mean multiple years at a high salary) I don’t think it makes much difference if you sign a guy for $4M or $14M. The higher priced guy fails as often. Which, again, is probably why I don’t see them spending $40M on arms. One thing I am certain of, however, is the first time the pen loses the game people will be complaining about it. Complaining about the pen is a yearly ritual across fan bases of all 30 teams.

They have $40M to spend. What pitching is going to cost $40M? Why not one bench guy with major league experience. This fan base complained all year about Mastrobouni and Wisdom being in the bench and now they don’t want to spend any money to put a proven major leaguer in the bench. There is enough money available for 2 pen arms and a starting pitcher and still get a bench bat. No one is suggesting spending $20M on two bench bats. Just one bat with a max payroll of $5M to $8M is not going to stop them from getting a solid starting pitcher and a couple of pen arms. If they can do it for less that is fine. But there is no sense skimping on a bench bat to spend on pitching. Plenty of money for both.

That is my thought. Then one more pen arm and they are done until Sasaki decides.

Canario, Workman and Cowles are not the same as Baez, Russell, Contreras and Bryant. All of those guys came up to start. The guys you want on the bench aren’t even the best prospects the Cubs have.

Because they have 4 guys who may pitch 550- 600 innings between them I would like to get a guy you can count on for 170+ innings. I understand it could work. And you have great examples of it working. But I would rather they get a guy who is a starting pitcher now. I would rather they get an established starting pitcher..

I can see the argument against spending big on a bench bat. But I would like one, at least. Maybe spend $32M to $35M on a starting pitcher and 2 pen arms and $5M to $8M on someone who can cover 3rd and 1st. Castro makes $6.8. The bench would be Kelly, Canario, Workman and Castro. I don’t like the idea of all 3 non back up catcher spots taken by unproven players.

While we are at it, why not get Castro too?

I like Lopez too. But he does make $21M a year for 3 more years. If they got him they would only have $19M left to spend on improving the pen, a guy for cover for Shaw and at times Busch and maybe another bench bat or another pen arm.

Why do the Cubs need to think like that? Why not trade for or pay a real starting pitcher? They have $40M to work with and still plenty of prospects they can trade. As a major market team why do they have to mess around and try to fit square pegs in round holes? Just get the good starting pitcher.

But that is still 4 weeks away. I just don’t see him waiting 4 weeks on a guy that, at best, they have about a 15% chance of getting. By then all other options might be gone. I really doubt any team is sitting back waiting on Sasaki. Even if the Cubs add another pitcher I am sure they will gladly find a spot for Sasaki if he chooses them.

If 2 years is on the table, I MIGHT do that. Nothing beyond 2 years. And at 2 the deal may have to be similar to Boyd’s deal. 2/$25 or 1/$15. That said, with the current staff I might rather get a guy they know will take the all 30+ times a year. I feel the current rotation shouldn’t be counted on for more than 105 starts. Because of that I think it is best to get a guy you can count on for 30+ starts. Buehler wouldn’t be that guy.

Got it. That makes more sense. That said, I don’t think it mattered with Tucker. Astros wanted Paredes last year and they had Bregman. I think that has they have traded for Arenado either he or Paredes would have moved to first. Astros were going to deal Tucker, regardless.

That fair. Maybe my excitement of him went a little too far. Didn’t check his minor league numbers. Just saw he was a second round pick and only 25. He also had decent slug in the majors. But forget about taking over for Nico in 26. He would still be a nice option in 25. I like it because he would be a cheap find allowing the Cubs to spend elsewhere.

I think he would be a great option. For one thing he would be cheap from a salary standpoint. Maybe instead of the prospect going for a pitcher it goes for him. Then the Cubs sign Beuhler. They would have a good amount of money for a few pen arms, and probably an upgrade over Canario, right handed bat to play the outfield. And if he hits, and Shaw hits it would allow them to trade Nico next year if they needed to.

It is really hard to find good fits. The teams who do have pitching want major league talent back. I think the Cubs want to deal from their minor league talent. Maybe the Rays? They seem to be an organization that thinks outside the box at times. Bradley, Littell, Baz? 🤷 Cubs seem to have a good working relationship with their FO. Maybe something can happen here? Keller is also available but not sure he would be a guy then ubs are looking for. Plus it is hard to trade in the division.!

This makes no sense. He said Arenado not accepting a trade to Houston was the main reason the Cubs got Tucker. Except the Cubs traded for Tucker before Arenado refused to waive his NTC. I couldn’t care less why Arenado didn’t go to Houston. That isn’t the point. I am just trying to understand why him not going made the Astros decide they had to trade Tucker. I assume he is suggesting that had Arenado allowed the trade to happen they wouldn’t have wanted Paredes. But since they were in on him at the deadline last year, when they had Bregman, that would have me believe they would put him at 1st. Just like what they would do now if Arenado did agree to a trade(or Arenado would love to first). As for the money involved, I read the Cardinals were kicking in $10M to $15M to get the deal done. Whether Arenado went to Houston or not has no bearing on them trading Tucker.

Could have been all of that on top of the Cubs deciding they had more money than they thought they did so they didn’t have to trade a prospect for a high ceiling, high injury risk, lower salaried pitcher.

So with Luzardo out of the picture now, who do the Cubs look too? Cease would be awesome, but not sure the cost and not sure the teams match up. Aren’t the padres planning on competing this year? They woukd want major league talent back. Seattle would also want major league talent back. So not sure about either of those teams. Maybe look to the Twins. They are said to be looking to cut payroll and still compete. Maybe a guy like Lopez works. Give them back Assad and Triantos for starters. Maybe add Canario or better. That gives them someone they can put in the rotation or the pen if they want to put Jax in the rotation, as well as a couple of prospects. It also lowers their team salary. They actually have a lot of interesting options. Ryan and Ober are also options. So is Jax, if the Cubs view him as a potential starter. But all of those guys don’t cost that much so moving them doesn’t save the Twins money. Lopez does. Back to Seattle, Castillo would be fine, but I don’t see a match. If the Cubs did get Castillo from Seattle another team would have to be involved who wanted a prospect. Not giving up Hoerner for him. Honestly I am not interested in trading any major league offense for a pitcher. Cubs need what they have. They need to get a pitcher in trade by using their minor league assets or sign a FA pitcher. Don’t touch the regular guys in the line up.

I am fine with this as well. I think this was a fallback in the event the Cubs had to eat more of Bellinger’s contract. Once they don’t have to eat much if it he may have become less appealing to the Cubs. They can aim higher and spend more on a pitcher. I love your idea on Cease. The issue is I really think he would only be for one year. And who do you have to trade for him for one year?

A trade is a possibility, but that would entail trading prospects. Beuhler only cost money.

So then backing out of Luzardo is a good thing for the Cubs. If they were on him because he was a cheap option that was because Jed may not have thought he could get rid of as much of Bellinger’s salary as he eventually got rid of. So pivoting from Luzardo may mean he does like someone else more and now he has the money to spend on that pitcher. I guess we will find out soon”ish”.

Yep. They still have enough money even if they do pay $15M for a pitcher. I think the bigger issue is they dont want to pay that guy multiple years. Maybe 2 at most. If they are going to make a serious run at Tucker, and I think they will, they don’t want that contract on the books. That is why 1 or at most 2 years of Buehler makes sense. .

Considering I mentioned Beuhler about 2 hours ago as someone I felt was a better option than Luzardo, I completely agree with you. But he might cost $15M so cubs would be down to about $25M to spend after signing him. So is it Yates for $12M, Minter for $6M and one bench bat/back uo 1st and 3rd baseman? Seems that is doable.

What does this mean? What does Arenado not accepting a trade to Houston have to do with the Cubs getting Tucker? Houston was going to move Paredes to first had Arenado agreed to the trade. His decision has nothing to do with the Cubs getting Tucker.