soccer10k

Cubs would lose because Rusch would give up 5 HRs before the Cubs even come to bat. That's an excellent point.

And we can't do anything about this.

I'm gonna have to go with either Zambrano or Wood as the DH's.

Absolutely classic. That's sig worthy.

I don't know about any managers bouncing back, but Jason Giambi was quite possibly the most hated man in New York after his grand jury testimony was leaked and he wasn't hitting anything. Now he's hitting and the fans like him.

Maybe Rusch should get the spot start and have a contest: First pitcher to allow 5 home runs loses.

Cedeno is kind of a pre-steriod, pre-Arod/Tejada/Nomar/Jeter throw back. I think he will be a good-not-great SS for a long time. Both He and Murton have more than held their own so far in their first full season. I agree and think Cedeno will definately be solid major league player. Maybe not great, but he'll have a long career.

Actually lots of people make a living hitting minor league pitching. It's just not a very prosperous one. Just because you want to dismiss minor league production doesn't mean it can't be included in rational debate. You said all signs indicated he couldn't hit lefties. I think a large amount of minor league at bats can easily outwiegh a handful of major league at bats spread out over multiple years, as well as personel decisions made by the Cubs. It's your opinion that he can't hit lefties, but you have no more evidence than those that say he might be able to if given a chance. It's been stated before in this thread because it's an important fact to remember, even though you insist on ignoring it. My point on minor league hitting is that just because some guy tears up minor league pitching doesn't mean that he's going to tear up major league pitching. It's the "what have you done for me lately" line. What has Choi done against left handed pitchers at the major league level? Absolutely nothing.

AB's against lefties: 2003: 17 AB 2004: 36 AB 2005: 29 AB 82 AB's total vs. lefties 783 AB's total vs. righties Wow. He just can't hit lefties. It's been proven. In three years, with 82 AB's, he did squat. Hmm... let's do some numbers here on those HR's. 36 HR's in 783 AB's... is 1 HR every 21.75 AB's. 2 HR's in 82 AB's... that's 1 HR every 41 AB's. That's the worst split ever. Okay, not really. It's not even all that surprising. Of course, given the size of, dare I say it, the sample, I find it hard to draw any such conclusion that Choi cannot hit lefties. Indeed, I surmise that if the Cubs had not acquired Karros in 2003, Choi would have had a greater chance against lefties and perhaps, as his minor league career indicated, he would have hit just fine against them. Shouldn't you also ask the question: Why did the Cubs even acquire Karros? Maybe because something was wrong. Every sign out there proves that Choi can't hit lefties. He is average against righties, but he can't hit lefties. You can cite sample size (and yes I have taken a couple statistics classes) but Choi hasn't given me any reason to believe that he'll ever hit left handed pitching well at all. Definately not well enough to play every day. Also, for those of you that think the Cubs should bring Choi back to Chicago, Pittsburgh has 3 left handed starters, Milwaukee has 3, St. Louis has 1, Houston has 2, and Cincinnati has 2. That's 11 out of 25 left handed starters. Choi is not the answer. The Cubs didn't set out to acquire Karros. They set out to get rid of Todd Hundley. The price was taking Grudz and Karros -- and it was a pretty good deal, frankly. Nobody goes into a trade not caring who they get in return. Jim Hendry wanted Grudz and Karros in return. You don't just call up another GM and say "Hey I'm going to give you Todd Hundley, just give me whatever you want to in return. I don't care." You don't do that. Hendry had to have had some idea of what he wanted in return. If he didn't want Karros, he wouldn't have acquired him.

Who cares about minor league pitching? Stop using that as an example. That point has already been stated about 15 in this thread. I GOT YOUR POINT ALREADY. Nobody makes a living hitting minor league pitching.

Holy dear lord, you've changed your opinion. It's magic, I say, magic. Nice try, my foot. You are a contrarian, CubsfaninCA, and you regularly skirt the line of trollish behavior pretty regularly. You've been a dropping into threads in such a fashion almost since you joined the board. I'm all for different opinions and I like a good debate. I don't like when people reiterate the same opinions time again without sufficient support for the argument. Additionally, it's pretty clear that "almost everyone else in baseball" doesn't mean much of anything since we don't have access to their thoughts. I would add the argument, too, that it's pretty clear that there are a lot of baseball clubs that really don't know how to maximize their winning potential. The Cubs are, and have been, a great example of how not to assemble a baseball team. that's really rich. when the information doesn't back one's opinion go personal. take the next lecture to pm. Keep dodging, ducking, dipping, diving and dodging. You may not like it, but you are contrarian. It's not personal and it's not an attack. You take pride in fighting the conventional wisdom of the board. You like pointing out how stats can't do this, and stats can't do that, and how your eyes told you that Choi sucked as a Dodger. Oh, and by the way, since you never read the last PM I sent you, why would I bother sending you any more? If you don't like what I have to say, in what forum I say it, how I behave as a Mod, how and when I moderate, or if you have a problem with me personally, please feel free to contact Tim or 1908. Let him disagree with the board. What's the big deal with it?

AB's against lefties: 2003: 17 AB 2004: 36 AB 2005: 29 AB 82 AB's total vs. lefties 783 AB's total vs. righties Wow. He just can't hit lefties. It's been proven. In three years, with 82 AB's, he did squat. Hmm... let's do some numbers here on those HR's. 36 HR's in 783 AB's... is 1 HR every 21.75 AB's. 2 HR's in 82 AB's... that's 1 HR every 41 AB's. That's the worst split ever. Okay, not really. It's not even all that surprising. Of course, given the size of, dare I say it, the sample, I find it hard to draw any such conclusion that Choi cannot hit lefties. Indeed, I surmise that if the Cubs had not acquired Karros in 2003, Choi would have had a greater chance against lefties and perhaps, as his minor league career indicated, he would have hit just fine against them. Shouldn't you also ask the question: Why did the Cubs even acquire Karros? Maybe because something was wrong. Every sign out there proves that Choi can't hit lefties. He is average against righties, but he can't hit lefties. You can cite sample size (and yes I have taken a couple statistics classes) but Choi hasn't given me any reason to believe that he'll ever hit left handed pitching well at all. Definately not well enough to play every day. Also, for those of you that think the Cubs should bring Choi back to Chicago, Pittsburgh has 3 left handed starters, Milwaukee has 3, St. Louis has 1, Houston has 2, and Cincinnati has 2. That's 11 out of 25 left handed starters. Choi is not the answer.

Don't suppose you care to post the number of plate appearances he was given against lefties? I'm sure that has nothing to do with the difference in home runs. Hard to hit lefties when you rarely, if ever, are given an opportunity to face them. Even if he does have trouble with them, platoon him. Start him against right-handers and use him off the bench to pinch hit against righties. You can do that and get him 400+ at-bats easily. I'm not saying that the Cubs should do this. When Lee is back, they have a star player at that position. But there are teams that don't have someone locked into that position. Have you read everything I've written? I said the exact same thing. I'm not debating whether or not he's a decent hitter against right handed pitching. I even suggested to platoon him. But he shouldn't face lefties all the time. He just shouldn't.

He barely has 100 PA's against LHP in 3 years. That's what's called a self fulfilling prophecy. A guy gets labeled as someone who can't hit LHP(even though in Choi's case he hit them fine and never got a chance to prove it at the MLB level), and then sees so few of them after that he never gets a chance to show his abilities. And does it ever occur to you that there may be a reason for that? There is a big difference between minor league pitchers and major league pitchers. You and brinoch can spout out all of the minor league stats you want, but the fact remains that at the major league level, Choi has not been able to hit left handed pitching. He just can't. He's like Jacque Jones. Both would be good platoon players but neither should be everyday players.

Your eyes and your memory have misled you. Choi had an OBP of .389 and an SLG of .496 (OPS of .885) when he was injured. But he still can't hit lefties. He never has been able to. That's a fact. And the key is those were his stats BEFORE he was injured. What has he done since then. You can state your case based on that but he's not that same player. I could make the argument that Sammy was still hitting well before he got beaned in the head and that should warrant a contract. But Sammy changed after that, teams know that, and that's why he isn't playing this year. Choi never could hit lefties, and after he suffered the concussion, he changed. And that right there is reason enough that Choi shouldn't play everyday. The guy at best is a platoon player. Really? Wow, he sucked as a Marlin in 2004. Only had a .388 OBP and a .495 SLG (.883 OPS). That's just awful, I say. Definitely took a dip to Neifi-esque suckitude with a .331 OBP and a .453 SLG (.789 OPS) as a Dodger in 2005. In the minors, Choi faced lefties everyday and wasn't platooned. He did fine against them. TT, post the numbers. 2003 to 2005: Lefties: .159/.317/.280/.597 Righties: .253/.357/.461/.818 Using your example of 2004: Lefties: .167/.268/.278/.546 Righties: .261/.381/.469/.850 Also from 2003 to 2005 he hit 38 HR's and 36 of those were against righties. The guy can't hit lefties. Face it and admit it. I'm not debating that he can sometimes hit righties, but he can't hit lefties to save his life.

Steve Phillips doesn't think Dusty should be fired. Steve Phillips also probably thinks Steve Phillips should still be the General Manager of the New York Mets.

I would say the Cubs have to play at least .550 ball when everybody comes for me to be okay with an extention. Playing .500 isn't good enough. I would think that when Prior, Wood, Miller, and Lee come back, the Cubs need to play .700 ball for at least a month for Hendry to offer him an extension. After all, the return of those players eliminates all of Baker's excuses. First, assuming Lee comes back by the end of July, that leaves August and September for the team to turn it around and I would expect them to play well for 2 months not 1. Second, expecting a team to play .700 ball is a bit excessive as that would mean a 113 win pace. I could see .600 ball as that would be a 97 win pace. But they would have to play really well after everybody gets back for an extention to be warranted. Not that it has a lot of bearing on the rest of the thread, but Lee should be back a month sooner than that. I know. I should have been more specific. I'm giving him time to get used to hitting a baseball again and being conservative with my estimate.

Your eyes and your memory have misled you. Choi had an OBP of .389 and an SLG of .496 (OPS of .885) when he was injured. But he still can't hit lefties. He never has been able to. That's a fact. And the key is those were his stats BEFORE he was injured. What has he done since then. You can state your case based on that but he's not that same player. I could make the argument that Sammy was still hitting well before he got beaned in the head and that should warrant a contract. But Sammy changed after that, teams know that, and that's why he isn't playing this year. Choi never could hit lefties, and after he suffered the concussion, he changed. And that right there is reason enough that Choi shouldn't play everyday. The guy at best is a platoon player.

I would say the Cubs have to play at least .550 ball when everybody comes for me to be okay with an extention. Playing .500 isn't good enough. I would think that when Prior, Wood, Miller, and Lee come back, the Cubs need to play .700 ball for at least a month for Hendry to offer him an extension. After all, the return of those players eliminates all of Baker's excuses. First, assuming Lee comes back by the end of July, that leaves August and September for the team to turn it around and I would expect them to play well for 2 months not 1. Second, expecting a team to play .700 ball is a bit excessive as that would mean a 113 win pace. I could see .600 ball as that would be a 97 win pace. But they would have to play really well after everybody gets back for an extention to be warranted.

have seen this before. choi, jerome walton.... it's a legit question. not trying to knock the kid. The Marlins are really the only team that has allowed Choi to play regularly, and when given that opportunity, he produced. Then they traded him to the Dodgers who let him rot on the bench. perhaps i'm wrong, but didn't a bunch of teams have a chance to claim choi off waivers recently?? I believe the Red Sox have him stashed at AAA now. Doesn't change the fact that when give a chance to actually play regularly, he played well. if the guy could produce, he wouldn't be stashed in AAA. :roll: Whatever you say. I guess the fact that he actually has produced when given the chance to play regularly doesn't mean anything. No one is saying he's a star player. However, there are some AL teams that could use him as a DH, and probably a handful of teams around the majors that could use him at first base. He just happens to be in an organization that has productive players at 1B and DH already. Didn't he play regularly with the Cubs before he got his concussion? I don't remember him doing anything for us. Choi is just as bad, if not worse, as Jacque is against left handed pitchers. I think it's unanimous on this board that Jacque should have a platoon partner. So why should Choi get the chance to play when he can't hit lefties? He doesn't deserve it.

It's now up to 33 votes for Freddy Bynum and I think he voted for himself each time. You have to feel sorry for Rich Hill because he only has 44 votes. Since over 4000 people have voted that means that he is considered to be on par with Bynum. Now I know Hill hasn't been that good, but he's not Bynum bad.

How hard is it to realize that you can't have both defense and offense in a catcher? Most of the time, you have to pick one or the other. Barrent is a hitting catcher and Miller is a defensive catcher. Like carniby said, Miller's numbers will drop off SIGNIFICANTLY. Just wait until the end of the year and Miller's final numbers won't be anywhere near what his numbers are at right now. Barrett is the superior overall catcher and like a couple other people have said, he isn't the problem. You can talk about the pitch calling, but does Barrett make Glendon Rusch throw batting practice to the opposing team every time he takes the mound? No. The pitchers have to make the right pitches. If Barrett calls a pitch, the pitcher throws it correctly, and it gets hit for a homerun, then that's Barrett's fault. Is it Barrett's fault that our pitchers have walked the most batters in the National League and are second only to Baltimore in all MLB? No. Let's look at the offense. It doesn't matter how good Barrett's pitchcalling is when the offense scores 11 runs in 10 games and gets shutout 4 times in 6 games. And don't even try the argument that Barrett wasn't hitting either because he is only responsible for 1 out of every 9 at bats. Everybody knows Barrett isn't the best defensive catcher. Everybody has faults. There is no such thing as the perfect player. The problems with this team run far deeper than Barrett.

As I recall, Cedeno wasn't known for his bat in the minors.

This I can agree with. Most. Annoying. Announcers. Ever. Good guys 3, bad guys 0. Who does that? Thats just stupid. EDIT: WHenever Hawk says something ridiculously stupid, DJ somehow backs him up with some ludicrous explanation, DJ usually gives Hawk verbal fellatio. Btw, they don't know what OBP is. THEY SERIOUSLY DONT. I can't stand the "He gone" line that one of them always says. Like bc2k said, I watch to stay informed. I have MLB.TV so if I'm bored the first thing I do is look if a game is on. If the Sox game happens to be the best game being played at that time then I'll watch it. But only then. And when they play the Cubs.

I would say the Cubs have to play at least .550 ball when everybody comes for me to be okay with an extention. Playing .500 isn't good enough.