Cubs "not motivated" to move Pena

[Guest]

LOL @ Hendry.

[TruffleShuffle]

Ladies and gentleman, your 2011-2015 Chicago Cubs 1B, Carlos Pena.

 

let's make a bet - i say carlos pena will not be the cubs' starting 1b through 2015. you say he will be. loser has to stop posting on nsbb.

[Have a seat, Neifi]

And now people are just piling on:

 

@joe_sheehan

Joe Sheehan

 

BREAKING: Jim Hendry says Koyie Hill not available.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Ladies and gentleman, your 2011-2015 Chicago Cubs 1B, Carlos Pena.

 

let's make a bet - i say carlos pena will not be the cubs' starting 1b through 2015. you say he will be. loser has to stop posting on nsbb.

 

Thats a lose lose for me.If I lose I cant post anymore. If I win I lose my spellchecker and daily dose of dry wit. How about if Im right you send me a case of Vegemite.

[Iceblink]

Gammons said Ramirez, Byrd, Pena, and Baker have all been the subject of inquiries, and the Cubs turned them all down saying that we were planning to use them to win next year. I'm pretty sure you could add Lou Gehrig to this team and we'd struggle to compete for the wild card.

 

Hendry is motivated by something other than fielding a team that can win games.

[HossmanGT]

Over in Stark's writings on ESPN, it also notes that the Braves took a run at Marlon Byrd, but the Cubs weren't going to move him.

 

The Braves are getting desperate to acquire a right-handed hitting outfielder, especially with guys like Pence and Beltran off the market. They are loaded with young pitching talent and Mike Minor appears to be the guy they were dangling for Pence. If Frank Wren comes back to the Cubs and offers Minor for Byrd, I really hope Hendry gives it strong consideration.

[XZero771679666304]

If Hendry is serious about not entertaining trade offers for Pena - and I can't truly believe he is - I don't know what to say. Even if he planned on bringing him back, he's going to be a FA anyway. Not trading him does virtually nothing to increase the chances of him being a Cub in 2012.

[Cubfanintheknow]

Cracks me up how several posters dismiss the baseball "experts" like Olney and Gammons as hacks at one moment and take them as gospel the next.

[YearofDaCubs]

Hendry is such a moron..

[erik316wttn]

How can someone like Pena be off the market?

 

Wasn't the entire reason we signed him was to flip him at the deadline for prospects if we were out of it?

[Little Slide Rooter]

How can someone like Pena be off the market?

 

Wasn't the entire reason we signed him was to flip him at the deadline for prospects if we were out of it?

 

Wheres your faith man? Were only 16.5 games out in a weak division. We're right where we want to be.

[erik316wttn]

How can someone like Pena be off the market?

 

Wasn't the entire reason we signed him was to flip him at the deadline for prospects if we were out of it?

 

Wheres your faith man? Were only 16.5 games out in a weak division. We're right where we want to be.

 

Faith only leads to pain.

[dew1679666265]

Over in Stark's writings on ESPN, it also notes that the Braves took a run at Marlon Byrd, but the Cubs weren't going to move him.

 

The Braves are getting desperate to acquire a right-handed hitting outfielder, especially with guys like Pence and Beltran off the market. They are loaded with young pitching talent and Mike Minor appears to be the guy they were dangling for Pence. If Frank Wren comes back to the Cubs and offers Minor for Byrd, I really hope Hendry gives it strong consideration.

 

I can't imagine the Braves would even consider dangling Minor for Byrd. Pence is a far more valuable player than Byrd.

[dew1679666265]

If Hendry is serious about not entertaining trade offers for Pena - and I can't truly believe he is - I don't know what to say. Even if he planned on bringing him back, he's going to be a FA anyway. Not trading him does virtually nothing to increase the chances of him being a Cub in 2012.

 

Yeah, not trading Pena makes no sense whatsoever. I'm a little concerned it's a sign they either are currently in doubt as to whether they'll pursue Pujols/Fielder or they've already decided they won't.

[dew1679666265]

I don't see why it would be "extremely difficult" to contend with Pena if money is spent other places to improve the team. I haven't looked it up, but wouldn't think the win share difference between him and Fielder is that great. It seems with his power numbers and OBP he isn't a liability.

 

Fielder has been worth 3.4 WAR so far this year, Pena's been worth 1.0. I'm concerned that Pena's value will deteriorate heading into his age 35 season, while Fielder may well get better entering his age 28 season.

 

We could contend with Pena instead of Fielder, but it'd be more based on getting lucky with regression not kicking in. In order to contend next year we need as many wins as we can get from our offseason additions, so 3-4+ extra wins from Fielder/Pujols would be pretty important.

[Little Slide Rooter]

I don't see why it would be "extremely difficult" to contend with Pena if money is spent other places to improve the team. I haven't looked it up, but wouldn't think the win share difference between him and Fielder is that great. It seems with his power numbers and OBP he isn't a liability.

 

Fielder has been worth 3.4 WAR so far this year, Pena's been worth 1.0. I'm concerned that Pena's value will deteriorate heading into his age 35 season, while Fielder may well get better entering his age 28 season.

 

We could contend with Pena instead of Fielder, but it'd be more based on getting lucky with regression not kicking in. In order to contend next year we need as many wins as we can get from our offseason additions, so 3-4+ extra wins from Fielder/Pujols would be pretty important.

 

If we were to contend with Pena, wed need a lot of things to go right.

 

-CJ Wilson

-Zambrano and Soriano to get back to old form

-Castros power to develop

-'08/'10 Soto

-Brett Jackson to be the real deal

-Aramis to return

 

Thats a lot of ifs. If we dont get Fielder or Pujols, I really dont see it happening. Pena would be a waste of money. If they dont plan on Fielder or Pujols, they may as well go with LaHair.

[dew1679666265]

Pena would be a waste of money. If they dont plan on Fielder or Pujols, they may as well go with LaHair.

 

I wouldn't support going with LaHair either. With Pena there might be a 10% chance to contend (I'm making up numbers here, don't get too hung up on them). It's not a good chance, but there is a chance. With LaHair, who may well put up a 0 WAR or worse, that small chance drops further.

 

Plus, if it's blatantly obvious the Cubs aren't trying to contend, they'll lose even more fans and the ballpark will get even more thin.

[mookie]

Wow. So, Pena is going to be signing with us again next year then, eh? Bye bye big bat dreams.

[KingKongvs.Godzilla]

Not motivated probably means the Pirates wanted the Cubs to pay almost all the salary and still not give back anything of value.

 

+1

 

I'd want a better a good pitcher from the Pirates for Pena, specifically Jeff Locke.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Pena would be a waste of money. If they dont plan on Fielder or Pujols, they may as well go with LaHair.

 

I wouldn't support going with LaHair either. With Pena there might be a 10% chance to contend (I'm making up numbers here, don't get too hung up on them). It's not a good chance, but there is a chance. With LaHair, who may well put up a 0 WAR or worse, that small chance drops further.

 

Plus, if it's blatantly obvious the Cubs aren't trying to contend, they'll lose even more fans and the ballpark will get even more thin.

 

The fans aren't dumb. If they send out a team that looks like this one, they're not going to react well. CJ Wilson would be a good pickup, but I don't think he'd be enough of a difference maker alone. If Pena is back, without a substantial upgrade elsewhere, and I don't know where else they'd have one, I cant imagine contending. I don't see another 100 loss disaster, but another 4th-5th place team. I think the only difference between Pena and LaHair would be a close 4th-5th place with a chance for 3rd if Pujols leaves the Cards vs. a distant 5th place with a chance for 4th if Pujols leaves the Cards.

[dew1679666265]

The fans aren't dumb. If they send out a team that looks like this one, they're not going to react well. CJ Wilson would be a good pickup, but I don't think he'd be enough of a difference maker alone. If Pena is back, without a substantial upgrade elsewhere, and I don't know where else they'd have one, I cant imagine contending. I don't see another 100 loss disaster, but another 4th-5th place team. I think the only difference between Pena and LaHair would be a close 4th-5th place with a chance for 3rd if Pujols leaves the Cards vs. a distant 5th place with a chance for 4th if Pujols leaves the Cards.

 

So they won't turn out to see a better version of this team, but they will turn out to see a team that fields AAAA players? If the Cubs bring Pena back and sign Wilson they probably won't contend but they'll come a lot closer than if they start LaHair at first.

 

The minute possibility that Pena produces another 6 win season is enough to go with him over LaHair.

Edited July 31, 2011 by dew

[Tarver]

Pena would be a waste of money. If they dont plan on Fielder or Pujols, they may as well go with LaHair.

 

I wouldn't support going with LaHair either. With Pena there might be a 10% chance to contend (I'm making up numbers here, don't get too hung up on them). It's not a good chance, but there is a chance. With LaHair, who may well put up a 0 WAR or worse, that small chance drops further.

 

Plus, if it's blatantly obvious the Cubs aren't trying to contend, they'll lose even more fans and the ballpark will get even more thin.

 

The fans aren't dumb. If they send out a team that looks like this one, they're not going to react well. CJ Wilson would be a good pickup, but I don't think he'd be enough of a difference maker alone. If Pena is back, without a substantial upgrade elsewhere, and I don't know where else they'd have one, I cant imagine contending. I don't see another 100 loss disaster, but another 4th-5th place team. I think the only difference between Pena and LaHair would be a close 4th-5th place with a chance for 3rd if Pujols leaves the Cards vs. a distant 5th place with a chance for 4th if Pujols leaves the Cards.

 

They still have a month and a day, but if Hendry stands pat it's an indictment on Ricketts for retaining him. Completely unacceptable.

[Little Slide Rooter]

The fans aren't dumb. If they send out a team that looks like this one, they're not going to react well. CJ Wilson would be a good pickup, but I don't think he'd be enough of a difference maker alone. If Pena is back, without a substantial upgrade elsewhere, and I don't know where else they'd have one, I cant imagine contending. I don't see another 100 loss disaster, but another 4th-5th place team. I think the only difference between Pena and LaHair would be a close 4th-5th place with a chance for 3rd if Pujols leaves the Cards vs. a distant 5th place with a chance for 4th if Pujols leaves the Cards.

 

So they won't turn out to see a better version of this team, but they will turn out to see a team that fields AAAA players? If the Cubs bring Pena back and sign Wilson they probably won't contend but they'll come a lot closer than if they start LaHair at first.

 

The minute possibility that Pena produces another 6 win season is enough to go with him over LaHair.

 

I never said they turn out to see a AAAA team. I dont think they'll turn out to see either. They just need to spend the necessary money so t doesnt come down to that. Were a major market team. They need to go back to acting like it but be smarter this time.

[dew1679666265]

They still have a month and a day, but if Hendry stands pat it's an indictment on Ricketts for retaining him. Completely unacceptable.

 

Pena's the only guy who it's inexplicable that they've not traded. Byrd, Baker, Aramis can help us next year and Reed and Grabow may simply not be drawing any interest. I don't think Hendry not trading Pena is an indictment of Ricketts.

[dew1679666265]

I never said they turn out to see a AAAA team. I dont think they'll turn out to see either. They just need to spend the necessary money so t doesnt come down to that. Were a major market team. They need to go back to acting like it but be smarter this time.

 

Big market teams don't go with LaHair over Pena. Assuming we don't sign Fielder or Pujols in the offseason, you're right that a lot of fans won't turn out either way. However, more will come out to see a team that has Pena over one with LaHair.