Great Day for Patterson

[erik316wttn]

I think the fact that everyone gets so excited when Corey has one good game says something about the type of player that he is.

 

I think he has a lot of potential, but it's never been realized for more than a few weeks at a time. And if people want to have Pie in center next year, we can't have Corey at a corner spot. Not nearly enough proudction.

 

Someone will still give value for him, based on the very potential you guys speak of.

 

I've never understood that argument, really. What do you mean by "Production?" Home runs? RBI? I think the RBI can be influenced more by where he hits in the lineup. If you bat him 6th he'll have more chances than if he hits leadoff or 2nd. And all runs count the same. A run driven in by your centerfielder doesn't count any more or less than one driven in by your catcher or first baseman or shortstop.

 

And with the struggles at the plate we've had for the last 3 plus years, don't you think you'd want to get away from the high K, high power, low OBP guys? Lee and Ramirez and Nomar are fine. But you don't need any more guys to hit 40 home runs if you have guys who hit 20-30 with higher OBPs.

 

This organization needs a whole new offensive philosophy when it comes to signing free agent hitters. I'd be just fine in taking a hit on team home runs on the corner OF positions if it means we have have higher OBP's and smarter hitting.

[Gunned]

I think the fact that everyone gets so excited when Corey has one good game says something about the type of player that he is.

 

 

i think the fact that people still find reasons to rag on him after he has a good game says something about some people and their dislike for patterson.

 

I don't dislike Corey Patterson. I want him to do well. It's just that nothing he has shown me in the past three years indicates he's ever going to be better than a .260/.320 kind of player.

 

And there is nothing wrong with players like that. It's fine, and you can keep him because of his defense. Bat him seventh or eighth. But you can't surround him with two other rookies in the OF and hope to have a prayer of competing.

 

A Floyd/Patterson/Giles outfield would be just fine. But Murton/Pie/Patterson has sub-.500 written all over it, unless you have five Mark Priors and the Texas Rangers' infield.

[sporrer17]

I want to see Pie next year. Early on, I was in favor of letting him stay in AAA next season, let him work on the power a little bit, and just have him come up as a "polished" hitter. However, he's got so much talent that he may be able to come up and make an impact right off the bat. An OF featuring Patterson/Pie may be the best defensive OF, if even an average LF is added to the mix (Murton, Huff). They are that good, defensively.

 

If Corey hits .270-.275 with 25 HRs and plays gold glove defense, there's no reason to complain about that at all. Corey hit .266 (i think) last year and had 24 HRs, but remember he hit the wall in September to drop those numbers the last month. I'd definately take that from Corey.

 

Pie is capable of great things. We all know that. If he hits 15-20 HRs this year, it's not all that much different than what they had expected out of Hollandsworth this year. Now we just need to match/equal Burnitz's output.

 

We need at least the '04 (if not '03) Patterson...a solid rookie year from Pie...and a little better than Burnitz (.280 with 25-30 HRs...Huff anyone?) There...OF solved. Murton gets the chance after Pie, if he struggles.

[Gunned]

I think the fact that everyone gets so excited when Corey has one good game says something about the type of player that he is.

 

I think he has a lot of potential, but it's never been realized for more than a few weeks at a time. And if people want to have Pie in center next year, we can't have Corey at a corner spot. Not nearly enough proudction.

 

Someone will still give value for him, based on the very potential you guys speak of.

 

I've never understood that argument, really. What do you mean by "Production?" Home runs? RBI? I think the RBI can be influenced more by where he hits in the lineup. If you bat him 6th he'll have more chances than if he hits leadoff or 2nd. And all runs count the same. A run driven in by your centerfielder doesn't count any more or less than one driven in by your catcher or first baseman or shortstop.

 

And with the struggles at the plate we've had for the last 3 plus years, don't you think you'd want to get away from the high K, high power, low OBP guys?

 

I'm confused. You kind of defended Corey, but then said we want to get rid of "high K, high power, low OBP guys."

 

Isn't that exactly what Corey is?

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

I want to see Pie next year. Early on, I was in favor of letting him stay in AAA next season, let him work on the power a little bit, and just have him come up as a "polished" hitter. However, he's got so much talent that he may be able to come up and make an impact right off the bat. An OF featuring Patterson/Pie may be the best defensive OF, if even an average LF is added to the mix (Murton, Huff). They are that good, defensively.

 

If Corey hits .270-.275 with 25 HRs and plays gold glove defense, there's no reason to complain about that at all. Corey hit .266 (i think) last year and had 24 HRs, but remember he hit the wall in September to drop those numbers the last month. I'd definately take that from Corey.

 

Pie is capable of great things. We all know that. If he hits 15-20 HRs this year, it's not all that much different than what they had expected out of Hollandsworth this year. Now we just need to match/equal Burnitz's output.

 

We need at least the '04 (if not '03) Patterson...a solid rookie year from Pie...and a little better than Burnitz (.280 with 25-30 HRs...Huff anyone?) There...OF solved. Murton gets the chance after Pie, if he struggles.

 

Corey showed more discipline than Pie has at AA. Pie isn't ready. We saw what happened when Corey was rushed; let's leave Pie in AAA next season and let him learn everything he needs to learn in order to be a MLB all-star.

[katway]

I don't see why a Pie, Murton, CPatt outfield will not work from an offensive perspective because of a perceived lack of power.

 

Look at the Whitesox outfield. Corey can at least give us Dye's production. Pie can easily probably hit for more power than Podsednik (0 homers). Murton can probably give us Rowand's (9 homers thus far) production in a full season.

 

That's the outfield of the best team in the AL and Pie, Murton, and CPatt can probably equal its production and play just as well, if not better, defensively.

 

The fact is that fewer players are hitting homers without the roids. Corner outfielders with 35 homers+ per year is no longer the norm and teams can easily win without them. Especially teams like the Cubs, which can get power from their infield.

 

Let the kids play next year, bring in some quality pitching and this team will finally win the games they are supposed to win.

[erik316wttn]

I don't see why a Pie, Murton, CPatt outfield will not work from an offensive perspective because of a perceived lack of power.

 

Look at the Whitesox outfield. Corey can at least give us Dye's production. Pie can easily probably hit for more power than Podsednik (0 homers). Murton can probably give us Rowand's (9 homers thus far) production in a full season.

 

That's the outfield of the best team in the AL and Pie, Murton, and CPatt can probably equal its production and play just as well, if not better, defensively.

 

The fact is that fewer players are hitting homers without the roids. Corner outfielders with 35 homers+ per year is no longer the norm and teams can easily win without them. Especially teams like the Cubs, which can get power from their infield.

 

Let the kids play next year, bring in some quality pitching and this team will finally win the games they are supposed to win.

 

The White Sox are winning because they can string together hits, they're agressive but not stupid at the plate, and they can draw walks.

[MustangMike]

Corey looked great today: 3 for 4 with a walk to boot! He hit a double off of a tough pitcher for lefties to hit. He looked patient at the plate. AND he made a tremendous outstretched diving catch in center. Way to go Corey!

 

I have a lot of faith in Corey yet. I hope he's our starting rightfielder next year (Pie in center)!

 

:D

 

I'm very happy he had a good game, hopefull he'll continue to play well and we can trade him! :wtg:

[Exile on Waveland]

I don't see why a Pie, Murton, CPatt outfield will not work from an offensive perspective because of a perceived lack of power.

 

Look at the Whitesox outfield. Corey can at least give us Dye's production. Pie can easily probably hit for more power than Podsednik (0 homers). Murton can probably give us Rowand's (9 homers thus far) production in a full season.

 

That's the outfield of the best team in the AL and Pie, Murton, and CPatt can probably equal its production and play just as well, if not better, defensively.

 

The fact is that fewer players are hitting homers without the roids. Corner outfielders with 35 homers+ per year is no longer the norm and teams can easily win without them. Especially teams like the Cubs, which can get power from their infield.

 

Let the kids play next year, bring in some quality pitching and this team will finally win the games they are supposed to win.

 

I can agree with the "let the kids play next year" mantra. Especially with the free agent class lacking where the Cubs need the most help. Outside of a big trade for a OF, playing youth in the OF may be the wise decision.

 

However, if Pie-Patterson-Murton is the opening day outfield, the team cannot expect to contend. That OF is just not going to cut it next year. Also, I'd prefer far, far more patience with Pie -- no Patterson Part II.

[Gunned]

I don't see why a Pie, Murton, CPatt outfield will not work from an offensive perspective because of a perceived lack of power.

 

Look at the Whitesox outfield. Corey can at least give us Dye's production. Pie can easily probably hit for more power than Podsednik (0 homers). Murton can probably give us Rowand's (9 homers thus far) production in a full season.

 

 

Jermaine Dye is hitting .268/.330/.465 with 21 homers. That's not bad -- and I'll give Corey the benefit of the doubt in saying he can match that, since that's similar to what he did last year. Of course, he could just as easily hit .240 and never take a walk, like this year.

 

You mention that Podsednik hasn't hit a homer. But he's also hitting .280 with a .348 OBP. Even the most optimistic among us can't expect Pie to match that ... he's never even played a game at the major league level. He isn't ready yet.

 

Rowand is hitting a solid .286 with a .337 OBP. Once again, Murton COULD match that, yes. But he also could hit .250 once those infield hits stop piling up quite so much. However,out of these three guys, I think Murton has the best chance for success next year.

 

When you think of a Murton/Pie/Patterson outfield you can't just consider what their ceiling is. (And we've just determined that their ceiling isn't much better than the offensively weak White Sox outfield.) You have to consider the floor as well.

 

That's been the Cubs' philosophy over the past few years: hoping for the best with certain players. And then when anything goes wrong (injuries, bad performance, bad luck) it drives down the team far, far below expectations. Good teams like the Cardinals, Red Sox, Angels and Yankees try to drive their expected wins way up there so they can withstand injuries and misfortunes and still compete.

 

There's absolutely no excuse for a high payroll team like the Cubs to rely on Corey Patterson and two rookies in the outfield. As you said, it COULD work out ... but it's just as likely that it'd be a total disaster.

[minnesotacubsfan]

I don't see why a Pie, Murton, CPatt outfield will not work from an offensive perspective because of a perceived lack of power.

 

Look at the Whitesox outfield. Corey can at least give us Dye's production. Pie can easily probably hit for more power than Podsednik (0 homers). Murton can probably give us Rowand's (9 homers thus far) production in a full season.

 

 

Jermaine Dye is hitting .268/.330/.465 with 21 homers. That's not bad -- and I'll give Corey the benefit of the doubt in saying he can match that, since that's similar to what he did last year. Of course, he could just as easily hit .240 and never take a walk, like this year.

 

You mention that Podsednik hasn't hit a homer. But he's also hitting .280 with a .348 OBP. Even the most optimistic among us can't expect Pie to match that ... he's never even played a game at the major league level. He isn't ready yet.

 

Rowand is hitting a solid .286 with a .337 OBP. Once again, Murton COULD match that, yes. But he also could hit .250 once those infield hits stop piling up quite so much. However,out of these three guys, I think Murton has the best chance for success next year.

 

When you think of a Murton/Pie/Patterson outfield you can't just consider what their ceiling is. (And we've just determined that their ceiling isn't much better than the offensively weak White Sox outfield.) You have to consider the floor as well.

 

That's been the Cubs' philosophy over the past few years: hoping for the best with certain players. And then when anything goes wrong (injuries, bad performance, bad luck) it drives down the team far, far below expectations. Good teams like the Cardinals, Red Sox, Angels and Yankees try to drive their expected wins way up there so they can withstand injuries and misfortunes and still compete.

 

There's absolutely no excuse for a high payroll team like the Cubs to rely on Corey Patterson and two rookies in the outfield. As you said, it COULD work out ... but it's just as likely that it'd be a total disaster.

 

 

iN THIS SITUATION, I SEE MURTON AS A STOP GAP. I WOULD MUCH RATHER SEE HUFF/GILES/FLOYD W/CPATT AND PIE. I THINK THAT COMBO WOULD BE A GOOD OF FOR THE $$$