Bulls offseason

[WrigleyField 22]

Plus I'm totally prepped for the return on any such deal to be a former mid lotto PG instead of a pick and the Bulls to throw in a future second.

[David]

I don't understand how Paxson could possibly be signing off on these things.

 

He wasn't a complete idiot before Forman came around. How is this complete incompetence happening?

[SouthSideRyan]

So sounds like Wade will still opt in. Maybe they'll try to trade him or buy him out. I'd think they'd decline Rondos option.

 

 

PG - Rondo (option) Dunn, MCW (FA), Grant, Payne

SG - Wade, Wade, Valentine, Canaan

SF- Zipser

PF - Markkanen, Niko (FA), Portis, Lauvergne (FA)

C -RoLo, Felicio (FA)

 

I swear to God, if you guys cost the Nets their #1 pick.

[SouthSideRyan]

And yes, I'm really pissed at Ainge. If they don't wind up with Porzingis or George, this has been a miserable failure.

[WrigleyField 22]

And yes, I'm really pissed at Ainge. If they don't wind up with Porzingis or George, this has been a miserable failure.

Would you have done Butler for no 3?

[KingCubsFan]

Is there a single person in the media even kind of defending it? Legitimately asking. I'd love to read it.

No. One SI.com article said the only defensible thing about the deal is how bad it makes the team now, and I think that's the closest thing to a defense I've seen.

 

And the hell of it is, it probably doesn't even make the team THAT bad unless Dunn and LaVine both turn into their worst-case scenarios. A basket of future picks probably would've made the team really bad, but they wouldn't even go that route apparently.

 

FWIW, Boston supposedly wasn't offering 3 or next year's Nets pick (Danny Ainge is allergic to trading anything with any value at all), so who knows if there was a better deal out there.

Based on the info coming out today, it sounds like neither Boston nor Phoenix was willing to give up their pick. This was the best offer.

[SouthSideRyan]

And yes, I'm really pissed at Ainge. If they don't wind up with Porzingis or George, this has been a miserable failure.

Would you have done Butler for no 3?

 

A few days ago I said I'd go as far as the 3, the LAL/SAC pick, Crowder, and Smart. Apparently any one of those things would've been enough?

[cubbyvirus00]

Sounds like nobody was really willing to offer a top pick for cost controlled 27 year old Jimmy Butler. Weird. Boston should have traded for him because it looks like they have a bunch of picks but will fall to Lebron yet again.

 

 

Last night was a disaster. The only silver lining is that it not only ushered in a rebuild, but I'm assuming GarPax's leash just got tighter and somewhat shorter. The fans now have 0 reason to show up and maybe a few years of that will end the clown show.

[WrigleyField 22]

Sounds like nobody was really willing to offer a top pick for cost controlled 27 year old Jimmy Butler. Weird. Boston should have traded for him because it looks like they have a bunch of picks but will fall to Lebron yet again.

 

 

Last night was a disaster. The only silver lining is that it not only ushered in a rebuild, but I'm assuming GarPax's leash just got tighter and somewhat shorter. The fans now have 0 reason to show up and maybe a few years of that will end the clown show.

I don't think their leash really got shorter, they just got a three year free pass.

[Sammy Sofa]

Sounds like nobody was really willing to offer a top pick for cost controlled 27 year old Jimmy Butler. Weird. Boston should have traded for him because it looks like they have a bunch of picks but will fall to Lebron yet again.

 

 

Last night was a disaster. The only silver lining is that it not only ushered in a rebuild, but I'm assuming GarPax's leash just got tighter and somewhat shorter. The fans now have 0 reason to show up and maybe a few years of that will end the clown show.

I don't think their leash really got shorter, they just got a three year free pass.

 

Yeah, since when does Reinsdorf give a horsefeathers? The White Sox have had some garbage attendance and that FO hasn't turned over at all. Why would he flip the Bulls FO suddenly?

[bcl412]

I'm underwhelmed by the trade but I don't really understand the Zach Lavine hate aside from the injury. A 22 year old who averaged 18 points a game while being a good three point shooter is pretty good.

[raw]

I'm underwhelmed by the trade but I don't really understand the Zach Lavine hate aside from the injury. A 22 year old who averaged 18 points a game while being a good three point shooter is pretty good.

 

He doesn't seem to have any great actual basketball skill. He's basically putting up those numbers by being extremely athletic, with the ability to jump a mile in the air. While that is a great ability to have, it's typically not something that is a sustained way of putting up numbers. And he's not good enough in the halfcourt game to be an efficient enough scorer. Like you said, he is 22, and maybe he can develop his halfcourt game like young Vince Carter did (though Carter was better already by this point). But most likely, he's a guy that will never be more than a 3rd option in the halfcourt and a stud in transition. And this reeks of the days the Bulls were signing/trading for Eddie Robinson and Larry Hughes to be the best player on the team.

[Outshined_One]

I'm underwhelmed by the trade but I don't really understand the Zach Lavine hate aside from the injury. A 22 year old who averaged 18 points a game while being a good three point shooter is pretty good.

 

Restricted free agent after the upcoming season. The Bulls should have the cap space to match any offer made to him, but it's conceivable he's gone after a year with this team.

[bcl412]

I'm underwhelmed by the trade but I don't really understand the Zach Lavine hate aside from the injury. A 22 year old who averaged 18 points a game while being a good three point shooter is pretty good.

 

He doesn't seem to have any great actual basketball skill. He's basically putting up those numbers by being extremely athletic, with the ability to jump a mile in the air. While that is a great ability to have, it's typically not something that is a sustained way of putting up numbers. And he's not good enough in the halfcourt game to be an efficient enough scorer. Like you said, he is 22, and maybe he can develop his halfcourt game like young Vince Carter did (though Carter was better already by this point). But most likely, he's a guy that will never be more than a 3rd option in the halfcourt and a stud in transition. And this reeks of the days the Bulls were signing/trading for Eddie Robinson and Larry Hughes to be the best player on the team.

 

He's been a decently efficient scorer though. I think he's a pretty underrated player and I'd be more excited about getting him if it weren't for the injury and the contract situation.

[Cubswin11]

I'm underwhelmed by the trade but I don't really understand the Zach Lavine hate aside from the injury. A 22 year old who averaged 18 points a game while being a good three point shooter is pretty good.

He's a horrifically, awful defender too by almost all accounts and they are going to have to decide to give him like 3-4 years at $12 mil+ a year after the season as well.

[LeonDurham]

The only thing that I'm bothered by is selling the pick. It bothers me not because it says GarPax are stupid- because even an idiot wouldn't sell a pick just for $. It bothers me because it says the ownership of one of the most lucrative and valuable franchises in the NBA wouldn't pay $3.5 million for a chance at hitting on a Draymond Green or Isaiah Thomas.

 

But the trade doesn't bother me at all. I like Butler a lot but don't get all the angst. His value was overrated. People act like the Bulls turned down many other better deals and wanted to give him to Thibs. He's a top 15-20 player who has 2 years left on a team friendly deal on a Bulls team that has no hope whatsoever of contending while Butler is still in his prime. After that, he's going to want supermax. No thank you.

 

Watch what the Pacers get for PG or see what Sac got for Cousins. Why people feel that Butler is worth multiple lottery picks and/or a proven young star is beyond me. There is a very limited market for him, especially given he dominance of GS. He might make a lot of teams marginally better but he certainly isn't going to push many teams over the top especially when he will probably be in decline before GS.

[davell]

I'm underwhelmed by the trade but I don't really understand the Zach Lavine hate aside from the injury. A 22 year old who averaged 18 points a game while being a good three point shooter is pretty good.

He's a horrifically, awful defender too by almost all accounts and they are going to have to decide to give him like 3-4 years at $12 mil+ a year after the season as well.

 

Holy horsefeathers, do you look at NBA contracts? What the hells wrong with giving him THAT lol?

[Splendid Splinter]

I'm underwhelmed by the trade but I don't really understand the Zach Lavine hate aside from the injury. A 22 year old who averaged 18 points a game while being a good three point shooter is pretty good.

He's a horrifically, awful defender too by almost all accounts and they are going to have to decide to give him like 3-4 years at $12 mil+ a year after the season as well.

 

Holy horsefeathers, do you look at NBA contracts? What the hells wrong with giving him THAT lol?

 

Yeah that's a no brainer there. I mean there's talks of teams going to offer Andre Igoudala $20 mil+ a year. Andre horsefeathering Igoudala!!!

 

Evan Turner got 4/70 which is 17.5 mil a year which is what I'm expecting Lavine gets.

[Brian]

I feel worse about the Bulls and their future than I did about the Cubs in the last days of Jim Hendry.

 

 

Not to be morbid and all, but is there any reason to believe that the end of the Jerry Reinsdorf era is going to be anything close to Bill to Rocky Wirtz?

[WrigleyField 22]

I feel worse about the Bulls and their future than I did about the Cubs in the last days of Jim Hendry.

 

 

Not to be morbid and all, but is there any reason to believe that the end of the Jerry Reinsdorf era is going to be anything close to Bill to Rocky Wirtz?

Michael Reinsdorf is apparently Gar's biggest advocate, so...

[Brian]

sigh

[davell]

I think it goes deeper than even that. Their wives are either sisters or best friends.

[Brian]

I was really hoping the answer was going to be that his heir's don't give a horsefeathers about sports/the headaches of owning two teams and are going to sell the teams to get the quick cash... I guess that's probably not the case, right?

[davell]

I was really hoping the answer was going to be that his heir's don't give a horsefeathers about sports/the headaches of owning two teams and are going to sell the teams to get the quick cash... I guess that's probably not the case, right?

 

I'm not 100% sure, but I think they've said they had no interest in selling. Hopefully I'm imagining that though.

[WrigleyField 22]

I was really hoping the answer was going to be that his heir's don't give a horsefeathers about sports/the headaches of owning two teams and are going to sell the teams to get the quick cash... I guess that's probably not the case, right?

I've heard Michael cares way more about the Bulls than Sox.

 

It's just a different structure overall though. Reinsdorf is one of many minority owners, but the sole general partner for the limited partners. So he has complete control of the investment, but carries a fiduciary responsibility to those LP's, and likely the partnership would contain provisions that the LPs could vote to remove the general partner.

 

Not sure if I've ever heard that the succession plan is definitely that Michael would inherit the businesses. Maybe Jerry will realize his investments and cash out and and dissolve the partnership before he dies.