Silva being scouted by other teams

[davell]

http://sports.espn.go.com/chicago/mlb/news/story?id=6210931

 

No idea why Levine keeps harping on 12 mill(here and in his chats too) since the Cubs are only on the hook for 6 mill, plus a 2 mill buyout. If it's at all possible to trade him for even HALF of what we owe him being picked up with us getting zilch in return, I hope we jump all over it.

[CUBZ99]

http://sports.espn.go.com/chicago/mlb/news/story?id=6210931

 

No idea why Levine keeps harping on 12 mill(here and in his chats too) since the Cubs are only on the hook for 6 mill, plus a 2 mill buyout. If it's at all possible to trade him for even HALF of what we owe him being picked up with us getting zilch in return, I hope we jump all over it.

 

Bruce Levine shouldn't tease us like that.

[erik316wttn]

If you can dump his salary and get anything equal to or greater than an expired coupon, take it.

[Guest]

In a perfect world, Silva is a great guy to mop up innings and take a few starts to make sure Cashner's workload isn't too much this year. However, since I don't make the decisions, and Silva is kind of crazy, we'd probably do well to try and grab the next Ceda/Archer for him.

[davell]

In a perfect world, Silva is a great guy to mop up innings and take a few starts to make sure Cashner's workload isn't too much this year. However, since I don't make the decisions, and Silva is kind of crazy, we'd probably do well to try and grab the next Ceda/Archer for him.

 

 

To me, grabbing a Ceda/Archer IS the perfect world when it comes to Silva. I'd settle for literally nothing in return if it means we have a few mill more to spend at the deadline or for the draft or international free agents. I think Coleman or Russell will be just as useful to us as Silva in the role you mentioned anyway.

[Backtobanks]

http://sports.espn.go.com/chicago/mlb/news/story?id=6210931

 

No idea why Levine keeps harping on 12 mill(here and in his chats too) since the Cubs are only on the hook for 6 mill, plus a 2 mill buyout. If it's at all possible to trade him for even HALF of what we owe him being picked up with us getting zilch in return, I hope we jump all over it.

 

Also, it bothers me that writers keep mentioning all of these candidates for the #4 and #5 rotation spots. It seems to me that Wells has always been a lock for the rotation.

[Post Count Padder]

If the Nationals wanna keep dealing us intriguing prospects for our overstock, that's fine. I know the Yankees still aren't too sure about the back of their rotation, but I don't know that they'd think Silva is an upgrade over Freddy Garcia and Sergio Mitre.

[Backtobanks]

If the Nationals wanna keep dealing us intriguing prospects for our overstock, that's fine. I know the Yankees still aren't too sure about the back of their rotation, but I don't know that they'd think Silva is an upgrade over Freddy Garcia and Sergio Mitre.

 

You're the only one on NSBB that would hold out for an "intriguing" prospect for Silva. Most of us would be happy if we don't have to send the other team an "intriguing" prospect to take Silva. :yahoo:

[Post Count Padder]

If the Nationals wanna keep dealing us intriguing prospects for our overstock, that's fine. I know the Yankees still aren't too sure about the back of their rotation, but I don't know that they'd think Silva is an upgrade over Freddy Garcia and Sergio Mitre.

 

You're the only one on NSBB that would hold out for an "intriguing" prospect for Silva. Most of us would be happy if we don't have to send the other team an "intriguing" prospect to take Silva. :yahoo:

I was referring to what we got back for Gorzelanny and that it's not too farfetched that they might send an "intriguing" prospect back. I'd trade him for a broken bat or used jock strap.

[dew1679666265]

Also, it bothers me that writers keep mentioning all of these candidates for the #4 and #5 rotation spots. It seems to me that Wells has always been a lock for the rotation.

 

Most people are way down on Wells, it seems. Shouldn't be, but they are.

[Backtobanks]

Also, it bothers me that writers keep mentioning all of these candidates for the #4 and #5 rotation spots. It seems to me that Wells has always been a lock for the rotation.

 

Most people are way down on Wells, it seems. Shouldn't be, but they are.

 

He's had a great spring, so maybe that will change.

[davell]

Also, it bothers me that writers keep mentioning all of these candidates for the #4 and #5 rotation spots. It seems to me that Wells has always been a lock for the rotation.

 

Most people are way down on Wells, it seems. Shouldn't be, but they are.

 

My guess as to WHY the Cubs seem to be down on Wells is this: They probably look at him as a solid enough 4-5 guy. But, after his stats for his 1st two major league seasons, he may be classified as MORE than that, especially if he has a solid 3rd season as well. My guess is the Cubs concern is he's likely to be making 3-4 mill as a first year arb guy with salaries going upwards from there and if they DO view him as a 4-5 guy, it's just too much to pay for that, if they feel Coleman or someone else can basically do the same thing for a lot less.

 

 

In other words, this may be one of the cases to the Cubs that stats don't tell the whole story as to why the Cubs must think the way they do on him. Not to mention the fact, that evidently he doesn't appear to have much trade value around the league, which seems odd considering that he's had 2 very solid seasons under his belt.(read that a couple of times over the offseason). Maybe the Cubs and most teams throughout the league look at him as a fluke, rightly or wrongly?

 

Don't get me wrong, I feel very confident that he's going to be our 4th starter and I feel like he'll have an OK season for us too.

[Illini Iceman]

In a perfect world, Silva is a great guy to mop up innings and take a few starts to make sure Cashner's workload isn't too much this year. However, since I don't make the decisions, and Silva is kind of crazy, we'd probably do well to try and grab the next Ceda/Archer for him.

 

Yeah, I don't see Silva reacting well to being put in the bullpen so I think all things considered they are better off shipping him somewhere else if he isn't going to make the rotation. Don't really care who they get for him, but if they eat some of the contract they should at least get a decent prospect.

[dew1679666265]

In other words, this may be one of the cases to the Cubs that stats don't tell the whole story as to why the Cubs must think the way they do on him. Not to mention the fact, that evidently he doesn't appear to have much trade value around the league, which seems odd considering that he's had 2 very solid seasons under his belt.(read that a couple of times over the offseason). Maybe the Cubs and most teams throughout the league look at him as a fluke, rightly or wrongly?

 

I agree that Cubs management and general people likely find Wells to be very fluky and I can understand where that thought is coming from - I considered him that after his first year as well. Heck, I wanted to deal Wells for Heath Bell midway through his first season as a major leaguer.

 

The reason he's seen as a fluke is that he's a little old (28 now, 29 sometime this year) to be entering his third MLB season and he had pretty mediocre minor league stats. However, what they're overlooking is that he started his minor league career as a catcher, explaining his older age relative to his experience. He's also now thrown as many quality major league innings as he has mediocre minor league seasons. We have enough of a sample size to say he'll at least be solid at the ML level, while that's a pretty big gamble with a guy like Coleman. Also, because he began as a catcher in the minors, his arm will have less wear on it than a normal 28 year old, meaning he'll likely be productive for longer than most pitchers.

 

Is he a future all-star stud? No, but he's also too good to cast off for anybody short of the elite players in the system (Cashner, JJax, McNutt, etc).

[CUBZ99]

In other words, this may be one of the cases to the Cubs that stats don't tell the whole story as to why the Cubs must think the way they do on him. Not to mention the fact, that evidently he doesn't appear to have much trade value around the league, which seems odd considering that he's had 2 very solid seasons under his belt.(read that a couple of times over the offseason). Maybe the Cubs and most teams throughout the league look at him as a fluke, rightly or wrongly?

 

I agree that Cubs management and general people likely find Wells to be very fluky and I can understand where that thought is coming from - I considered him that after his first year as well. Heck, I wanted to deal Wells for Heath Bell midway through his first season as a major leaguer.

 

The reason he's seen as a fluke is that he's a little old (28 now, 29 sometime this year) to be entering his third MLB season and he had pretty mediocre minor league stats. However, what they're overlooking is that he started his minor league career as a catcher, explaining his older age relative to his experience. He's also now thrown as many quality major league innings as he has mediocre minor league seasons. We have enough of a sample size to say he'll at least be solid at the ML level, while that's a pretty big gamble with a guy like Coleman. Also, because he began as a catcher in the minors, his arm will have less wear on it than a normal 28 year old, meaning he'll likely be productive for longer than most pitchers.

 

Is he a future all-star stud? No, but he's also too good to cast off for anybody short of the elite players in the system (Cashner, JJax, McNutt, etc).

 

It is possible that they knew he needed some motivation and wanted to push him. Regardless, I don't think he was in any real danger of losing a rotation spot.

[biittner77]

Also, it bothers me that writers keep mentioning all of these candidates for the #4 and #5 rotation spots. It seems to me that Wells has always been a lock for the rotation.

 

Most people are way down on Wells, it seems. Shouldn't be, but they are.

 

My guess as to WHY the Cubs seem to be down on Wells is this: They probably look at him as a solid enough 4-5 guy. But, after his stats for his 1st two major league seasons, he may be classified as MORE than that, especially if he has a solid 3rd season as well. My guess is the Cubs concern is he's likely to be making 3-4 mill as a first year arb guy with salaries going upwards from there and if they DO view him as a 4-5 guy, it's just too much to pay for that, if they feel Coleman or someone else can basically do the same thing for a lot less.

 

 

In other words, this may be one of the cases to the Cubs that stats don't tell the whole story as to why the Cubs must think the way they do on him. Not to mention the fact, that evidently he doesn't appear to have much trade value around the league, which seems odd considering that he's had 2 very solid seasons under his belt.(read that a couple of times over the offseason). Maybe the Cubs and most teams throughout the league look at him as a fluke, rightly or wrongly?

 

Don't get me wrong, I feel very confident that he's going to be our 4th starter and I feel like he'll have an OK season for us too.

 

So the Cubs are worried that he'll be too good? If he has a season worthy of a substantial arby raise that would probably up his trade value enough to where they could find a taker.

 

I think the reason they aren't promising him a rotation spot is that they still want to find a way to get a LH starter. It's a dumb reason but that's the way Hendry thinks. Somebody like Russell couldn't hope to be chosen for a roster spot over Cashner (who's much better) and Silva (who's highly paid) but he might hold out hope to be able to beat out Wells.

[davell]

Also, it bothers me that writers keep mentioning all of these candidates for the #4 and #5 rotation spots. It seems to me that Wells has always been a lock for the rotation.

 

Most people are way down on Wells, it seems. Shouldn't be, but they are.

 

My guess as to WHY the Cubs seem to be down on Wells is this: They probably look at him as a solid enough 4-5 guy. But, after his stats for his 1st two major league seasons, he may be classified as MORE than that, especially if he has a solid 3rd season as well. My guess is the Cubs concern is he's likely to be making 3-4 mill as a first year arb guy with salaries going upwards from there and if they DO view him as a 4-5 guy, it's just too much to pay for that, if they feel Coleman or someone else can basically do the same thing for a lot less.

 

 

In other words, this may be one of the cases to the Cubs that stats don't tell the whole story as to why the Cubs must think the way they do on him. Not to mention the fact, that evidently he doesn't appear to have much trade value around the league, which seems odd considering that he's had 2 very solid seasons under his belt.(read that a couple of times over the offseason). Maybe the Cubs and most teams throughout the league look at him as a fluke, rightly or wrongly?

 

Don't get me wrong, I feel very confident that he's going to be our 4th starter and I feel like he'll have an OK season for us too.

 

So the Cubs are worried that he'll be too good? If he has a season worthy of a substantial arby raise that would probably up his trade value enough to where they could find a taker.

 

I think the reason they aren't promising him a rotation spot is that they still want to find a way to get a LH starter. It's a dumb reason but that's the way Hendry thinks. Somebody like Russell couldn't hope to be chosen for a roster spot over Cashner (who's much better) and Silva (who's highly paid) but he might hold out hope to be able to beat out Wells.

 

 

No, it's not that I think that the Cubs think he's going to be too good, it's the opposite. I think it's possible they think he's going to regress actually, but then figure he's still going to cost quite a bit in his 1st year of arb, giving them a tough decision to make as to whether or not to tender him. I bet they did their damndest to try and trade him this offseason personally, to try and put that possible decision in someone else's hands. Granted, it'd just be a 3-4 million dollar decision on him, not exactly the end of the world for the Cubs, but they may think that money could go towards something they feel is a better investment. In the end, I'm just trying to figure out why they, or any other team, evidently doesn't hold him to very much value. You could be right too though, it could be something as simple as handedness when it comes to the Cubs.

 

 

Personally, I think like Dew does and figure he's got lots of innings left on his arm, due to his late start and may even show improvement still. Making him a very solid 4 type guy over the entirety of his arb years.

[Splendid Splinter]

No, it's not that I think that the Cubs think he's going to be too good, it's the opposite. I think it's possible they think he's going to regress actually, but then figure he's still going to cost quite a bit in his 1st year of arb, giving them a tough decision to make as to whether or not to tender him. I bet they did their damndest to try and trade him this offseason personally, to try and put that possible decision in someone else's hands. Granted, it'd just be a 3-4 million dollar decision on him, not exactly the end of the world for the Cubs, but they may think that money could go towards something they feel is a better investment. In the end, I'm just trying to figure out why they, or any other team, evidently doesn't hold him to very much value. You could be right too though, it could be something as simple as handedness when it comes to the Cubs.

 

 

Personally, I think like Dew does and figure he's got lots of innings left on his arm, due to his late start and may even show improvement still. Making him a very solid 4 type guy over the entirety of his arb years.

 

 

He's a lot like Theriot's situation IMO... He's good through his first 3 years as it's cheap. Next year, if it's goes to 3-4 mil in his 1st arb, while it's not bad and I would be willing to pay Wells that much. It's going to be his 2nd and 3rd arbs that's going to be a problem. If he gets 3-4 mil next year, then he's probably gonna get like at least 5 mil-ish (lets use Garza for example: 3.35 mil in his 1st arb and 5.95 mil this year) in his 2nd arb and that's probably too much for a guy like him and probably lose most of his trade value by then. I would rather have Coleman/Cashner/JJax/Carpenter instead of paying Wells 5 mil. I kinda wouldn't be surprised if Wells is going to be the guy teams looking at or Cubs shopping him around the trade deadline, just like Theriot was last year (I believe Cubs were shopping him around or teams had interest in him unless I'm just dreaming about that part).

[Backtobanks]

No, it's not that I think that the Cubs think he's going to be too good, it's the opposite. I think it's possible they think he's going to regress actually, but then figure he's still going to cost quite a bit in his 1st year of arb, giving them a tough decision to make as to whether or not to tender him. I bet they did their damndest to try and trade him this offseason personally, to try and put that possible decision in someone else's hands. Granted, it'd just be a 3-4 million dollar decision on him, not exactly the end of the world for the Cubs, but they may think that money could go towards something they feel is a better investment. In the end, I'm just trying to figure out why they, or any other team, evidently doesn't hold him to very much value. You could be right too though, it could be something as simple as handedness when it comes to the Cubs.

 

 

Personally, I think like Dew does and figure he's got lots of innings left on his arm, due to his late start and may even show improvement still. Making him a very solid 4 type guy over the entirety of his arb years.

 

 

He's a lot like Theriot's situation IMO... He's good through his first 3 years as it's cheap. Next year, if it's goes to 3-4 mil in his 1st arb, while it's not bad and I would be willing to pay Wells that much. It's going to be his 2nd and 3rd arbs that's going to be a problem. If he gets 3-4 mil next year, then he's probably gonna get like at least 5 mil-ish (lets use Garza for example: 3.35 mil in his 1st arb and 5.95 mil this year) in his 2nd arb and that's probably too much for a guy like him and probably lose most of his trade value by then. I would rather have Coleman/Cashner/JJax/Carpenter instead of paying Wells 5 mil. I kinda wouldn't be surprised if Wells is going to be the guy teams looking at or Cubs shopping him around the trade deadline, just like Theriot was last year (I believe Cubs were shopping him around or teams had interest in him unless I'm just dreaming about that part).

 

I would think if he continues to pitch pretty well for the next two seasons that $5 million wouldn't be a problem as trade bait. A very solid #4 and possible #3 starter for $5 million is a good deal for most teams.

[Little Slide Rooter]

I really dont see any teams giving up anything in terms of cash or prospects for Silva, and any team scouting him is more likely waiting for the Cubs to cut him toward the end of spring training. Id assume that there are pitching desperate teams doing the same with Oliver Perez.

[dew1679666265]

He's a lot like Theriot's situation IMO... He's good through his first 3 years as it's cheap. Next year, if it's goes to 3-4 mil in his 1st arb, while it's not bad and I would be willing to pay Wells that much. It's going to be his 2nd and 3rd arbs that's going to be a problem. If he gets 3-4 mil next year, then he's probably gonna get like at least 5 mil-ish (lets use Garza for example: 3.35 mil in his 1st arb and 5.95 mil this year) in his 2nd arb and that's probably too much for a guy like him and probably lose most of his trade value by then. I would rather have Coleman/Cashner/JJax/Carpenter instead of paying Wells 5 mil. I kinda wouldn't be surprised if Wells is going to be the guy teams looking at or Cubs shopping him around the trade deadline, just like Theriot was last year (I believe Cubs were shopping him around or teams had interest in him unless I'm just dreaming about that part).

 

If Wells continues to post 4.24 and 4.09 range xFIPs, then he'll be well worth $5 mil a year. For what WAR is worth with pitchers, Wells has been a 3.1 and 3.3 WAR pitcher the past two seasons - he's worth $5 mil a year.

 

Theriot's problem is that he provided extremely minimal value, so when his salary bumped up at all, he became overpaid. Theriot was over a 3 WAR only once in his career and had a slightly better than 1.0 WAR in two seasons (with a 2.3 WAR the fourth and 0.0 last year).

[erik316wttn]

What troubles me is that Marshall is criminally undervalued by this team and ought to be a lock for the back end of the rotation.

[Little Slide Rooter]

What troubles me is that Marshall is criminally undervalued by this team and ought to be a lock for the back end of the rotation.

 

Marshalls quite valuable as a 7th-8th inning reliever. Last year, he came up big when the likes of Grabow, Caridad, and Samardzia were being tried at the set up role and failing miserably. Considering the fact that teams have been shelling out 2-3 year deals to 7th-8th inning guys this offseason, Marshalls home will likely be in the pen as long as hes a Cub, especially with Cashner, Jackson, Carpenter, and Coleman all lined up in front of him for a rotation spot. We have some solid rotation depth in the minors, but as for relievers, not so much.

[Guest]

What troubles me is that Marshall is criminally undervalued by this team and ought to be a lock for the back end of the rotation.

 

Marshall is 27 and had trouble staying healthy as a starter, his career high in IP is 146. Even if everything worked out great as a starter, his upside isn't big enough to make it worth taking him out of the bullpen and risk injury and ineffectiveness again. Marshall was a top 10 reliever in the game last year. Randy Wells can't do that, but he can do what Marshall would have done in the rotation.

[shnsajax]

I have a really tough time breaking up Marshall and Marmol when Marshall is not going to significantly outproduce whoever our #5 starter is. He is a top 5 setup man in the league.