Minor League Discussion & Boxes 7-21-11

[Guest]

vitters has a home run and an unintentional walk :shock:

 

rhoderick and peralta were complete disasters. casey coleman was also bad, though it appears he can hit (2-2 with a triple, hitting .545!) marwin gonzalez is 2-2 with a home run.

 

 

The walk is more exciting for him than the home run at this point.

 

I don't know. Vitters' lack of power this season has been disappointing too so I think both the BB and HR very exciting.

[questionmarkgrace]

why is searle just getting back to being a starter? a couple years back he looked like he would be a solid piece.

[toonsterwu]

The lack of starting pitching in this organization is unbelievable. Every day is just a list of complete garbage.

I'll concede a couple of those, but come on.

 

Future 5th starters and middle relievers aren't exciting. The Cubs farm system is like the team in 2008. Solid depth, but no one who will ever be regarded as a top player in baseball. Obviously we just produced Castro, which is great, but even in the early 2000s we had Wood, Prior, and Zambrano who at least had star potential. Right now, nothing super exciting, pitching or hitting wise.

 

Even Brett Jackson, what's his ceiling, a Marlon Byrd type career?

 

The young arms in the lower levels are actually fairly exciting. Sure, attrition up the ladder will move many of those guys off a level of high intrigue, but there are upside arms in the system. The Cubs have also pushed a couple fairly intriguing guys in Nick Struck and Dallas Beeler far too fast. Both those guys have solid mid-rotation potential.

 

The pitching side of the organization is fine. It's not elite, but it's average, with several good high upside pieces (Wells, Peralta, Cruz, Reed (way too early to write him off since he was supposed to be a developmental project), Liria, and a few others), but far away, a few intriguing upper level chips (Struck, McNutt, Beeler at the top), a couple scattered pieces here and there (Rhee has shown enough to get back on the radar, saw Alberto Cabrera fire low-mid 90's with a nasty slider (so I'm not as concerned about his stuff), and some solid bullpen possibilities.

[toonsterwu]

The pitching is very weak, I do agree. There are some high ceiling guys down in Boise and Peoria one can dream of though.

 

I would've preferred if they'd just have left the upper levels thin this year and let guys work their way up the ladder. Struck should've, at best, been in AA this year, and Beeler, I would've preferred him to go to A+.

[toonsterwu]

Home run for Logan Watkins. Not much else to get excited about on the farm tonight. Good night for Vitters and Marwin Gonzalez too, I guess.

 

He's on such a tear that it's somewhat ridiculous. Also hearing that his glove is actually playing fairly well at short. Not really a bet to stay there long run, yet, but if any of this power surge is legitimate, he would be an intriguing 2nd base option.

[toonsterwu]

The pitching is very weak, I do agree. There are some high ceiling guys down in Boise and Peoria one can dream of though.

 

The Cubs didn't seem to get much pitching in the draft, either. After Maples and Jacquez, there are maybe a handful of guys who are kind of interesting, but seemingly no one with those kinds of ceilings.

 

Injuries have saapped pitching depth this year, too. Losing Whitenack to TJS hurt. McNutt's blister problem has been disconcerting, although he could finish the season strong. Simpson still doesn't seem to be fully recovered from mono, plus there have been whispers about his shoulder.

 

that is why I didnt understand the cubs picking Baez when we could have gotten someone like Jungmann who will most likely move quickly for the Brewers. This I believe will turn out to be a big mistake. When you dont have pitching at the higher levels it makes no sense not to draft college pitching especially when good ones are available. I get that the draft is not an exact science and that the cubs decided to target overslot highschool guys. But jesus did we really need to draft 3 catchers in the first 16 picks in comparison to 4 pitchers?

 

I didn't want Jungmann personally, but I think with the first pick, you have to draft the best guy on your board, and not necessarily the guy that moves the fastest. If those two aspects come together, then awesome.

 

That said, the pitching depth in the upper levels should stabilize a bit next year as the shakeups of this past season settles down. It's possible, if not likely, that we'll see McNutt and Beeler in AA next year. Rhee's down enough to draw intrigue again, and you fit in a lefty like a Rosscup in there, and that's a fairly solid AA rotation. AAA will likely have some arms of intrigue in Jay Jackson (saw the velo in the 90's a couple outings back, so still think he could make the shift to the pen - my hypothesis on his last 2 years has always been that he focused so much on improving his control that he lost the touch on his breaking ball and I wonder if a shift to the pen will help), Alberto Cabrera (stuff looks to be there, can he tighten up his control, as he did in his 2nd go around of AA), perhaps Nick Struck (I wouldn't mind if new management shifted him back to AA). Guys like Casey Coleman, Andrew Cashner could be in the upper levels, and much as they aren't exciting, Rusin/Raley are fine for upper level starters that might fill stopgap/end of the rotation type roles.

 

At least, entering 2012, I think the pitching situation throughout the system will look a bit better, with only one spot looking somewhat concerning right now (Daytona - unless some of the raw arms jump up, the current Peoria crew and the current Daytona crew that might stick in A+ again don't really excite unless guys step up in a big way).

[toonsterwu]

I think the thing that needs to be remembered about Austin Reed is that he was supposed to take some time in that there were mechanical issues to tweak and his body was going to physically mature.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Home run for Logan Watkins. Not much else to get excited about on the farm tonight. Good night for Vitters and Marwin Gonzalez too, I guess.

 

He's on such a tear that it's somewhat ridiculous. Also hearing that his glove is actually playing fairly well at short. Not really a bet to stay there long run, yet, but if any of this power surge is legitimate, he would be an intriguing 2nd base option.

 

But as good as hes been lately, my perception is that hes more Darwin Barney than anything.

[Guest]

But as good as hes been lately, my perception is that hes more Darwin Barney than anything.

 

It might be helpful to double check the players involved when you're making these comparisons. Watkins is younger, a HS draftee v. Barney's back to back CWS titles, he walks more, and he's hitting for more power this year.

[biittner77]

What's the deal with Marwin Gonzalez? I see that he's a switch hitter but it looks like he's much better from the right side. How's his defense?

[Little Slide Rooter]

But as good as hes been lately, my perception is that hes more Darwin Barney than anything.

 

It might be helpful to double check the players involved when you're making these comparisons. Watkins is younger, a HS draftee v. Barney's back to back CWS titles, he walks more, and he's hitting for more power this year.

 

What would you project his ceiling as? I know there have been high hopes attached to him since the get go.

[KingCubsFan]

vitters has a home run and an unintentional walk :shock:

 

rhoderick and peralta were complete disasters. casey coleman was also bad, though it appears he can hit (2-2 with a triple, hitting .545!) marwin gonzalez is 2-2 with a home run.

 

 

The walk is more exciting for him than the home run at this point.

At this point, he'll probably never walk enough, so he better start hitting for some legit power.

[toonsterwu]

Home run for Logan Watkins. Not much else to get excited about on the farm tonight. Good night for Vitters and Marwin Gonzalez too, I guess.

 

He's on such a tear that it's somewhat ridiculous. Also hearing that his glove is actually playing fairly well at short. Not really a bet to stay there long run, yet, but if any of this power surge is legitimate, he would be an intriguing 2nd base option.

 

But as good as hes been lately, my perception is that hes more Darwin Barney than anything.

 

Comes down to how much of this power development is legitimate. He'll probably never be as good as Barney as a defensive player. It's still more likely, if not probable, that Watkins most likely scenario is as a IF/OF utility player, if he even makes it up, but I think he has a little better starting upside than someone like Barney (at 2nd base). Others have noted before that Watkins bat always showed well in practice, but it never translated to game power, so let's see if this is the start of something.

[toonsterwu]

What's the deal with Marwin Gonzalez? I see that he's a switch hitter but it looks like he's much better from the right side. How's his defense?

 

I haven't heard enough on his defense at short this year to feel confident to make a specific statement, but it seems ... improved and decent. He's always been a toolsy kid who was looking for a position. The Cubs pushed him (he's awful young), and gave him enough AB's in the lower levels, so I'm taking a wait and see on his bat this year, but overall, he probably fits best as a versatile IF/OF utility type player if he gets a crack in the bigs.

[mul21]

Home run for Logan Watkins. Not much else to get excited about on the farm tonight. Good night for Vitters and Marwin Gonzalez too, I guess.

 

He's on such a tear that it's somewhat ridiculous. Also hearing that his glove is actually playing fairly well at short. Not really a bet to stay there long run, yet, but if any of this power surge is legitimate, he would be an intriguing 2nd base option.

 

But as good as hes been lately, my perception is that hes more Darwin Barney than anything.

 

Comes down to how much of this power development is legitimate. He'll probably never be as good as Barney as a defensive player. It's still more likely, if not probable, that Watkins most likely scenario is as a IF/OF utility player, if he even makes it up, but I think he has a little better starting upside than someone like Barney (at 2nd base). Others have noted before that Watkins bat always showed well in practice, but it never translated to game power, so let's see if this is the start of something.

 

So, Todd Walker-ish ceiling then?

[toonsterwu]

eh, probably a bit different from Todd. I can't think of a great comp (ceiling-wise), but he's more athletic than Todd, but I'll be surprised if he ever shows Todd's level of pop. It's easy to forget that Todd had a healthy .15 ish ISOP for his career. I just don't view Logan's power ceiling like that, but who knows. I was going to say a more athletic Fontenot, but didn't realize Fontenot actually had a very healthy ISOP (.143) for his career so far.

 

Not the best comp, as I think he may have a slightly better approach from what I recall, but perhaps Mike Lansing-ish is a reasonable comp (granted, I guess that isn't a ceiling comp, but Walker/Fontenot's power seems more than I could even imagine for Watkins, but again, who knows).

[Rob]

eh, probably a bit different from Todd. I can't think of a great comp (ceiling-wise), but he's more athletic than Todd, but I'll be surprised if he ever shows Todd's level of pop. It's easy to forget that Todd had a healthy .15 ish ISOP for his career. I just don't view Logan's power ceiling like that, but who knows. I was going to say a more athletic Fontenot, but didn't realize Fontenot actually had a very healthy ISOP (.143) for his career so far.

 

Not the best comp, as I think he may have a slightly better approach from what I recall, but perhaps Mike Lansing-ish is a reasonable comp (granted, I guess that isn't a ceiling comp, but Walker/Fontenot's power seems more than I could even imagine for Watkins, but again, who knows).

 

I keep seeing visions of Eric Patterson, sadly.