2020 roster

[Bryants Disco Ball]

Here's my first go of it

C- Vic

1B- Rizzo

2B- Nico

SS- Javy

3B- KB

LF- Schwarbs

CF- Heyward

RF- Nick

 

Bench: Margot (CF), Fraizer 2B/OF, Bote IF, Kemp IF/OF, Castro/Martin C

 

Pitchers (13)

 

Rotation:

Lester

Darvish

Hendricks

Gray

Q

 

Bullpen

Kimbrel

Wick

Estevez

Ryan

Wieck

Phelps

Underwood

Mills

 

Underwood And Mills are out of options so they get first crack at the bullpen. Then Graveman, Rea, Adbert, Mekkes, Hultzen, etc are on the shuttle.

 

I feel like this isn't changing things up enough. That lineup, rotation and bullpen is far too much the same for me to have any confidence in this bunch. Theo needs to get much crazier.

[Cubswin11]

Here's my first go of it

C- Vic

1B- Rizzo

2B- Nico

SS- Javy

3B- KB

LF- Schwarbs

CF- Heyward

RF- Nick

 

Bench: Margot (CF), Fraizer 2B/OF, Bote IF, Kemp IF/OF, Castro/Martin C

 

Pitchers (13)

 

Rotation:

Lester

Darvish

Hendricks

Gray

Q

 

Bullpen

Kimbrel

Wick

Estevez

Ryan

Wieck

Phelps

Underwood

Mills

 

Underwood And Mills are out of options so they get first crack at the bullpen. Then Graveman, Rea, Adbert, Mekkes, Hultzen, etc are on the shuttle.

 

I feel like this isn't changing things up enough. That lineup, rotation and bullpen is far too much the same for me to have any confidence in this bunch. Theo needs to get much crazier.

I just don’t see the complete blow up offseason. There’s still a solid core here that likely gets tweaked instead of overhauled. I just don’t see how they do like the 4-6 big moves to overly change things. I think something what I laid out is roughly what’s going to happen. You’re still smoothing the edges with better depth and adding a ~3+ WAR SP and the bullpen is solid enough on paper going in to a year. It obviously doesn’t feel like enough but round things out better and take your shot again, just looking at it realistically. I’d like to see more change too but don’t want to get hopes up or remotely expect it.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

The 4 best SP, the best reliever, and 4 position players(3 of them stars) are basically chiseled in concrete, it’s gonna feel familiar unless you start making trades for the sake of trades. The reckoning starts one way or another after next year, when you have half the rotation plus Rizzo out of contract.

[Cubswin11]

I just made this up but mostly it's the gist of what I want right now probably:

 

C: Zunino/Caratini - I assume the former will be non-tendered, the staff seems to like Caratini well enough to survive with that min salary, Jason Castro is another Caratini partner I like. Worst case is the catchers just catcher well, wouldn't be surprised if a Caratini/vet pairing finds some offense mad $/WAR potential

 

1B - Rizzo

 

2B - Cesar Hernandez, Bote, Hoerner - for Happ, maybe someone like Joey Wendle from the Rays instead

 

SS - Baez, Hoerner, Bote

 

3B - Bryant, Bote

 

RF - Betts - Contreras, Marquez, Riley Thompson, Luis Verdugo, Cubs also get Darwinzon Hernandez

 

CF - Heyward/Brinson - Brinson for Almora and Mills

 

LF - Schwarber - Vin Diesel would be all like "too soon, junior" if Theo traded him now after forcing him down our throats through what now seems like growing pains. Turns out Schwarber's a pretty competent all around player, doesn't make it look pretty, Don't need a new norm so much as a peak year, maybe two but one and trade is fine, that are super cheap

 

Darvish

Hendricks

Quintana - A guy I would love to package with Heyward to the Braves for Patrick Weigel or, with luck, Kyle Wright

Lester

Wacha - For the troll, Pineda for two years max I guess if they lack the confidence in the pitching department to do some trolling

 

Kimbrel

Chatwood

Wick

Ryan

Phelps? - Maybe someone cheaper depending on the details of his option. Collin McHugh?

Tony Cingrani - Signed mainly as a placeholder for Hernandez, who otherwise is a top 25 guy

Tyler Thornburg - These last two are more potential trolling for the pitching department, I hate the idea of spending serious money on bullpen and BOR arms this offseason

 

Trading Bote for a reliever seems obvious but I was losing steam by the time I got to him if not 7000+ posts ago

Sign me up, outside of Brinson move. He horsefeathering sucks, like one of the worst players I’ve ever seen. I thought of Hernandez as a target as well, but went with Fraizer in my mock. I’m fine keeping Bote because he’s solid, but more as the 11-12th man on the 25 man for position players.

[Sammy Sofa]

Sign me up, outside of Brinson move. He horsefeathering sucks, like one of the worst players I’ve ever seen. I thought of Hernandez as a target as well, but went with Fraizer in my mock. I’m fine keeping Bote because he’s solid, but more as the 11-12th man on the 25 man for position players.

 

Meh, we've awarded and will award free jobs to way less productive prospects than Brinson for making contact and existing as Cubs. For the cost it's just swapping out a Almora and a not dead low ceiling cheap ML arm for a guy who min salary CF who actually hit in the minors to backup the OF. The overarching point on Brinson is you're probably not getting a clearcut starting CF like Margot for the kind of prices the Cubs can pay for a non-stud

 

Translation:

 

[Cubswin11]

Sign me up, outside of Brinson move. He horsefeathering sucks, like one of the worst players I’ve ever seen. I thought of Hernandez as a target as well, but went with Fraizer in my mock. I’m fine keeping Bote because he’s solid, but more as the 11-12th man on the 25 man for position players.

 

Meh, we've awarded and will award free jobs to way less productive prospects than Brinson for making contact and existing as Cubs. Meanwhile the lineup is full of guys who K'd in the minors but also mashed, most like Brinson big guys for the position. For the cost - just swapping out a Almora and a not dead low ceiling cheap ML arm for a guy who min salary CF who actually hit in the minors to backup the OF - it's worth it on that kind of roster. The overarching point on Brinson is you're probably not getting a clearcut starting CF like Margot for the kind of prices the Cubs can pay for a non-stud

Dude Lewis Brinson is horsefeathering horrible. Also how is the cost on Margot prohibitive? He’s a short side of the platoon bat and good defender, Happ and a Short or Ademan is more than enough for that.

[minnesotacubsfan]

I think Theo goes scorched earth on this roster. I think the only untouchables are Rizzo, Javy and Hendricks. Everyone else is various levels of available. Heck Rizzo might even be available but I think they want his clubhouse presence and the Cubs probably value a 30 year old 1B with 2 years left on his deal more than other teams would. I don't think they will dump guys just to upend the roster but I think they will set out to fix some of the lingering issues this team has had the last couple of seasons and will be more willing than ever to trade a Bryant/Contreras/Schwarber. I'd put money on at least 1 of those 3 being gone in the offseason.

 

You guys do roster construction stuff much better than me, I'm just throwing guesses out there. But I think Theo knows that the roster needs more than just a couple of small tweaks.

 

I think youre right that at least one of Rizzo/Bryant/schwarber/Contreras will be out, but id say in order of most to least likely itd be Schwarber/Rizzo/Bryant/Contreras. Schwarber is pretty obvious, but i put Rizzo as 2nd most likely simply because its easier to replace a 1st baseman, and his contract seems to give him some excess value that will start to deteriorate rapidly as he gets closer to FA. If youre gonna trade Rizzo rather than watch him leave via FA, the time to do so is this offseason. We have inhouse options to replace him, too. But id rather go outside to replace him if he did get traded.

 

 

I think you have it backwards

[sweetpeteman]

I think Theo goes scorched earth on this roster. I think the only untouchables are Rizzo, Javy and Hendricks. Everyone else is various levels of available. Heck Rizzo might even be available but I think they want his clubhouse presence and the Cubs probably value a 30 year old 1B with 2 years left on his deal more than other teams would. I don't think they will dump guys just to upend the roster but I think they will set out to fix some of the lingering issues this team has had the last couple of seasons and will be more willing than ever to trade a Bryant/Contreras/Schwarber. I'd put money on at least 1 of those 3 being gone in the offseason.

 

You guys do roster construction stuff much better than me, I'm just throwing guesses out there. But I think Theo knows that the roster needs more than just a couple of small tweaks.

 

I think youre right that at least one of Rizzo/Bryant/schwarber/Contreras will be out, but id say in order of most to least likely itd be Schwarber/Rizzo/Bryant/Contreras. Schwarber is pretty obvious, but i put Rizzo as 2nd most likely simply because its easier to replace a 1st baseman, and his contract seems to give him some excess value that will start to deteriorate rapidly as he gets closer to FA. If youre gonna trade Rizzo rather than watch him leave via FA, the time to do so is this offseason. We have inhouse options to replace him, too. But id rather go outside to replace him if he did get traded.

 

 

I think you have it backwards

 

 

It's easily Contreras/Schwarber......................Rizzo/Bryant

 

 

The reasons:

 

Contreras is probably the most likely to be moved. He's got the combination of high value but expendable. He's in a high value position and is likely to be able to bring back the value in a trade that makes it worth trading him while the Cubs also have an in house option to replace him. Caratini doesn't seem like he'd be that much of a step down with the bat, while also providing better game calling/framing. Contreras has the arm, but overall I think Caratini is better behind the plate.

 

Schwarber is also in a position where he could be replaced with a FA, like Nick, Puig, or a stop-gap like Corey Dickerson.

 

Rizzo and Bryant are really interchangeable. I don't see either one being moved. Rizzo is still on a very team-friendly deal, and frankly isn't going to bring that much back that would be worth trading him for. While Goldschmidt brought back a really good haul for the DBacks, I don't see Rizzo getting that much.

Bryant isn't getting moved because there is no way in hell they are trading him for anything but an absolute block buster of an offer that isn't going to be there.

[Named After Maddux]

 

 

Contreras is probably the most likely to be moved. He's got the combination of high value but expendable. He's in a high value position and is likely to be able to bring back the value in a trade that makes it worth trading him while the Cubs also have an in house option to replace him. Caratini doesn't seem like he'd be that much of a step down with the bat, while also providing better game calling/framing. Contreras has the arm, but overall I think Caratini is better behind the plate.

 

I completely agree and I’d be very interested in signing Grandal for a Grandal/Caratini C tandem.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

The 4 best SP, the best reliever, and 4 position players(3 of them stars) are basically chiseled in concrete, it’s gonna feel familiar unless you start making trades for the sake of trades. The reckoning starts one way or another after next year, when you have half the rotation plus Rizzo out of contract.

 

Crap. Then we are screwed. If the core of this team is basically the same next year, I expect to see the exact same type of performance next season. We might as well just start retooling rather than letting everybody play out their contracts.

 

I'd rather trade KB for Betts, trade for Whit Merrifield and sign Rendon.

 

Granted, none of this is probably possible, but that's the kind of shakeup I'd like to see. I love KB, but he's one more ailment away next season from officially breaking down. He has gone months each of the last two seasons with an injury that has zapped him.

[Cubswin11]

The 4 best SP, the best reliever, and 4 position players(3 of them stars) are basically chiseled in concrete, it’s gonna feel familiar unless you start making trades for the sake of trades. The reckoning starts one way or another after next year, when you have half the rotation plus Rizzo out of contract.

 

Crap. Then we are screwed. If the core of this team is basically the same next year, I expect to see the exact same type of performance next season. We might as well just start retooling rather than letting everybody play out their contracts.

 

I'd rather trade KB for Betts, trade for Whit Merrifield and sign Rendon.

 

Granted, none of this is probably possible, but that's the kind of shakeup I'd like to see. I love KB, but he's one more ailment away next season from officially breaking down. He has gone months each of the last two seasons with an injury that has zapped him.

No we are not “screwed.” That sequence of moves is so unlikely, just not realistic. The problem isn’t the core, the core is still pretty damn good. The problem is the margins and complimentary pieces to supplement what the core lacks, which can be addressed in the offseason. You just don’t blow it up, you make a real effort with the likely $20-30 mil in available money and a lesser trade piece (Willy/Schwarbs) to go figure it out.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

The 4 best SP, the best reliever, and 4 position players(3 of them stars) are basically chiseled in concrete, it’s gonna feel familiar unless you start making trades for the sake of trades. The reckoning starts one way or another after next year, when you have half the rotation plus Rizzo out of contract.

 

Crap. Then we are screwed. If the core of this team is basically the same next year, I expect to see the exact same type of performance next season. We might as well just start retooling rather than letting everybody play out their contracts.

 

I'd rather trade KB for Betts, trade for Whit Merrifield and sign Rendon.

 

Granted, none of this is probably possible, but that's the kind of shakeup I'd like to see. I love KB, but he's one more ailment away next season from officially breaking down. He has gone months each of the last two seasons with an injury that has zapped him.

No we are not “screwed.” That sequence of moves is so unlikely, just not realistic. The problem isn’t the core, the core is still pretty damn good. The problem is the margins and complimentary pieces to supplement what the core lacks, which can be addressed in the offseason. You just don’t blow it up, you make a real effort with the likely $20-30 mil in available money and a lesser trade piece (Willy/Schwarbs) to go figure it out.

 

I don't know, man. I just think we are going to be right back here next year trying to come up with why this core again didn't get it done.

 

KB for Betts and Rendon are very unlikely, but at least shoot for somebody that resembles 2016 Dex.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

What good does Bryant for Betts even do besides subtract an MVP candidate to replace him with one hitting FA after the season? How is Bryant's 26-27 any different from Rendon's 25-26 outside of being way better?

 

Well, it's more replacing Bryant with Rendon but then also getting another star for KB. So sort of two stars for one.

 

But, yeah, none of this is actually happening. I've just grown fatigued watching this offense and hope for something a tad different.

 

ETA: I also thought Betts and KB were both under contract for two more seasons.

[Cubswin11]

 

Crap. Then we are screwed. If the core of this team is basically the same next year, I expect to see the exact same type of performance next season. We might as well just start retooling rather than letting everybody play out their contracts.

 

I'd rather trade KB for Betts, trade for Whit Merrifield and sign Rendon.

 

Granted, none of this is probably possible, but that's the kind of shakeup I'd like to see. I love KB, but he's one more ailment away next season from officially breaking down. He has gone months each of the last two seasons with an injury that has zapped him.

No we are not “screwed.” That sequence of moves is so unlikely, just not realistic. The problem isn’t the core, the core is still pretty damn good. The problem is the margins and complimentary pieces to supplement what the core lacks, which can be addressed in the offseason. You just don’t blow it up, you make a real effort with the likely $20-30 mil in available money and a lesser trade piece (Willy/Schwarbs) to go figure it out.

 

I don't know, man. I just think we are going to be right back here next year trying to come up with why this core again didn't get it done.

 

KB for Betts and Rendon are very unlikely, but at least shoot for somebody that resembles 2016 Dex.

For as fun as that would be, they just won't add Betts (with KB or Rendon on the roster) he'd soak up all the available money. Which yeah that sucks but we are dealing in reality, let's wait a year and hope we can grab him in FA. The trade KB for stuff and sign Rendon sequence makes sense on paper and in a video game but I think it's harder to pull off in reality.

 

That leaves us with the fact we have 13-15 WAR banked between KB, Javy and Rizzo going in to next year. They are not the problem. The problems are the pieces around them and we need to make the roster deeper and more diverse to supplement their deficiencies. This was similar to the pre-2016 offseason, we saw our butts get shoved in the CS vs the Mets pitching because we had too much swing and miss and saw we needed a more well rounded roster and contact so we added Zobrist and Heyward. It's not all that dissimilar to this offseason coming up, you know what your core is with those three so go address it with the margin and supplemental moves (which involves trading at least one of Willy or Schwarbs). Build out a deeper roster on offense with some more contact and complimentary pieces and things should shake out better. The pitching also has a decent enough foundation with the guys returning that it's more back filling than doing a big overhaul. The offense should be the big focus.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

No we are not “screwed.” That sequence of moves is so unlikely, just not realistic. The problem isn’t the core, the core is still pretty damn good. The problem is the margins and complimentary pieces to supplement what the core lacks, which can be addressed in the offseason. You just don’t blow it up, you make a real effort with the likely $20-30 mil in available money and a lesser trade piece (Willy/Schwarbs) to go figure it out.

 

I don't know, man. I just think we are going to be right back here next year trying to come up with why this core again didn't get it done.

 

KB for Betts and Rendon are very unlikely, but at least shoot for somebody that resembles 2016 Dex.

For as fun as that would be, they just won't add Betts (with KB or Rendon on the roster) he'd soak up all the available money. Which yeah that sucks but we are dealing in reality, let's wait a year and hope we can grab him in FA. The trade KB for stuff and sign Rendon sequence makes sense on paper and in a video game but I think it's harder to pull off in reality.

 

That leaves us with the fact we have 13-15 WAR banked between KB, Javy and Rizzo going in to next year. They are not the problem. The problems are the pieces around them and we need to make the roster deeper and more diverse to supplement their deficiencies. This was similar to the pre-2016 offseason, we saw our butts get shoved in the CS vs the Mets pitching because we had too much swing and miss and saw we needed a more well rounded roster and contact so we added Zobrist and Heyward. It's not all that dissimilar to this offseason coming up, you know what your core is with those three so go address it with the margin and supplemental moves (which involves trading at least one of Willy or Schwarbs). Build out a deeper roster on offense with some more contact and complimentary pieces and things should shake out better. The pitching also has a decent enough foundation with the guys returning that it's more back filling than doing a big overhaul. The offense should be the big focus.

 

Yeah, that would be fine. Baez, Rizzo and Bryant are cool in the middle. I just really want -- about to sound meatbally here -- a spark at the top. Maybe even two. A couple guys who make contact, get on base and have speed. Guys who can create havoc while getting knocked in by those three. But that's way easier said then done. I suppose everybody wants those guys.

[Cubswin11]

 

I don't know, man. I just think we are going to be right back here next year trying to come up with why this core again didn't get it done.

 

KB for Betts and Rendon are very unlikely, but at least shoot for somebody that resembles 2016 Dex.

For as fun as that would be, they just won't add Betts (with KB or Rendon on the roster) he'd soak up all the available money. Which yeah that sucks but we are dealing in reality, let's wait a year and hope we can grab him in FA. The trade KB for stuff and sign Rendon sequence makes sense on paper and in a video game but I think it's harder to pull off in reality.

 

That leaves us with the fact we have 13-15 WAR banked between KB, Javy and Rizzo going in to next year. They are not the problem. The problems are the pieces around them and we need to make the roster deeper and more diverse to supplement their deficiencies. This was similar to the pre-2016 offseason, we saw our butts get shoved in the CS vs the Mets pitching because we had too much swing and miss and saw we needed a more well rounded roster and contact so we added Zobrist and Heyward. It's not all that dissimilar to this offseason coming up, you know what your core is with those three so go address it with the margin and supplemental moves (which involves trading at least one of Willy or Schwarbs). Build out a deeper roster on offense with some more contact and complimentary pieces and things should shake out better. The pitching also has a decent enough foundation with the guys returning that it's more back filling than doing a big overhaul. The offense should be the big focus.

 

Yeah, that would be fine. Baez, Rizzo and Bryant are cool in the middle. I just really want -- about to sound meatbally here -- a spark at the top. Maybe even two. A couple guys who make contact, get on base and have speed. Guys who can create havoc while getting knocked in by those three. But that's way easier said then done. I suppose everybody wants those guys.

If they can't find that guy, which idk if he's out there (Brett Gardner, Margot vs LHP, Nico if he really is a thing, idk) just throw Rizzo at the top and make him the leadoff. That solves a lot of problems with the vaunted lead off spot. Then find more contacty guys down stream in the lineup.

[Bear Cub]

A whole bunch of pipe dreams here!

[ChiCubsFan]

This is all so depressing.

[Post Count Padder]

Bring back Big Stick Nick (4 years, $65?)

Trade Chatwood and a prospect to Phillies for Cesar Hernandez

Trade Ian Happ/Almora/prospect to the Orioles for Bundy/Givens

Cut Descalso

Nontender Russell

Sign Cameron Maybin

Sign Collin McHugh

 

 

Willy

Rizzo

Hernandez

Baez

Bryant

Castellanos

Heyward

Schwarber

 

Caratini

Kemp

Bote

Maybin

 

 

 

Lester

Hendricks

Q

Darvish

Bundy

 

Kimbrel

Givens

Ryan

Phelps

Wick

Wieck

Mills

McHugh

 

Let's do the painstaking thing again next year!

[Post Count Padder]

Honestly could just tear it all down too. Who cares anymore.

[Sammy Sofa]

The likely outcome is that bullpen is going to be, yet again, a nightmare at the best of times, and the starting rotation is all but a lock to be worse than it is this year due to age, likely injury and lack of money. Holy horsefeathers, did these guys drop the horsefeathering ball on pitching post-2016.

[Derwood]

I'm calling a major Rowan Wick blow up year in 2020.

[Sammy Sofa]

I'm calling a major Rowan Wick blow up year in 2020.

 

Given the track record of the medical staff, this might actually means he literally explodes.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Who the horsefeathers would seriously want to sign KB to a 15 year anything?

[mhuber92211]

When Bryce Harper went to Philly, I had the random thought that KB would be joining him when he reached FA. Why not start that move this off season? Trade KB for Nola & Hernandez & Pivetta/Irvin. Keep Castellanos and sign Rendon.