2015 Cubs-Related Trade Deadline Rumor Thread

[Hairyducked Idiot]

For those genuinely upset about the trade deadline(and not just countering 'well they tried!' arguments), what was your line for not being unhappy with the results? If they had gotten Kazmir or Leake instead of Haren? Or was it a big talent like Ross/Price or bust?

 

Can the line be "Do at least as much as at least one of our key playoff-spot rivals?"

[Sammy Sofa]

For those genuinely upset about the trade deadline(and not just countering 'well they tried!' arguments), what was your line for not being unhappy with the results? If they had gotten Kazmir or Leake instead of Haren? Or was it a big talent like Ross/Price or bust?

 

I don't think anyone here is really that upset given what's come out about what teams were asking for. Basically it seems to come down to the Cubs not being willing to move Baez, and that just is what it is. A lot of people just take issue with those that are crowing about how they're simply happy the Cubs didn't "sell the farm."

[Hairyducked Idiot]

For those genuinely upset about the trade deadline(and not just countering 'well they tried!' arguments), what was your line for not being unhappy with the results? If they had gotten Kazmir or Leake instead of Haren? Or was it a big talent like Ross/Price or bust?

 

I don't think anyone here is really that upset given what's come out about what teams were asking for. Basically it seems to come down to the Cubs not being willing to move Baez, and that just is what it is. A lot of people just take issue with those that are crowing about how they're simply happy the Cubs didn't "sell the farm."

 

I'm a *little* upset. Less upset than I've been at other times, probably because they've worn me down at this point. It was a D+/C- kind of deadline.

[Guest]

For those genuinely upset about the trade deadline(and not just countering 'well they tried!' arguments), what was your line for not being unhappy with the results? If they had gotten Kazmir or Leake instead of Haren? Or was it a big talent like Ross/Price or bust?

 

Can the line be "Do at least as much as at least one of our key playoff-spot rivals?"

 

The line can be whatever you want, I'm genuinely curious what it is for you. Assuming you are truly upset about the outcome and not just arguing against people who are too far on the other side of the spectrum.

[NOLA]

What is wrong with some of you people? From all indications, the Cubs tried quite hard to trade for controllable impact talent, which is exactly what we should have hoped they attempted to do. They came up empty, but for the 100th time, how can you be so irritated when you don't even know what was being asked for a guy like Ross? I swear if some of you people were the GMs, you'd run the team right into the ground within two years.

 

And for the love of God, can people stop acting like it's so bad the Cubs might have been looking more toward the future than the present, even in their trade targets? This is not the right time to go all in. The right time is when you're the Royals and you have a really good team and you can add a few pieces to solidify your chance at winning a championship. Or when you can make a trade to get to be as good as the Royals were before they made their trades, thus putting yourself in the convo to win a title.

 

There is not a team built like the Cubs right now. I can't imagine a team built on 21, 22 and 23 year olds winning the whole thing, which is all I care about. Save me the "you have to give yourself a chance" stuff. Even had we gotten Ross, we would still need a miracle to win it all. You have to realistically look at your chances and tune out the "What if everything just hits perfect" thoughts.

 

Also, totally random, but Carlos Gomez is not that good. You bitches.

Preach it. The Cubs should be in a better position next season at the deadline unless something has gone really wrong, and then they'd better make a big move. That realistic hope is a stronger bet to me than going deep into the playoffs this year. Before the last couple of weeks of suck I would have felt differently, maybe.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

The line can be whatever you want, I'm genuinely curious what it is for you. Assuming you are truly upset about the outcome and not just arguing against people who are too far on the other side of the spectrum.

 

I hate trying to phrase it in binary terms like this. I'm glad they didn't do literally nothing. I don't think they did enough. I'm happy that the Cubs are in contention. I'm annoyed that all the other contenders got more better than we did. I am excited about our young hitting. I'm a bit nervous we didn't do anything to make the pitching staff younger and more stable in the medium-term.

 

I don't think there had to be one line that said "Kyle Happy" on one side and "Kyle Sad" on the other. (I'm sure someone can finish off that alley-oop)

[Bryants Disco Ball]

How are the Cubs not a good team that could have added a few pieces to solidify their chances? They're 55-47 on August 1st.

 

The Cubs are so not a legit contender this season. So you add a Tyson Ross and Craig Kimbrel, and you're better but still not a big-time contender. I'm not talking a contender for the second wild card, I'm talking a contender for a championship. And the Cubs would't be like some wild card teams from the past that had success. When you get to the postseason, yes, I will acknowledge that you give yourself a chance to win it all. Of course you do.

 

But the chances the Cubs, with half their starting lineup 23 or younger and two more who are 25, going through, let's say, the Pirates, Cardinals, Dodgers and Royals is absurd. Oh, and that's also trying to take over the Giants just to get to the playoffs.

 

Oh, hell no. And by the way, I'd have been fine with Ross and Kimbrel because it helped us for the future. [expletive] literally every rental we could have gotten that would have cost a lot.

 

So what ages do they have to be for their chances to be better? What record do they need to have? You just gave us a bunch of nebulous criteria for when the Cubs would be "really" competitive. There's likely always going to be better teams they'll have to face.

 

1. Whatever age makes more than half of them not rookies, all of whom have struggled big-time for stretches this season (Schwarbs is too new, so not him), as should be expected.

 

2. Actually, I think there might not be better teams on paper in a few years. And if there are, we will still be No. 2.

 

3. You all are smart. I know you realize the Cubs would need so much to break right to win it all this year even with the additions we talked about. It's OK not to go and make a bunch of trades just so you might be able to squeak in the playoffs. That is a way to run your team into the ground rather quickly. No team goes all-in every year. None. Why the hell would we pick this year to do it? (And I mean, now that the team is respectable).

[Guest]

For those genuinely upset about the trade deadline(and not just countering 'well they tried!' arguments), what was your line for not being unhappy with the results? If they had gotten Kazmir or Leake instead of Haren? Or was it a big talent like Ross/Price or bust?

 

Can the line be "Do at least as much as at least one of our key playoff-spot rivals?"

Haren + Hunter ~= Leake.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

For those genuinely upset about the trade deadline(and not just countering 'well they tried!' arguments), what was your line for not being unhappy with the results? If they had gotten Kazmir or Leake instead of Haren? Or was it a big talent like Ross/Price or bust?

 

I don't think anyone here is really that upset given what's come out about what teams were asking for. Basically it seems to come down to the Cubs not being willing to move Baez, and that just is what it is. A lot of people just take issue with those that are crowing about how they're simply happy the Cubs didn't "sell the farm."

 

I might be reading wrong, but I feel like a lot of people are upset. And that's why you are getting those who are crowing about not selling the farm.

 

ETA: I'll sell the farm. [expletive] yes, I'd love to. Just not this year.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Preach it. The Cubs should be in a better position next season at the deadline unless something has gone really wrong

 

Meh. The 2016 Cubs right now don't seem that much better to me than the 2015 Cubs. The older and overperforming pitching staff should be projected to give back anything the young and underperforming offense gives you.

 

The main reason to think 2016 might be better is "holy crap, the Cardinals can't win 110 games every year," I guess.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

Preach it. The Cubs should be in a better position next season at the deadline unless something has gone really wrong

 

Meh. The 2016 Cubs right now don't seem that much better to me than the 2015 Cubs. The older and overperforming pitching staff should be projected to give back anything the young and underperforming offense gives you.

 

The main reason to think 2016 might be better is "holy crap, the Cardinals can't win 110 games every year," I guess.

 

Oh, hell no, Idiot.

 

First, they will sign another quality pitcher to go with our other top pitchers, none of whom I expect to regress much at all. And, you will see an improvement from a lot of these very, very talented young guys. I don't anticipate them all hitting their stride next season, but I do think the slumps will be less exaggerated.

 

It's OK to realize the future is bright and not be scared about it.

Edited August 1, 2015 by Bryant's Disco Ball

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Haren + Hunter ~= Leake.

 

Can't agree. Leake has roughly doubled their fWAR total this year.

[Guest]

This not the right time to go all in. The right time is when you're the Royals and you have a really good team and you can add a few pieces to solidify your chance at winning a championship.

 

Could not be more unequivocally wrong. The right time is when you need to make a move to increase your chances of getting in the playoffs. Doing it when you're solidly in makes far less sense.

 

The moves are a lot about getting into the playoffs, not very much what you do once you're there.

[Sammy Sofa]

1. Whatever age makes more than half of them not rookies, all of whom have struggled big-time for stretches this season (Schwarbs is too new, so not him), as should be expected.

 

All the more reason to bolster a team eyeing the playoffs. Established players like Rizzo, Fowler, Castro and Montero have had extended horrendous stretches this year, so it's not as though not being a rookie means that that won't happen. Like stupid babies, teams that are right there fighting to get in are the ones that need the most help.

 

2. Actually, I think there might not be better teams on paper in a few years. And if there are, we will still be No. 2.

 

If you're assuming they're going to go out there and regularly dominate, you're likely going to be disappointed. They're tied up in a ton of ways financially for years to come, they've focused on creating an offense-first team in a very offensively depressed environment, and they're in a division that is likely to remain competitive for the foreseeable future. I think it's very likely that they're going to be very good, but I don't think they're going to be coasting very often. Besides, if the Cubs actually did end up being THAT good, why would they need to make key deadline moves more than teams who are fighting?

 

3. You all are smart. I know you realize the Cubs would need so much to break right to win it all this year even with the additions we talked about. It's OK not to go and make a bunch of trades just so you might be able to squeak in the playoffs. That is a way to run your team into the ground rather quickly. No team goes all-in every year. None. Why the hell would we pick this year to do it? (And I mean, now that the team is respectable).

 

The Cubs bets young players were pretty much untouchable going into the deadline, so this fear that they would have in any way gutted what they've tried to build up over the last few years is ridiculous. The assets they have left in the farm at this point are, quite frankly, pretty average with a few exceptions. Most of them will go on to do bupkis and their primary avenues of impact are, quite honestly, as trade bait. Plus isn't one of the main things that is appealing about our FO is that they'll continually be able to draft and sign talent to replenish the farm system?

[Bryants Disco Ball]

This not the right time to go all in. The right time is when you're the Royals and you have a really good team and you can add a few pieces to solidify your chance at winning a championship.

 

Could not be more unequivocally wrong. The right time is when you need to make a move to increase your chances of getting in the playoffs. Doing it when you're solidly in makes far less sense.

 

The moves are a lot about getting into the playoffs, not very much what you do once you're there.

 

Damn it, David. I don't care about the "just get to the playoffs and anything can happen" card. Not with this current Cubs team. Playoffs or not, the chances of us winning it all this year are so damn remote. I'm not willing to give up a lot of stuff for that unrealistic dream.

 

And, we disagree. I thought it was the perfect time for the Royals to go all-in.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

First, they will sign another quality pitcher to go with our other top pitchers, none of whom I expect to regress much at all. And, you will see an improvement from a lot of these very, very talented young guys. I don't anticipate them all hitting their stride next season, but I do think the slumps will be less exaggerated.

 

It's OK to realize the future is bright and not be scared about it.

 

Well, I guess since the ink is already dry on that quality pitcher and there's no chance that the Dodgers might sign him instead, then that is pretty awesome.

 

I'm not "scared" of the future. I'm simply not taking the 60th percentile projection on everyone and crowing about how great it's going to be.

[Guest]

they've focused on creating an offense-first team in a very offensively depressed environment,

I keep seeing this mentioned like it's a bad thing, when in fact it's a very smart thing and by design.

[Sammy Sofa]

The way some people talk I'm kinda convinced they'd just assume the Cubs would fail in the playoffs if they face any team that technically has a better regular season record.

[Sammy Sofa]

they've focused on creating an offense-first team in a very offensively depressed environment,

I keep seeing this mentioned like it's a bad thing, when in fact it's a very smart thing and by design.

 

I agree, but I think many are expecting too much. It's not a bad thing at all, but I don't think it's too likely they end up with some kind of nu-Murderer's Row that's just taking advantage of everyone. Pitching is still going to dominate.

[Guest]

This not the right time to go all in. The right time is when you're the Royals and you have a really good team and you can add a few pieces to solidify your chance at winning a championship.

 

Could not be more unequivocally wrong. The right time is when you need to make a move to increase your chances of getting in the playoffs. Doing it when you're solidly in makes far less sense.

 

The moves are a lot about getting into the playoffs, not very much what you do once you're there.

 

Damn it, David. I don't care about the "just get to the playoffs and anything can happen" card. Not with this current Cubs team. Playoffs or not, the chances of us winning it all this year are so damn remote. I'm not willing to give up a lot of stuff for that unrealistic dream.

 

And, we disagree. I thought it was the perfect time for the Royals to go all-in.

 

Then you don't care about reality. That's what the playoffs are. Other than the obvious disadvantage to the wild cards before the play in game, the teams all have more or less equal odds of getting through. That's just what it is.

 

And if you do believe there's such a thing as being built for the playoffs, you can't ask much more than having 2015 Jake arrieta, Jon Lester, and Jason Hammel all on your team.

Edited August 1, 2015 by David

[Hairyducked Idiot]

they've focused on creating an offense-first team in a very offensively depressed environment,

I keep seeing this mentioned like it's a bad thing, when in fact it's a very smart thing and by design.

 

I like it, but I can see a failure condition. I sometimes wonder if the Cubs aren't focused on the kinds of hitters that would thrive in the 00s, but might not translate well to the 2010s pitching environment.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

[expletive], I couldn't split the quotes like you, Sofa.

 

But I was saying that I do think the Cubs are going to be pretty damn awesome sooner than later, and while certainly not just winning divisions easy, will be considered one of the best in the NL. I have a tremendous amount of faith in our young guys, and anticipate the team signing a billion dollar TV contract in a few years and being much like the Dodgers to an extent. Which also is the team I'd respond to your question about regarding which legit contenders make key deadline deals.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

[expletive], I couldn't split the quotes like you, Sofa.

 

But I was saying that I do think the Cubs are going to be pretty damn awesome sooner than later, and while certainly not just winning divisions easy, will be considered one of the best in the NL. I have a tremendous amount of faith in our young guys, and anticipate the team signing a billion dollar TV contract in a few years and being much like the Dodgers to an extent. Which also is the team I'd respond to your question about regarding which legit contenders make key deadline deals.

[Sammy Sofa]

they've focused on creating an offense-first team in a very offensively depressed environment,

I keep seeing this mentioned like it's a bad thing, when in fact it's a very smart thing and by design.

 

I like it, but I can see a failure condition. I sometimes wonder if the Cubs aren't focused on the kinds of hitters that would thrive in the 00s, but might not translate well to the 2010s pitching environment.

 

To me it seems like the kind of the thing that can run really hot and cold to extremes.

[Sammy Sofa]

[expletive], I couldn't split the quotes like you, Sofa.

 

But I was saying that I do think the Cubs are going to be pretty damn awesome sooner than later, and while certainly not just winning divisions easy, will be considered one of the best in the NL. I have a tremendous amount of faith in our young guys, and anticipate the team signing a billion dollar TV contract in a few years and being much like the Dodgers to an extent. Which also is the team I'd respond to your question about regarding which legit contenders make key deadline deals.

 

I'm really not trying to pick on this so much, but you say "considered one of the best in the NL" like it's a thing in the future when they have the 5th best record in the NL right now. If a top 5 team isn't one of the best, then what is?