BOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!! (Barroid 756)

[illiniguy]

I think it is interesting to note when the all century team was voted on Maddux was selected higher than Clemens. Then at age 40 plus Clemens got a whole lot better. Can we see his head shots from the past to now? Edited August 8, 2007 by illiniguy

[illiniguy]

Hank Aaron had over 900 more total bases than Barry

 

Barry's been on base 550 more times in 1400 less PAs.

 

i'll take extra bases over walks

Dusty?

[Fro]

I think it is interesting to note when the all century team was voted on Maddux was selected higher than Clemens. Then at age 40 plus Clemens got a whole lot better. Can we see his head chots from the past to now?

 

Yeah, that's not really natural. I don't think Clemens would still be playing if there was a test for HGH.

[treebird]

Hank Aaron had over 900 more total bases than Barry

 

Barry's been on base 550 more times in 1400 less PAs.

 

i'll take extra bases over walks

 

you're also taking a hell of a lot of outs, which is why you're wrong here.

[illiniguy]

I think it is interesting to note when the all century team was voted on Maddux was selected higher than Clemens. Then at age 40 plus Clemens got a whole lot better. Can we see his head chots from the past to now?

 

Yeah, that's not really natural. I don't think Clemens would still be playing if there was a test for HGH.

But, Clemens is a media darling, thus he gets none of the slack Bonds has.

[Guest]

Hank Aaron had over 900 more total bases than Barry

 

Barry's been on base 550 more times in 1400 less PAs.

 

i'll take extra bases over walks

 

Extra bases and one heck of a lot of outs.

[Derwood]

Hank Aaron had over 900 more total bases than Barry

 

Barry's been on base 550 more times in 1400 less PAs.

 

i'll take extra bases over walks

 

you're also taking a hell of a lot of outs, which is why you're wrong here.

 

i'm talking about a gifted athlete getting to 2nd and 3rd more often rather than a guy with no knees who is slower than cliff floyd walking to first in hopes that ray durham knocks him in

[ConstableRabbit]

Update: President Bush ends up calling Bonds and according to Tony Snow says "You've always been a great hitter and you broke a great record"

 

Very careful choice of words...

[Guest]

Hank Aaron had over 900 more total bases than Barry

 

Barry's been on base 550 more times in 1400 less PAs.

 

i'll take extra bases over walks

 

you're also taking a hell of a lot of outs, which is why you're wrong here.

 

i'm talking about a gifted athlete getting to 2nd and 3rd more often rather than a guy with no knees who is slower than cliff floyd walking to first in hopes that ray durham knocks him in

Barry ran better than Aaron for most of his career.

[Derwood]

Hank Aaron had over 900 more total bases than Barry

 

Barry's been on base 550 more times in 1400 less PAs.

 

i'll take extra bases over walks

 

you're also taking a hell of a lot of outs, which is why you're wrong here.

 

i'm talking about a gifted athlete getting to 2nd and 3rd more often rather than a guy with no knees who is slower than cliff floyd walking to first in hopes that ray durham knocks him in

Barry ran better than Aaron for most of his career.

 

yes, but not in the career OPS skewing 250 walk seasons where people gave up the baserunner because the next leading run producers were Marquis Grissom and Deivi Cruz. Not making outs isn't useful when your team sucks so bad as to not every drive you in

[illiniguy]

Hank Aaron had over 900 more total bases than Barry

 

Barry's been on base 550 more times in 1400 less PAs.

 

i'll take extra bases over walks

 

you're also taking a hell of a lot of outs, which is why you're wrong here.

 

i'm talking about a gifted athlete getting to 2nd and 3rd more often rather than a guy with no knees who is slower than cliff floyd walking to first in hopes that ray durham knocks him in

Barry ran better than Aaron for most of his career.

 

yes, but not in the career OPS skewing 250 walk seasons where people gave up the baserunner because the next leading run producers were Marquis Grissom and Deivi Cruz. Not making outs isn't useful when your team sucks so bad as to not every drive you in

not true. Bill James ran a simulation putting Babe Ruth into a lineup with the worst hitters ever surrounding him. The team scored a significant amount of runs more when they walked Ruth everytime. Face it walks are very valueable no matter who bats around them.

[Guest]

I think it is interesting to note when the all century team was voted on Maddux was selected higher than Clemens. Then at age 40 plus Clemens got a whole lot better. Can we see his head shots from the past to now?

 

No offense to OMC, but I found it amusing that's he's spent the whole thread chastising Barry Bonds for using performance enhancing drugs only to turn around and talk Roger Clemens up quite a bit.

[Cynosure]

I thought cheaters never prosper?

 

Unless I see an asterisk I don't believe that statement.

[OleMissCub]

I think it is interesting to note when the all century team was voted on Maddux was selected higher than Clemens. Then at age 40 plus Clemens got a whole lot better. Can we see his head shots from the past to now?

 

No offense to OMC, but I found it amusing that's he's spent the whole thread chastising Barry Bonds for using performance enhancing drugs only to turn around and talk Roger Clemens up quite a bit.

 

There's a ridiculous amount of circumstantial and supposed physical evidence to suggest Bonds took HGH, etc.

 

Clemens, even though I've personally suspected him of being a juicer, doesn't have that same mountain of evidence against him.

[SouthSideRyan]

Unless you're punishing Bonds for PED use, I don't understand how you put Aaron over him.

 

Aaron slugged 555 in a 395 environment. Bonds slugged 607 in a 409 SLG environment.

[OleMissCub]

Unless you're punishing Bonds for PED use, I don't understand how you put Aaron over him.

 

Aaron slugged 555 in a 395 environment. Bonds slugged 607 in a 409 SLG environment.

 

Is this addressed to me? Because I don't put Aaron over him on my all-time list.

[oldcubsfan]

Hank Aaron had over 900 more total bases than Barry

 

Barry's been on base 550 more times in 1400 less PAs.

 

i'll take extra bases over walks

 

you're also taking a hell of a lot of outs, which is why you're wrong here.

 

i'm talking about a gifted athlete getting to 2nd and 3rd more often rather than a guy with no knees who is slower than cliff floyd walking to first in hopes that ray durham knocks him in

so in other words, you really don't know baseball. Barry Bonds has far better numbers than most people who have ever played the game. Go look up his career numbers.

[Derwood]

Hank Aaron had over 900 more total bases than Barry

 

Barry's been on base 550 more times in 1400 less PAs.

 

i'll take extra bases over walks

 

you're also taking a hell of a lot of outs, which is why you're wrong here.

 

i'm talking about a gifted athlete getting to 2nd and 3rd more often rather than a guy with no knees who is slower than cliff floyd walking to first in hopes that ray durham knocks him in

so in other words, you really don't know baseball. Barry Bonds has far better numbers than most people who have ever played the game. Go look up his career numbers.

 

I'm aware of his numbers. I'm looking at them as we speak. I'm trying to put his numbers in to context. But thanks for generalizing my baseball knowledge.

[Productive Outs]

Joe Sheehan[/url]"]We can’t say with certainty, on August 8, 2007, whether Bonds’ career achievements come with a taint. What we can say is that any taint comes within the context of his time. Call him a cheater? So were many of his peers, if the storyline is to be believed, including the pitchers he faced. Unnatural advantage? I refer you to Jim Bouton’s extensive coverage of amphetamine use two generations ago. Unfair playing field? You probably don’t want to compare him to Babe Ruth, then. Bad guy? Get in a very, very long line.

 

This is my general line of thinking as well when it comes to Bonds.