Tracking 2010 payroll

[Rob]

If somebody wants to get a start on the 2010 thread....

 

We have the following players under contract for the 2010 season (Signing bonuses prorated):

 

Alfonso Soriano - $19,000,000

Carlos Zambrano - $18,875,000

Aramis Ramirez - $16,750,000

Kosuke Fukudome - $14,000,000

Ryan Demptster - $13,500,000

Derrek Lee - $13,000,000

Ted Lilly - $13,000,000

Milton Bradley - $10,333,333

Jeff Samardzija - $2,000,000

 

Subtotal - $120,458,333

 

We are also on the hook for Luis Vizcaino's $500,000 buyout for 2010 and $1,000,000 of Aaron Miles contract.

 

Total - $121,958,333

 

 

Edited to reflect the Aaron Miles trade. Still waiting on contract details for Grabow.

Edited December 4, 2009 by Rob

[Derwood]

my god

[Wrigley Rat]

Should we now track the 2010 payroll?

[TruffleShuffle]

123 million for 10 players? sounds good.

[treebird]

123 million for 10 players? sounds good.

 

if we spent that much money, they must all be great players, though, right?

[Outshined_One]

Might as well make a new one.

[Wheelimus]

Has anyone not looked at that list and that price tag and had "expletive" be the first thought in their head?

[Neuby]

By some form we keep Bradley, how much is Hendry looking at in terms of spending money for this offseason assuming his budget is $145.

[Rob]

By some form we keep Bradley, how much is Hendry looking at in terms of spending money for this offseason assuming his budget is $145.

 

Not much.

 

Even if you assume Grabow's deal is backloaded (let's say 3 mil this year and 4.5 next), we'd still need to fill fourteen roster spots on top of what we've got now. That's 5.6 mil if everybody was making league minimum, which they aren't. And if I'm not mistaken, we probably have a few guys getting ready to be arb-eligible.

[17 Seconds]

in other words, this offseason is not going to be fun.

[Rob]

Miles trade edited in. Still waiting on contract details for Grabow.

[CubsWin]

I'm not sure what the signing bonuses of Grabow and Byrd are, if any, but here is what we have so far to the best of my ability...

 

Alfonso Soriano - $19,000,000

Carlos Zambrano - $18,875,000

Aramis Ramirez - $16,750,000

Kosuke Fukudome - $14,000,000

Ryan Demptster - $13,500,000

Derrek Lee - $13,000,000

Ted Lilly - $13,000,000

Carlos Silva - $11,500,000 (according to SeattleTimes.com)

John Grabow - $3,750,000

Marlon Byrd - $3,000,000

Jeff Samardzija - $1,000,000 (according to Cot's)

 

Subtotal - $127,375,000

 

Then as rob accurately pointed out, there's Luis Vizcaino's $500,000 buyout for 2010 and $1,000,000 for Aaron Miles. But the Cubs received 9 million from the Mariners in the Bradley trade, 5.5 million of which is applied to 2010.

 

Total - $123,375,000

 

That's for 11 players. If reports are true that the Ricketts family has set the payroll at $140 million, that leaves around 16 million for 14 players including Carlos Marmol, Geovany Soto, Sean Marshall, Ryan Theriot, Tom Gorzellany, Jeff Baker, Angel Guzman, Mike Fontenot and Koyie Hill.

 

Does anyone have solid estimates on what those nine are likely to make? And is there any way possible that the Cubs would have enough left over to entice Orlando Hudson to sign without going over $140 million?

[JeffH]

Jeff Samardzija - $1,000,000 (according to Cot's)

 

I believe that link is wrong and Samardzija will be paid $2.5 for this coming season.

 

If reports are true that the Ricketts family has set the payroll at $140 million, that leaves around 16 million for 14 players including Carlos Marmol, Geovany Soto, Sean Marshall, Ryan Theriot, Tom Gorzellany, Jeff Baker, Angel Guzman, Mike Fontenot and Koyie Hill.

 

Does anyone have solid estimates on what those nine are likely to make? And is there any way possible that the Cubs would have enough left over to entice Orlando Hudson to sign without going over $140 million?

 

Arizona Phil has allotted $10 total for the eight arb eligibles in his payroll analysis. And Soto will probably get between $0.75 and $1.0.

[CubsWin]

Jeff Samardzija - $1,000,000 (according to Cot's)

 

I believe that link is wrong and Samardzija will be paid $2.5 for this coming season.

 

If reports are true that the Ricketts family has set the payroll at $140 million, that leaves around 16 million for 14 players including Carlos Marmol, Geovany Soto, Sean Marshall, Ryan Theriot, Tom Gorzellany, Jeff Baker, Angel Guzman, Mike Fontenot and Koyie Hill.

 

Does anyone have solid estimates on what those nine are likely to make? And is there any way possible that the Cubs would have enough left over to entice Orlando Hudson to sign without going over $140 million?

 

Arizona Phil has allotted $10 total for the eight arb eligibles in his payroll analysis. And Soto will probably get between $0.75 and $1.0.

Great. Thanks, Jeff.

 

So call it 11 million including Soto. Add that to the 123.375 mill and the Cubs are at 134.375 mill. If Cot's is wrong and the Shark is making 2-2.5 mill, then the total becomes 135.875 mill. Rounding to 136, that leaves 4 million for the remaining 5 players. So it's safe to assume that ownership is going to have to be willing to go over 140 million if the Cubs are going to be able to make a serious play for Orlando Hudson.

[JeffH]

This has been covered in these "Tracking XXXX payroll" threads before, but it doesn't seem necessary to include the prorated portions of a signing bonus in these numbers, unless it's clear that the bonus (or a portion thereof) will be paid in the year in question.

 

It appears as though, in almost every case, the Cubs pay the entirety of the signing bonus upfront in the first year of the contract and tie that payment to a correspondingly lower "salary" in year one of a multi-year deal.

 

It seems likely that team ownership is concerned about the cash flow; that is, how the money is actually paid out, year-by-year. That's probably the number that Hendry and other Cub leadership are referring to when they throw around payroll figures.

[CubsWin]

This has been covered in these "Tracking XXXX payroll" threads before, but it doesn't seem necessary to include the prorated portions of a signing bonus in these numbers, unless it's clear that the bonus (or a portion thereof) will be paid in the year in question.

 

It appears as though, in almost every case, the Cubs pay the entirety of the signing bonus upfront in the first year of the contract and tie that payment to a correspondingly lower "salary" in year one of a multi-year deal.

 

It seems likely that team ownership is concerned about the cash flow; that is, how the money is actually paid out, year-by-year. That's probably the number that Hendry and other Cub leadership are referring to when they throw around payroll figures.

Any way of telling how, if at all, that changes the numbers we've been going on in this thread?

[JeffH]

This has been covered in these "Tracking XXXX payroll" threads before, but it doesn't seem necessary to include the prorated portions of a signing bonus in these numbers, unless it's clear that the bonus (or a portion thereof) will be paid in the year in question.

 

It appears as though, in almost every case, the Cubs pay the entirety of the signing bonus upfront in the first year of the contract and tie that payment to a correspondingly lower "salary" in year one of a multi-year deal.

 

It seems likely that team ownership is concerned about the cash flow; that is, how the money is actually paid out, year-by-year. That's probably the number that Hendry and other Cub leadership are referring to when they throw around payroll figures.

Any way of telling how, if at all, that changes the numbers we've been going on in this thread?

 

I think it knocks a million bucks each off of the following six players: Soriano, Zambrano, Ramirez, Fukudome, Dempster, and Lilly.

[CubsWin]

This has been covered in these "Tracking XXXX payroll" threads before, but it doesn't seem necessary to include the prorated portions of a signing bonus in these numbers, unless it's clear that the bonus (or a portion thereof) will be paid in the year in question.

 

It appears as though, in almost every case, the Cubs pay the entirety of the signing bonus upfront in the first year of the contract and tie that payment to a correspondingly lower "salary" in year one of a multi-year deal.

 

It seems likely that team ownership is concerned about the cash flow; that is, how the money is actually paid out, year-by-year. That's probably the number that Hendry and other Cub leadership are referring to when they throw around payroll figures.

Any way of telling how, if at all, that changes the numbers we've been going on in this thread?

 

I think it knocks a million bucks each off of the following six players: Soriano, Zambrano, Ramirez, Fukudome, Dempster, and Lilly.

Well, if that's the case, then the O-Dog becomes a blip on the Cubs free-agent radar screen.

[JeffH]

Go ahead and update with:

 

Mike Fontenot $1,000,000

Jeff Baker $975,000

Angel Guzman $825,000

Tom Gorzelanny $800,000

Koyie Hill $700,000

[CubsWin]

Cubs.com[/url]"]Theriot and the Cubs are $800,000 apart. Theriot, 30, who made $500,000 last season, his third as the starting shortstop, is seeking $3.4 million while Chicago offered $2.6 million.

 

Marmol, 27, who made $575,000 last year and heads into the 2010 season as the team's closer, is asking for $2.5 million. The Cubs offered him $1.75 million.

 

Marshall, who will be competing for a spot in the rotation or could be a swingman again, asked for $1.175 million while the Cubs offered $800,000.

Okay, if we split the differences in the above offers, (Theriot gets 3 mill, Marmol gets 2.125 mill and Marshall gets a mill), with those 8 players added in, it looks like this (with some questions remaining about exactly what Samardzjia and Silva are making in 2010):

 

Alfonso Soriano - $19,000,000

Carlos Zambrano - $18,875,000

Aramis Ramirez - $16,750,000

Kosuke Fukudome - $14,000,000

Ryan Demptster - $13,500,000

Derrek Lee - $13,000,000

Ted Lilly - $13,000,000

Carlos Silva - $11,500,000 (according to SeattleTimes.com)

John Grabow - $3,750,000

Marlon Byrd - $3,000,000

Ryan Theriot - $3,000,000 (estimated)

Carlos Marmol - $2,125,000 (estimated)

Sean Marshall - $1,000,000 (estimated)

Jeff Samardzija - $1,000,000 (according to Cot's)

Mike Fontenot - $1,000,000

Jeff Baker - $975,000

Angel Guzman - $825,000

Tom Gorzelanny - $800,000

Koyie Hill - $700,000

 

Total - $137,800,000

 

Plus Luis Vizcaino's $500,000 buyout for 2010 and $1,000,000 for Aaron Miles but minus the 5.5 million from the Mariners in the Bradley trade (with 3.5 still to be applied in 2011).

 

Total - $133,800,000

[CubsWin]

When you add non-arbitration eligible players like Soto and Wells to that list and the total is close to $135 million with 4 open roster spots likely to be used for one more pitcher and 3 bench players (one infielder and two outfielders).

 

The Cubs have been rumored to be interested in Xavier Nady and Ben Sheets, two guys I would certainly be interested in them signing for the right price. But if the Ricketts payroll cutoff is solidly at $140 million, they are likely out of the running for Sheets. Anyone hear anything at the Cubs Convention about their ceiling on payroll for 2010?

[JeffH]

When you add non-arbitration eligible players like Soto and Wells to that list and the total is close to $135 million with 4 open roster spots likely to be used for one more pitcher and 3 bench players (one infielder and two outfielders).

 

The Cubs have been rumored to be interested in Xavier Nady and Ben Sheets, two guys I would certainly be interested in them signing for the right price. But if the Ricketts payroll cutoff is solidly at $140 million, they are likely out of the running for Sheets. Anyone hear anything at the Cubs Convention about their ceiling on payroll for 2010?

 

Five open roster spots, actually, since Lilly will be unavailable to start the season.

 

Add one extra pitcher to your calculation, probably one from our stable of kid arms.

[CubsWin]

When you add non-arbitration eligible players like Soto and Wells to that list and the total is close to $135 million with 4 open roster spots likely to be used for one more pitcher and 3 bench players (one infielder and two outfielders).

 

The Cubs have been rumored to be interested in Xavier Nady and Ben Sheets, two guys I would certainly be interested in them signing for the right price. But if the Ricketts payroll cutoff is solidly at $140 million, they are likely out of the running for Sheets. Anyone hear anything at the Cubs Convention about their ceiling on payroll for 2010?

 

Five open roster spots, actually, since Lilly will be unavailable to start the season.

 

Add one extra pitcher to your calculation, probably one from our stable of kid arms.

Right you are. I had forgotten about that.

 

Of course, it could be that both pitchers come from inside the organization, especially if the Cubs are unable to afford Ben Sheets.

[LeftCoastCubFan]

Thank you for putting that all together. There a few minor differences I see.

 

Carlos Silva should be at 12.75 mil, 11.5 in salary plus 1.25 prorated signing bonus.

 

Samardzija should be at 2.5 mil. Cotts doesn’t have contract details but Rotoworld does http://www.rotoworld.com/Content/playerpages/player_previousnews.aspx?sport=mlb&id=4648

 

Vizciano’s buyout would have been paid in 2009 and should not be included in 2010 payroll

 

3 players under Cubs control seem to be locks to make the team. I would guess Soto renewed without a raise at 575k, Wells/Fuld at around 400k

 

That leaves the Cubs with 2 spots on the 25 man roster to fill for a veteran right handed pitcher and a veteran right handed outfielder.

[CubsWin]

Thank you for putting that all together. There a few minor differences I see.

 

Carlos Silva should be at 12.75 mil, 11.5 in salary plus 1.25 prorated signing bonus.

 

Samardzija should be at 2.5 mil. Cotts doesn’t have contract details but Rotoworld does http://www.rotoworld.com/Content/playerpages/player_previousnews.aspx?sport=mlb&id=4648

 

Vizciano’s buyout would have been paid in 2009 and should not be included in 2010 payroll

 

3 players under Cubs control seem to be locks to make the team. I would guess Soto renewed without a raise at 575k, Wells/Fuld at around 400k

 

That leaves the Cubs with 2 spots on the 25 man roster to fill for a veteran right handed pitcher and a veteran right handed outfielder.

You're welcome, LCCF.

 

I was aware of the discrepancies you listed, I just don't know who to believe since one site says one thing and some other site says something else. If you can help clear that up for me, that would be much appreciated. I tend to trust Cot's, but do you have reason to think that Roto is more accurate? I went with the Seattle Times report on Silva just because it was written by what seemed to be a Mariners beat writer and I figured he ought to know. I certainly don't profess to know anything. Just trying to keep track of the numbers as best I can.

 

I already added Soto and Wells in a previous post, but I wouldn't call Fuld a lock just yet. Regardless, for payroll purposes, whoever is filling that last bench spot is likely to be making close to what Fuld is, so six of one, half dozen of the other.