Khalil refuses to sign long-term in SD

[Vanilla Ice]

I would not be at all surprised to see the Cubs trade for Greene....

 

 

 

 

 

 

Then move Theriot to 2B and sit DeRosa.

 

Good 69th post.

 

Eh? Eh?

[nilodnayr]

I posted in the Byrd thread that expanding the trade idea with the Padres to acquire Hairston with Greene would eliminate the need for Byrd. Obviously, the offer would start with Murton and Cedeno. How about adding on Patterson (to back up Edmonds) and Marshall?

 

Still need more, at least Gallagher. I also don't believe the Padres would turn over Greene and replace him with a risky player like Cedeno. Teams who want to contend don't do that.

 

All of this discussion goes back to an old thread in which I suggested a 3-way deal with the Padres and Pirates. Don't remember all the details, but basically it sent Bay and Jack Wilson to the Padres with Greene (and maybe Hairston) coming to the Cubs while Headley, Murton, Cedeno, Gallagher/Marshall went to the Pirates.

 

 

Yeah I mentioned that yesterday (and credited you), I think it was in this thread. You should dig it up because I think its the only way it'll happen. My thoughts are that Jack Wilson is fairly undervalued in the market because of his defense (although Huntington probably realizes that). Greene is a great player but isn't the type of guy for his home stadium. While hes obviously a better hitter than Jack Wilson, Wilson can probably be as effective in Petco because hes not such an extreme fly ball hitter (Wilson is roughly middle of the pack, while Greene is far and away the leader for SS). Also, obviously the Padres want a corner OF and there aren't many better than Bay. In your scenario the padres would have to kick in some decent prospects. IIRC, the Padres don't have a great system, but they'd have to contribute something pretty decent. Greene for Wilson is lopsided, but Headley for Bay is way more lopsided.

 

Huntington hasnt done much with his players and has focused more on his staff. Hes stated that the team underacheived and hes not going to sell low, but I think presented with a fair package for both players (with possibly us having to take Morris off his hands), he'd most definitely consider a rebuild of his system.

 

So, I was thinking about a possible alternative to Bay being moved as quotes from Huntington seem to lead you to believe that he wants to hold onto him to build his value back up. How about a Bay-less 3 way (with BTBs permission, of course)?

 

Padres get: Wilson, Murton, Patterson

Cubs get: Greene and Nady

Pirates get: Cedeno and Hairston

 

Padres get an acceptable replacement for Greene who also provides good defense but has an offense thats better suited for Petco, they get the corner OF upgrade that they want, and a possible option for the future CF hole.

 

Cubs get to move Theriot to the supersub role and replace him with a big defensive and offensive upgrade in Greene. We also get the 4th OF who can play CF to platoon with Pie.

 

Pirates get rid of two of their bigger contracts while replacing them with similar players who will be under their control for longer and at a much cheaper rate.

[Backtobanks]

I posted in the Byrd thread that expanding the trade idea with the Padres to acquire Hairston with Greene would eliminate the need for Byrd. Obviously, the offer would start with Murton and Cedeno. How about adding on Patterson (to back up Edmonds) and Marshall?

 

Still need more, at least Gallagher. I also don't believe the Padres would turn over Greene and replace him with a risky player like Cedeno. Teams who want to contend don't do that.

 

All of this discussion goes back to an old thread in which I suggested a 3-way deal with the Padres and Pirates. Don't remember all the details, but basically it sent Bay and Jack Wilson to the Padres with Greene (and maybe Hairston) coming to the Cubs while Headley, Murton, Cedeno, Gallagher/Marshall went to the Pirates.

 

 

Yeah I mentioned that yesterday (and credited you), I think it was in this thread. You should dig it up because I think its the only way it'll happen. My thoughts are that Jack Wilson is fairly undervalued in the market because of his defense (although Huntington probably realizes that). Greene is a great player but isn't the type of guy for his home stadium. While hes obviously a better hitter than Jack Wilson, Wilson can probably be as effective in Petco because hes not such an extreme fly ball hitter (Wilson is roughly middle of the pack, while Greene is far and away the leader for SS). Also, obviously the Padres want a corner OF and there aren't many better than Bay. In your scenario the padres would have to kick in some decent prospects. IIRC, the Padres don't have a great system, but they'd have to contribute something pretty decent. Greene for Wilson is lopsided, but Headley for Bay is way more lopsided.

 

Huntington hasnt done much with his players and has focused more on his staff. Hes stated that the team underacheived and hes not going to sell low, but I think presented with a fair package for both players (with possibly us having to take Morris off his hands), he'd most definitely consider a rebuild of his system.

 

So, I was thinking about a possible alternative to Bay being moved as quotes from Huntington seem to lead you to believe that he wants to hold onto him to build his value back up. How about a Bay-less 3 way (with BTBs permission, of course)?

 

Padres get: Wilson, Murton, Patterson

Cubs get: Greene and Nady

Pirates get: Cedeno and Hairston

 

Padres get an acceptable replacement for Greene who also provides good defense but has an offense thats better suited for Petco, they get the corner OF upgrade that they want, and a possible option for the future CF hole.

 

Cubs get to move Theriot to the supersub role and replace him with a big defensive and offensive upgrade in Greene. We also get the 4th OF who can play CF to platoon with Pie.

 

Pirates get rid of two of their bigger contracts while replacing them with similar players who will be under their control for longer and at a much cheaper rate.

 

The reason I wanted Hairston is because he could cover all 3 OF positions, while Nady could only cover the corners.

[nilodnayr]

I posted in the Byrd thread that expanding the trade idea with the Padres to acquire Hairston with Greene would eliminate the need for Byrd. Obviously, the offer would start with Murton and Cedeno. How about adding on Patterson (to back up Edmonds) and Marshall?

 

Still need more, at least Gallagher. I also don't believe the Padres would turn over Greene and replace him with a risky player like Cedeno. Teams who want to contend don't do that.

 

All of this discussion goes back to an old thread in which I suggested a 3-way deal with the Padres and Pirates. Don't remember all the details, but basically it sent Bay and Jack Wilson to the Padres with Greene (and maybe Hairston) coming to the Cubs while Headley, Murton, Cedeno, Gallagher/Marshall went to the Pirates.

 

 

Yeah I mentioned that yesterday (and credited you), I think it was in this thread. You should dig it up because I think its the only way it'll happen. My thoughts are that Jack Wilson is fairly undervalued in the market because of his defense (although Huntington probably realizes that). Greene is a great player but isn't the type of guy for his home stadium. While hes obviously a better hitter than Jack Wilson, Wilson can probably be as effective in Petco because hes not such an extreme fly ball hitter (Wilson is roughly middle of the pack, while Greene is far and away the leader for SS). Also, obviously the Padres want a corner OF and there aren't many better than Bay. In your scenario the padres would have to kick in some decent prospects. IIRC, the Padres don't have a great system, but they'd have to contribute something pretty decent. Greene for Wilson is lopsided, but Headley for Bay is way more lopsided.

 

Huntington hasnt done much with his players and has focused more on his staff. Hes stated that the team underacheived and hes not going to sell low, but I think presented with a fair package for both players (with possibly us having to take Morris off his hands), he'd most definitely consider a rebuild of his system.

 

So, I was thinking about a possible alternative to Bay being moved as quotes from Huntington seem to lead you to believe that he wants to hold onto him to build his value back up. How about a Bay-less 3 way (with BTBs permission, of course)?

 

Padres get: Wilson, Murton, Patterson

Cubs get: Greene and Nady

Pirates get: Cedeno and Hairston

 

Padres get an acceptable replacement for Greene who also provides good defense but has an offense thats better suited for Petco, they get the corner OF upgrade that they want, and a possible option for the future CF hole.

 

Cubs get to move Theriot to the supersub role and replace him with a big defensive and offensive upgrade in Greene. We also get the 4th OF who can play CF to platoon with Pie.

 

Pirates get rid of two of their bigger contracts while replacing them with similar players who will be under their control for longer and at a much cheaper rate.

 

The reason I wanted Hairston is because he could cover all 3 OF positions, while Nady could only cover the corners.

 

Nady has 356 innings as a CF, 83 coming in 2007.

Hairston has 9.7 innings as a CF, 5 coming in 2007.

 

Nady is a below average defensive CF for sure, but hes got good amount of experience playing there and Hairston has basically none. So, I was thinking from the Jim Hendry perspective that he'd feel more comfortable going with Nady. Also, it makes the trade more even for all teams.

[BigbadB]

I posted in the Byrd thread that expanding the trade idea with the Padres to acquire Hairston with Greene would eliminate the need for Byrd. Obviously, the offer would start with Murton and Cedeno. How about adding on Patterson (to back up Edmonds) and Marshall?

 

Still need more, at least Gallagher. I also don't believe the Padres would turn over Greene and replace him with a risky player like Cedeno. Teams who want to contend don't do that.

 

All of this discussion goes back to an old thread in which I suggested a 3-way deal with the Padres and Pirates. Don't remember all the details, but basically it sent Bay and Jack Wilson to the Padres with Greene (and maybe Hairston) coming to the Cubs while Headley, Murton, Cedeno, Gallagher/Marshall went to the Pirates.

 

 

Yeah I mentioned that yesterday (and credited you), I think it was in this thread. You should dig it up because I think its the only way it'll happen. My thoughts are that Jack Wilson is fairly undervalued in the market because of his defense (although Huntington probably realizes that). Greene is a great player but isn't the type of guy for his home stadium. While hes obviously a better hitter than Jack Wilson, Wilson can probably be as effective in Petco because hes not such an extreme fly ball hitter (Wilson is roughly middle of the pack, while Greene is far and away the leader for SS). Also, obviously the Padres want a corner OF and there aren't many better than Bay. In your scenario the padres would have to kick in some decent prospects. IIRC, the Padres don't have a great system, but they'd have to contribute something pretty decent. Greene for Wilson is lopsided, but Headley for Bay is way more lopsided.

 

Huntington hasnt done much with his players and has focused more on his staff. Hes stated that the team underacheived and hes not going to sell low, but I think presented with a fair package for both players (with possibly us having to take Morris off his hands), he'd most definitely consider a rebuild of his system.

 

So, I was thinking about a possible alternative to Bay being moved as quotes from Huntington seem to lead you to believe that he wants to hold onto him to build his value back up. How about a Bay-less 3 way (with BTBs permission, of course)?

 

Padres get: Wilson, Murton, Patterson

Cubs get: Greene and Nady

Pirates get: Cedeno and Hairston

 

Padres get an acceptable replacement for Greene who also provides good defense but has an offense thats better suited for Petco, they get the corner OF upgrade that they want, and a possible option for the future CF hole.

 

Cubs get to move Theriot to the supersub role and replace him with a big defensive and offensive upgrade in Greene. We also get the 4th OF who can play CF to platoon with Pie.

 

Pirates get rid of two of their bigger contracts while replacing them with similar players who will be under their control for longer and at a much cheaper rate.

 

Cubs get Nady and Greene and Pittsburgh gets Cedeno and Hairston?

 

Maybe if Littlefield was still the GM, but that would be a horrible move on Pittsburgh's part to trade Nady and Wilson and only get back Cedeno and Hairston.

[Backtobanks]

I posted in the Byrd thread that expanding the trade idea with the Padres to acquire Hairston with Greene would eliminate the need for Byrd. Obviously, the offer would start with Murton and Cedeno. How about adding on Patterson (to back up Edmonds) and Marshall?

 

Still need more, at least Gallagher. I also don't believe the Padres would turn over Greene and replace him with a risky player like Cedeno. Teams who want to contend don't do that.

 

All of this discussion goes back to an old thread in which I suggested a 3-way deal with the Padres and Pirates. Don't remember all the details, but basically it sent Bay and Jack Wilson to the Padres with Greene (and maybe Hairston) coming to the Cubs while Headley, Murton, Cedeno, Gallagher/Marshall went to the Pirates.

 

 

Yeah I mentioned that yesterday (and credited you), I think it was in this thread. You should dig it up because I think its the only way it'll happen. My thoughts are that Jack Wilson is fairly undervalued in the market because of his defense (although Huntington probably realizes that). Greene is a great player but isn't the type of guy for his home stadium. While hes obviously a better hitter than Jack Wilson, Wilson can probably be as effective in Petco because hes not such an extreme fly ball hitter (Wilson is roughly middle of the pack, while Greene is far and away the leader for SS). Also, obviously the Padres want a corner OF and there aren't many better than Bay. In your scenario the padres would have to kick in some decent prospects. IIRC, the Padres don't have a great system, but they'd have to contribute something pretty decent. Greene for Wilson is lopsided, but Headley for Bay is way more lopsided.

 

Huntington hasnt done much with his players and has focused more on his staff. Hes stated that the team underacheived and hes not going to sell low, but I think presented with a fair package for both players (with possibly us having to take Morris off his hands), he'd most definitely consider a rebuild of his system.

 

So, I was thinking about a possible alternative to Bay being moved as quotes from Huntington seem to lead you to believe that he wants to hold onto him to build his value back up. How about a Bay-less 3 way (with BTBs permission, of course)?

 

Padres get: Wilson, Murton, Patterson

Cubs get: Greene and Nady

Pirates get: Cedeno and Hairston

 

Padres get an acceptable replacement for Greene who also provides good defense but has an offense thats better suited for Petco, they get the corner OF upgrade that they want, and a possible option for the future CF hole.

 

Cubs get to move Theriot to the supersub role and replace him with a big defensive and offensive upgrade in Greene. We also get the 4th OF who can play CF to platoon with Pie.

 

Pirates get rid of two of their bigger contracts while replacing them with similar players who will be under their control for longer and at a much cheaper rate.

 

Cubs get Nady and Greene and Pittsburgh gets Cedeno and Hairston?

 

Maybe if Littlefield was still the GM, but that would be a horrible move on Pittsburgh's part to trade Nady and Wilson and only get back Cedeno and Hairston.

 

Throw in Marshall (or someone) to get the deal done. It would solve the SS problem and reserve CF/OF and still leave us with Gallagher. Also, we would still have Marquis and Dempster (along with Gallagher and other prospects) as trade bait.

[nilodnayr]

I posted in the Byrd thread that expanding the trade idea with the Padres to acquire Hairston with Greene would eliminate the need for Byrd. Obviously, the offer would start with Murton and Cedeno. How about adding on Patterson (to back up Edmonds) and Marshall?

 

Still need more, at least Gallagher. I also don't believe the Padres would turn over Greene and replace him with a risky player like Cedeno. Teams who want to contend don't do that.

 

All of this discussion goes back to an old thread in which I suggested a 3-way deal with the Padres and Pirates. Don't remember all the details, but basically it sent Bay and Jack Wilson to the Padres with Greene (and maybe Hairston) coming to the Cubs while Headley, Murton, Cedeno, Gallagher/Marshall went to the Pirates.

 

 

Yeah I mentioned that yesterday (and credited you), I think it was in this thread. You should dig it up because I think its the only way it'll happen. My thoughts are that Jack Wilson is fairly undervalued in the market because of his defense (although Huntington probably realizes that). Greene is a great player but isn't the type of guy for his home stadium. While hes obviously a better hitter than Jack Wilson, Wilson can probably be as effective in Petco because hes not such an extreme fly ball hitter (Wilson is roughly middle of the pack, while Greene is far and away the leader for SS). Also, obviously the Padres want a corner OF and there aren't many better than Bay. In your scenario the padres would have to kick in some decent prospects. IIRC, the Padres don't have a great system, but they'd have to contribute something pretty decent. Greene for Wilson is lopsided, but Headley for Bay is way more lopsided.

 

Huntington hasnt done much with his players and has focused more on his staff. Hes stated that the team underacheived and hes not going to sell low, but I think presented with a fair package for both players (with possibly us having to take Morris off his hands), he'd most definitely consider a rebuild of his system.

 

So, I was thinking about a possible alternative to Bay being moved as quotes from Huntington seem to lead you to believe that he wants to hold onto him to build his value back up. How about a Bay-less 3 way (with BTBs permission, of course)?

 

Padres get: Wilson, Murton, Patterson

Cubs get: Greene and Nady

Pirates get: Cedeno and Hairston

 

Padres get an acceptable replacement for Greene who also provides good defense but has an offense thats better suited for Petco, they get the corner OF upgrade that they want, and a possible option for the future CF hole.

 

Cubs get to move Theriot to the supersub role and replace him with a big defensive and offensive upgrade in Greene. We also get the 4th OF who can play CF to platoon with Pie.

 

Pirates get rid of two of their bigger contracts while replacing them with similar players who will be under their control for longer and at a much cheaper rate.

 

Cubs get Nady and Greene and Pittsburgh gets Cedeno and Hairston?

 

Maybe if Littlefield was still the GM, but that would be a horrible move on Pittsburgh's part to trade Nady and Wilson and only get back Cedeno and Hairston.

 

That would be just about the opposite of a Littlefield move, FYI. Wilson doesn't have much positive value with his contract and if the Pirates hold onto Nady they'll non-tender him next offseason (there was discussion they might this offseason). The lynchpin to the deal would be that Towers and DePo realize that Wilson does have positive value for them due to his defense and that his offense will play better in Petco. Additionally, the SS market is pretty barren and they have no one ready to take over in the farm.

 

Starting with him calling out Castillo last offseason, to being dropped in the order, to being benched, to almost being dealt to the Tigers at the deadline to almost being dealt to the Cards this offseason, its not hard to see the Pirates want to go in a younger, cheaper direction. Maybe I'm overvaluing Cedeno, but hes the type of guy a team like the Pirates should gamble on. I wouldn't mind the cubs throwing a bit more the Pirates way if that makes you happy. I don't think they'd be interested in another starter, but maybe they'd want a reliever.

 

Some Rotoworld quotes.

 

"Still, the Pirates would be better off if Wilson spent the rest of the year (decade?) at the bottom of the lineup"

 

"The Pirates' highest-paid player went 0-for-4, leaving him at .248/.300/.333 for the year. He's just 5-for-41 with RISP. That Wilson is now making his outs from the eighth spot in the lineup, rather than as a No. 2 hitter, means he's not hurting the offense as much as he could be. Still, he needs to be doing some pretty amazing things with the glove to make up for his bat."

 

"Wilson's benching probably won't last much longer, but it seems like the Pirates are souring on him. They might try to trade him next month."

 

""I asked them, 'Tell my why I'm not playing, so I can fix it,' " Wilson said. "I got the answers I needed. It comes down to consistency. The last few weeks haven't been great for me at the plate, and that doesn't help the team." The Pirates have gone with Jose Castillo at short instead of Wilson the past four games. Wilson could be traded if anyone wants his contract."

 

"Any trade is unlikely to happen until after the July 31 non-waiver deadline, mostly because the Pirates surely will be asked to pick up a significant portion of the $14.25 million Wilson is owed after this season."