CubinNY
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I still can't fathom how someone votes for Dawson and not Rice. I loved Dawson as much as anyone, but to look at his career and say HOF and to not say the same for Rice destroys all credibility that you can look at baseball objectively. I agree Vance, the problem with Rice is he did lots of things really, really well but wasn't dominating in any one area. HOF voters love guys like Lou Brock (base stealing) or Ozzie Smith (defense) who dominate in at least one particular area. It's a shame guys like Rice get overlooked. HOF voters let their voting status go to their friggen heads. Here are my thoughts. The HOF is a museum of baseball as such the best players of each era should go into the HOF. It is a much about the history of the game as it is about any ridiculus notion of only the best of the best should get in. If that is the case then there should be eight position players and four or five starters in, and they can get voted out if somebody better comes along. The museum is plenty big enough to accomidate new inductees. And IMO the new inductees help to keep the museum alive, so to speak. What I mean is I don't really care about some pitcher who pitched for the Boston Braves in the 1920s but I can see Sandberg, Yaz, Yount and other players from childhood and youth. Players like Rice, Trammell, Santo, and Blyleven should be in becasue they were the best players of their generation at their positon. End of story.
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I am sorry, but that is the most loppsided trade idea this side of my PS2 The Mets would get Manny for: Victor Diaz Chris Benson Aaron Heilman Kaz Matsui It is to laugh. Baltimore Give up Tejada for: Lugo Benson Diaz Bannister They are reluctant to trade him for Prior. Tampa gives up Lugo and gets: Heilman Matsui That is obscene, Matsui's contract that is. Manny may end of a Met, but this deal aint gonna happen.
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Hopefully the O's FO is a dumb as many people think they are and they keep holding out for more until Hendry finally moves on. If there is one thing we know about Hendry it is that he doesn't move on. He tried to trade for Barrett two times before Beane helped him out. He waited all Winter for Maddux to sign. He waited way, way too long for McGriff to make up his mind. He tried to get Burnitz a couple of times. Hendry is pitbull like once he locks on to a player. Now that does not mean the trade will happen, everyone has their limits. But Hendry doesn't move on.
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Do you mean fans or front office people? I think this trade proposal is a fair one. But that does not make it a good one. I am torn. Prior is a once in a decade talent and will likely be a good to great "value" for 3 more years. He will definately be a better long term value then Tejada. Tejada is a player who can help the Cubs win now but in three years he will be on the downslope and expensive. I think the Cubs have to do something to win now. But they also have the luxuary of having a young nuecleus of starting pitching. Guzman, Marshall, and Gahallager Both sides are gambling here. Baltimore is starved for pitching and the Cubs are starved for offesenive help. Both sides want to get the most value out of the trade and then there are the players wishes to consider. I think this thing may drag out for a while.
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That is more than enough data to suggest to me that Cedeno can handle the job. He may not walk enough for us, but then again, who does?* *Rhetorical question
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We seem to be going round and round here. Ok Would anyone else do this trade: Hill, Guzman, Dope, Harvey/Reed for Tejada?
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someone felt the need to open another thread
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Come on goony, The future of the Cubs is in grave doubt right now. The Cubs are one of the few teams with the finiancial wearwithall to be able to land a top free agent pitcher even with Tejada. I'm not saying trading Prior for Tejada will make this team better or worse. And I'm not saying that I would make the propsed trade. But I see a future that isn't so bright anymore. It would be in more grave doubt. Seriously. The only reason this team has been any good at all the last couple years is because they lucked into Prior and didn't screw up the Zambrano situation (they wanted to trade him or move him to closer at one point). Prior and Zambrano give the Cubs an inherent advantage over other teams because nobody has two young pitchers of that caliber making such little money comparitavely speaking. They had that advantage, and a top payroll and couldn't do anything with it because they spend so much money on mediocrity and adhere to an old school approach to the game that abhors progress. Agreed.
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Come on goony, The future of the Cubs is in grave doubt right now. The Cubs are one of the few teams with the finiancial wearwithall to be able to land a top free agent pitcher even with Tejada. I'm not saying trading Prior for Tejada will make this team better or worse. And I'm not saying that I would make the propsed trade. But I see a future that isn't so bright anymore.
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Yea...can you believe we are breaking up the dynasty that has been the Chicago Cubs? Cant seem to recollect our record last year for the life of me. Although I'm not as flippant, I agree. Hendry has to do something to shake things up. I don't know if trading Prior for Tejada is the right something, but it is something. Regardless, this catasstrophy of an offseason following the debacle of a season is Hendry's doing. If this trade happens, the only thing that will save him is a playoff appearence
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Offer A works for the Cubs and the Orioles. Offer B works for the Cubs but doesn't make sense for the Orioles. I doubt Hendry is going to trade Prior unless he gets something like Offer B in return. I predict that if the Orioles don't want a deal along the lines of either Offer A or B, then he'll sit tight until a better deal comes along during the season. If offer A worked for the Cubs and Orioles, I imagine the deal would be done. To me it makes much more sense for Baltimore too. They aren't going anywhere this year with or without Prior and with or without Tejada. I also think that Cedeno has to be part of the deal unless they are stupid enough to want Perez.
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That is your opinion.
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The save is the most worthless kept stat in baseball, I voted no.
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Anyone who says Jim Rice doesn't belong in the HOF better speak up. The guy was one of the premire power hitters for his era. The only thing keeping him out of the real HOF is he was a dick to the sportswriters when he played.
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Gammons just said that he wouldn't make the Tejada for Prior deal because Prior is an injury risk. They also mentioned (Gammy + Phillips) on how great Bedyard (sp) is. Isn't he older than Prior? I heard the same thing. It is just like I wrote on page whatever. We see Prior differently than 99% of the baseball world. It doen't mean anyone is right or wrong in their view. Both Gammons and Phillips, mentioned that Bedard could be a # 1 or #2 starter down the road. What they were painfully ignorant on were the additional palyers that were being moved. I don't really think either of them know anything more than we do.
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I believe the above post goes in the irony thread. ---------- There is no doubt in my mind that Prior is more than a little ticked off with the way the organization handled his injuries. When people where questioning his "toughness" there weren't a whole lot of statements of support coming from Clark and Addison.
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The Cubs aren't trading Bedard for Prior. What if Bedard + Dope + Bacon landed Zito? ---- Again, just for clarification I am not advocating Prior/Tejada. I find it difficult to understand why the trade proposal is that bad of a deal.
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Cubs Get: Harden, Tejada, Bedard, cash, prospects Orioles Get: Prior and Zito Athletics Get: A lot of really good prospects likely involving Rich Hill and Nick Markakis That I could live with. Oh come on, that's just silly. As is trading Prior straight up for Tejada, imo. Seriously, this is borderline ridiculous. I feel like Jim Hendry secretly lost a bet with Jim Bowden, allowing Bowden to run the Cubs' 2006 offseason. Agreed. This is ridiculous and the first thing I did think of was this was a Bowdenesque trade. This trade proposal is far from ridiculous. Some ridiculous things: Signing Perez for way over market value Signing Jones for way over what he deserves with Pie in the wings Tejada is arguably the best SS in baseball, if not he in the same class. Prior is a very good young pitcher who has put up good numbers for one year and has been injured for two others. Other teams don't care if they were or were not freak injuries. Prior has a lot of hype, good perherials, but not much else from a convential perspective (wins and losses). People here know the story of wins and losses for a pitcher but few else do. One could say they wouldn't do the deal given the Cubs needs but the proposed trade is not ridiculous.
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here's my question. I read a few blogs and one in particular goes out of their way to point out that the Cubs didn't sign Tejada when they had the chance. now, I know the Cubs had the chance to do so but was CHicago a top-choice for Tejada? The top choice for Tejad was who ponnied up the bucks. The cubs didn't even make an offer, IIRC. Similar to Giles this year.
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To me the Cubs future doesn't look too bright. In the next couple of years the big three (Wood, Prior, Z) will be whittled down to the big two and perhaps the big one. The Cubs still have Guzman, Marshall, and a handfull other pitchers who can step into the rotation. None are of the quality of Prior though that is for sure. What the Cubs don't have are position players. Their offensive production is likely to be no better than last year. However, I don't know that I would do the trade either. It would be a tough call to say the leas. But the cost of doing nothing is another lost year with escalating contracts for Prior and Z. IMO it is a fair offer.
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Come on Sulley, Prior + Pie + Barrett for Santana, Mauer, and Hunter? You wouldn't do that trade? DISCLAIMER: I am only making this up for the purposes of discussion.
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I agree Cuse, and at the risk of going against the "groupthink" that people erroneously assert goes on here, I think Bedard + Tejada for Prior + top prospect is a fair trade. Now, I don't know if I would do the trade, but I would think hard about it. The Cubs need to shake things up. Hendry cannot think that this team is a playoff contender as it stands right now. The time to win for the Cubs is now. If I'm Hendry I talk to my people and ask if Prior can get back his pin point control. I also ask about Tejada's age and try to get stats for comparable players his age to try to project towards the future. There is a lot to think about. But that is why the GM makes the big bucks. IMO it is nowhere near as bad a trade ideas as people are making it out to be.
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Abreu to Houston Rumor
CubinNY replied to Blueheart05's topic in MLB Draft, International Signings, Amateur Baseball
I wish the Cubs were in the rumor :( -
That is a pretty decent group for Joe. Perry Hill is supposed to be great at positioning players and "coaching" fundamentals. "Go figure, they teach that stuff in the bigs?" --Johnny B, Chicago/San Fransisco
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Mr. Miles, It is my impression that Hairston is not well liked by Dusty. He made a number of comments about him missing signs and base running gaffes. Is this the case? Dusty seemed to have a distaste for Hairston right from spring training, for whatever reason. Hairston missed a number of signs during the season, and that certainly didn't endear him to the boss. But as the year went on, Hairston seemed to grow on the Cubs a little more _ Hendry also said as much at the winter meetings. He can be a valuable guy to have on a team, and he certainly wasn't the only Cub to make mental errors. I agree and thanks for talking to us starving Cub fans. We all appreciate when you stop by.