TruffleShuffle

watching every piece of trash the cards roll out there pitch well makes me vomit in rage.

I think he was the best player available at my pick, but the Eagles are loaded at DT, so I went with a need position.

Huge difference. Shawn Estes we all knew was terrible. He was terrible in 2002 and terrible for most of 2003 before the Cubs finally gave him the hook at the end of the year. Glendon Rusch was stinking up it up after a long opportunity, while Rich Hill was -- and here's the proper usage of this word -- destroying AAA batters. Here you have a case of a pitcher, Angel Guzman, whose minor league numbers the past three years are not all that great, and who is a significant injury risk. On the other side, there's Wade Miller, a veteran pitcher who has hardly pitched at all since his most recent shoulder surgery. Maybe he'll stink it up and be removed from the rotation, but unlike Rusch and Estes, you don't have a real sample size to know that he's done. Oh, and Juan Cruz never had the control that he should've had, and was rushed to the majors.

Look at his minor league numbers and then get back to me about how he isn't waiting to destroy opposing hitters. yeah his minor league numbers the past three years are nothing special

Yes, but we're never going to get a pen of mostly homegrown kids as long as we keep drafting people with "teh awesome stuff" and hoping they develop control. Why? You can teach mechanics, increased control, etc. You can't teach 98 mph fastballs and unhittable breaking balls maybe someone can teach mechanics and increased control, but that someone doesn't work for the cubs

Ray King, Julian Tavarez, Dave Veres, Mike Timlin, Steve Kline. All signed for $2M or more. That was easy. - I thought King came in a trade with Atlanta - I'm nearly positive that Timlin came over as part of a trade - Veres came over in the trade with Daryl Kile - Kline came over in a trade for Tatis Only one of those guys was signed as a free agent by stl - Tavarez and that was only to a two year deal worth a total of $4.2M. The other guys were all acquired as pieces of a trade. So I think my statement stands. I thought you meant that they never went onto the market and received big money.

doesn't work that way. If the guy's making an honest effort to come back and he keeps getting hurt, there are no grounds to void the contract.

A lot of people are also of the opinion that since Guzman's arm seems to fall off every time he's in a starting rotation, maybe he'd have a better chance staying healthy and being successful if he became a relief pitcher.

I really don't think it's a terrible thing to give Miller 4-5 starts at the outset of the year to find out whether he can still be effective. Maybe Guzman would do a better job, but probably not a whole lot better. And it gives Prior time to get his stuff together in extended spring training and hopefully be ready to step into the rotation.

who pitched like crap last year. If we don't sign Miller, then we're going into the season with our fifth starter being: a) Mark Prior, who can't stay healthy and when he was healthy last year, he got hammered... or... (b) Angel Guzman, who can't stay healthy and was really, really bad for the Cubs last year. I'd rather have more options, even if it turns out that Miller doesn't have what it takes to get big league hitters out.

Again, Guzman hasn't proven he can do this either. And all the stuff in the world doesn't get guys out... go ask Juan Cruz if you don't believe me.

If I had been the GM, he wouldn't have been on the team in this capacity. well okay, except he is on the team. Now, the Cubs didn't hand him the job - they had an open competition between Prior, Miller and Guzman. Miller pitched better than Prior and Guzman. Which begs the question, why have a competition for the 5th spot in the rotation if you're not going to give the winner a fair shot in the regular season? Eh? Guzman looked to have better stuff in ST than Miller & Prior. But good stuff is not the only measurement of a pitcher. Miller produced better results in the eyes of the Cubs. That's why he won the job. Relying on results in spring training games is a stupid and ignorant way of constructing a baseball team. Okay, well let's go on Guzman's spectacular 7.39 ERA and 1.88 WHIP in the majors last year. And oh by the way, I think his next healthy season will be his first one.

If I had been the GM, he wouldn't have been on the team in this capacity. well okay, except he is on the team. Now, the Cubs didn't hand him the job - they had an open competition between Prior, Miller and Guzman. Miller pitched better than Prior and Guzman. Which begs the question, why have a competition for the 5th spot in the rotation if you're not going to give the winner a fair shot in the regular season? Eh? Guzman looked to have better stuff in ST than Miller & Prior. Miller: 3.64 ERA, 17.1 IP, 22 H, 4 BB, 16 K Guzman: 5.79 ERA, 13.2 IP, 18 H, 1 BB, 7 K They were both hittable, but Miller struck guys out at a better rate. "Stuff" is great but isn't worth a whole lot if you don't know how to locate it.

If I had been the GM, he wouldn't have been on the team in this capacity. well okay, except he is on the team. Now, the Cubs didn't hand him the job - they had an open competition between Prior, Miller and Guzman. Miller pitched better than Prior and Guzman. Which begs the question, why have a competition for the 5th spot in the rotation if you're not going to give the winner a fair shot in the regular season?

if we're only going can a guy for one start, why even have him on the team in the first place?

Which teams, aside from the small market teams that have no other choice, do that? St. Louis & Anaheim, two teams that perpetually have top 5 bullpens in baseball. Other than Izzy, I can't think of a single FA those guys have gone on the market for and signed to big money contracts. Now, Anaheim extended Shields with pretty big money, but they found him for minimum dollars initially. Minnesota's bullpen last year was about as good as it gets. Nathan was the only guy making more than $1m, IIRC, and most were making around league minimum. Rincon and Crain were both strong minor league prospects who have been successful at the big league level. Pat Neshek was also a product of their system who had great numbers in the minors. They got incredibly lucky with Dennys Reyes, who had an ERA over 4.5 and a WHIP over 1.5, and then managed to have an ERA and a WHIP of under one last season. If the Cubs could produce three relievers like Rincon, Crain and Neshek, hell I'd be all for that. But Wuertz is probably pretty close to Crain in terms of ability, and then who's next? Will Ohman? He's easily worse than any of the Twins' three. Novoa sucked. Guzman has sucked in every attempt in the big leagues. Leicester, Wellemeyer, Bartosh, Mitre, none of those guys have been good enough. That's why the Cubs sign people like Howry and Eyre, because none of their minor league options are passable options. Your plan is great in theory abuck, but it doesn't work in real life because this organization has not produced enough quality pitchers.

25th pick in 2nd round: Eagles pick Steve Smith, WR, USC.

Ray King, Julian Tavarez, Dave Veres, Mike Timlin, Steve Kline. All signed for $2M or more. That was easy.

Wuertz is a good pitcher, and your point would hold water if the Cubs had an unlimited supply of him. But Wuertz is on the Cubs right now. They wouldn't be replacing Howry by Wuertz, they'd be replacing him by Novoa or Marmol, and there is a big difference between those guys and Howry.

the difference being that some starters fail because they don't have the stamina, or don't have three good pitches... and other starters fail because they just aren't good enough to pitch in the big leagues.

But he was and its still Howrys job as our supposed best reliever to get him out. Hell anything but give up a home run to Adam Freakin Everett. Howry and Eyre have been horrible so far this year. Money well spent there. 7 games.... Give it a little more than a week into they year before we evaluate if it was money well spent. The real comedy is in the game threads, after each win or loss they are either losing 100 games, or headed to the playoffs. I dont care if its 7 games into the season. The point of the matter is that its absolutely ignorant to spend big money on relievers. They are not worth it considering you have just as good of a chance using somebody from your own system. yeah we used a lot of guys from our own system last year, and they were God-awful. Howry is a good relief pitcher, even though half this board seems ready to bury him after two poor outings this year.

how dare he make as much money as he can working in a career that has a span of about 15 years!

lets go burn the ump in effigy

cubs have been pretty unlucky on hard hit balls the last 2 days

nice job garner, 2 games for lidge and he's out as closer... nice knee jerk reaction there