What could Murton get us in July??

[WrigleyinEngland]

I know , I know, why would i even consider this however..........

 

Not only is he currently proving that without question he is the real deal in LF but he just isn't the kind of player that will stick at this club. Not because he isn't good enough just because the set up of this team is a veteran manager who values experience over talent. I'm not saying this is right just looking ahead to what may take place. If a deal is not in place for D Lee and we are out of it by july what is the value of Lee + Murton in a package?? Would teams throw quality prospects at us?? How would some of those Angels or Diamonbacks prospects look in cubbie blue??

 

I'm not advocating this i just feel we should plan unlike Hendry has seemed to do the last 2 winters.

 

What would be a reasonable deal to ask for if offering Lee + Murton?

[Coach C]

I know , I know, why would i even consider this however..........

 

Not only is he currently proving that without question he is the real deal in LF but he just isn't the kind of player that will stick at this club. Not because he isn't good enough just because the set up of this team is a veteran manager who values experience over talent. I'm not saying this is right just looking ahead to what may take place. If a deal is not in place for D Lee and we are out of it by july what is the value of Lee + Murton in a package?? Would teams throw quality prospects at us?? How would some of those Angels or Diamonbacks prospects look in cubbie blue??

 

I'm not advocating this i just feel we should plan unlike Hendry has seemed to do the last 2 winters.

 

What would be a reasonable deal to ask for if offering Lee + Murton?

 

I don't think the Cubs are planning to move Lee anytime soon, since there were some talks of JH and Lee's agent on a contract extension. I guess that depends on if Lee's contract getting extended.

 

And if Lee is putting up numbers like last year, I doubt Lee is going anywhere.

[Warpticon]

This isn't making any sense to me. At all.

 

First off, the reason for your expecting Murton won't stick with the team is because he's young. So you're saying they'll trade him for...more young players? How does that work? And it's not like he won't be older and more veteran in July. When July comes around and the Cubs are out of it, one of two scenarios will exist:

 

a) He will have done a good job, in which case with the team out of it, it's important to have one of the cornerstones of the future team play, or

b) he will have not done a good job, in which case his trade value will be minimal.

 

And the Cubs are working on an extension for Lee, who is, at worst, their second best hitter. Nothing about this scenario seems likely at all.

[UK1679666180]

I don't think he'd get the Cubs much in return, he's not a toolsy player that found his groove. There's still some debate whether or not he'll hit for decent power as a corner OF'er and that can't evaluated in 85-115 games.

 

Except for being a plus pure hitter, he has avg. tools across the board with an advanced approach at the plate that doesn't get much in return. Especially since the Cubs have no other options in the OF, unless they think Grissom can handle being the starting LF'er, which he isn't capable of doing in a productive manner.

[CuseCubFan69]

I don't think he'd get the Cubs much in return, he's not a toolsy player that found his groove. There's still some debate whether or not he'll hit for decent power as a corner OF'er and that can't evaluated in 85-115 games.

 

Except for being a plus pure hitter, he has avg. tools across the board with an advanced approach at the plate that doesn't get much in return. Especially since the Cubs have no other options in the OF, unless they think Grissom can handle being the starting LF'er, which he isn't capable of doing in a productive manner.

 

How has Grissom been doing so far stat wise/looking this preseason?

[Backtobanks]

I know , I know, why would i even consider this however..........

 

Not only is he currently proving that without question he is the real deal in LF but he just isn't the kind of player that will stick at this club. Not because he isn't good enough just because the set up of this team is a veteran manager who values experience over talent. I'm not saying this is right just looking ahead to what may take place. If a deal is not in place for D Lee and we are out of it by july what is the value of Lee + Murton in a package?? Would teams throw quality prospects at us?? How would some of those Angels or Diamonbacks prospects look in cubbie blue??

 

I'm not advocating this i just feel we should plan unlike Hendry has seemed to do the last 2 winters.

 

What would be a reasonable deal to ask for if offering Lee + Murton?

 

Boy that's the earliest White Flag ever. While we're at it, why don't we see what Ramirez, Prior, and Zambrano would bring us.

[CuseCubFan69]

I know , I know, why would i even consider this however..........

 

Not only is he currently proving that without question he is the real deal in LF but he just isn't the kind of player that will stick at this club. Not because he isn't good enough just because the set up of this team is a veteran manager who values experience over talent. I'm not saying this is right just looking ahead to what may take place. If a deal is not in place for D Lee and we are out of it by july what is the value of Lee + Murton in a package?? Would teams throw quality prospects at us?? How would some of those Angels or Diamonbacks prospects look in cubbie blue??

 

I'm not advocating this i just feel we should plan unlike Hendry has seemed to do the last 2 winters.

 

What would be a reasonable deal to ask for if offering Lee + Murton?

 

Boy that's the earliest White Flag ever. While we're at it, why don't we see what Ramirez, Prior, and Zambrano would bring us.

 

I don't see it as giving up but just asking what Murton might be worth. I could see the Cubs trading Murton and others if they got a Gonzalez from Arizona if they feel they need more power to make a pennant run.

[WrigleyinEngland]

I accept the criticism raised and see what people are saying about why would we trade a young player for more prospects etc however maybe we won't have the same manager next year or GM for that matter. As to the white flag issue this team IMO will not be a middle of the road team, they will either ride there pitching in to the post season or absolutely suck with a lineup that has minimal improvements from last year. There is nothing wrong with planning for the best & worst case scenarios, maybe if this had been done in '04 and '05 we wouldn't of ended up so dissapointed.

I am also not opposed to trading big bats like Lee, Ramirez if the return ie quality SP or established talent makes us a better club. Our team is always lopsided , if we have the pitching we don't have the bats and if the bats are smokin' the bullpen will suck. This year the bullpen will be better and i have hopes for the pitching barring injuries, no one will convince me we are a playoff team with the OF on show.

[NorthsideAvenger]

I accept the criticism raised and see what people are saying about why would we trade a young player for more prospects etc however maybe we won't have the same manager next year or GM for that matter.

 

I can ALMOST guarantee you that Jim Hendry will be back, Baker on the other hand....

 

As to the white flag issue this team IMO will not be a middle of the road team, they will either ride there pitching in to the post season or absolutely suck with a lineup that has minimal improvements from last year.

 

Being a middle of the road team, is SO the Cubs luck. I don't see the Cubs being really good, or really bad. Kinda like last yr, they'll end up in the 78-83 wins catergory. Just enough to think they could make the playoffs, and not selloff, and just bad enough to not make it.

 

There is nothing wrong with planning for the best & worst case scenarios, maybe if this had been done in '04 and '05 we wouldn't of ended up so dissapointed.

 

Agreed, but why should the Cubs moved a 24 yr old player like Murton in your "worst case" scenerio? If Murton was 29-34, I agree moving him, if the Cubs suck, is a good thing, but possibly trading a 24 yr old at the first sign of adversity is not a savvy move.

 

I am also not opposed to trading big bats like Lee, Ramirez if the return ie quality SP or established talent makes us a better club. Our team is always lopsided , if we have the pitching we don't have the bats and if the bats are smokin' the bullpen will suck. This year the bullpen will be better and i have hopes for the pitching barring injuries, no one will convince me we are a playoff team with the OF on show.

 

I not against trading either Lee or Ramirez, (preferrably not both, tho) but ONLY if we get atleast 2 TOP PROSPECTS in all of baseball (for example......Justin Upton and Carlos Quentin TYPE prospects) as part of the deal. If your settling for less then that....that trading either Lee or Ramirez becomes a matter of being stupid.

[goonys evil twin]

If Murton is going to be traded, it's going to be for an impact veteran OF bat, which would only happen if the team was still in the race.

 

Although I don't think it will happen, this would be the type of scenario in which it will happen.

 

Cubs start off the season pretty well, but trail STL by a couple games and do it all on the strength of pitching. Meanwhile, Philly struggles out of the gate and lose the faith of that fickle fan base who no longer come just for the stadium. With a bloated payroll and disappointing results, the team decides to play for the future, trading off either Abreu or Burrell. This would leave the Cubs an opportunity to find the impact middle of the order bat they need, and they would trade Murton and a pitcher for one of those two hitters. You could substitute any other team with expensive OF bats who would be looking to trim payroll, hopefully including Florida.

 

What I can't see happening is the Cubs trading Murton for prospects. It makes no sense on any level. You trade for prospects when you are looking for the future or trimming payroll, and another team is willing to trade prospects for established veterans. That wouldn't be the case here.

[biittner77]

I accept the criticism raised and see what people are saying about why would we trade a young player for more prospects etc however maybe we won't have the same manager next year or GM for that matter.

 

If Hendry feels the need to save his job, he'd probably try to trade Murton and others for an established player as building for the future would only benefit his successor. I would hope MacPhail would have fired him by then after having already been down that road with Ed Lynch.

[TheDude]

I look at the Murton situation a bit differently. I believe he could have solid trade value around July or next offseason, but to what end, I'm not sure.

 

The fact is, with Jones signed for 3 years, and Pierre possibly being re-signed if he proves to be a spark for the team, Pie may be blocked next year.

 

So if Murton opens some eyes and increases his value to a low or mid-market club, then why not at least invesitigate a trade in July or the next offseason to open a spot for Pie in LF?

[Wheelimus]

I think it's very telling that, despite coming off of a down year where you'd think his price-tag would be cheap, the Cubs aren't going to talk to Pierre about a new contract until after the season.

 

What that tells me is, they're still in a wait and see mode as far as their outfield goes. If Matt Murton pans out this season and is a worthy corner outfield, and if Jacque Jones makes a comeback and isn't pointless, I could see the Cubs shifting him to Center Field and putting Pie in right field in 2007.

[goonys evil twin]

What that tells me is, they're still in a wait and see mode as far as their outfield goes. If Matt Murton pans out this season and is a worthy corner outfield, and if Jacque Jones makes a comeback and isn't pointless, I could see the Cubs shifting him to Center Field and putting Pie in right field in 2007.

 

I don't see what the point would be of moving Jones to center and putting Pie in right.

[Wheelimus]

Or, well, I suppose in that scenario Pie plays center, lol. Monday, brain isn't working

[ltb]

The fact is, with Jones signed for 3 years, and Pierre possibly being re-signed if he proves to be a spark for the team, Pie may be blocked next year.

 

I think that if Pie is ready, Pierre is gone. That is, unless the Cubs can find a taker for Mr. Jones' contract.

[ThePenguin11]

At the break, barring any injuries, the Cubs should be looking at Murton+Pie+Hill (or Guzman) for Miguel Cabrera or a reasonable facsimile. Any less than Cabrera, then you can pull Pie out.

 

If come July Murton is hitting .300+, with an OBP of .360, and about 12 or more HR, then I would say we have no reason to trade him. I think the Cubs are actually in a good position right now to deal from minor league depth to acquire what they need at the major league level come July. The big 'if' however, is the old injury 'if'. The bulk of the 25-man needs to be healthy for JH to be able to make major moves with prospects otherwise we'll be playing guys like Hill, Guzman or Pie on the big club's roster.

[Backtobanks]

The original post not only asked what Murton might be worth, but packaged him with Lee. The only possibility of dealing Murton would be for someone like Cabrera or maybe Dunn. We would need someone young enough to play quite a few years, but already established as a solid major league player. I don't think you will ever see the Cubs trade off most of their stars to rebuild because of the market size and budget. This is especially true if the Sox continue their success. The Cubs cannot afford 3-5 years of rebuilding while the Sox are one of the best teams in baseball. Win or lose, I think the Cubs will continue in the manner that they have been----- fine tuning by bringing in (or trading for) one major player and making a few middle-to-small deals to complement the core of the team. I think the core of team will be Lee, Ramirez, Prior, Zambrano, Cedeno, Murton, and Pie. Everybody else will be role players or trade bait.

[katway]

If Murton is playing well, then there really is no reason to trade him for slightly younger, less proven talent. Only a team like Florida would make that kind of move because they don't want to pay the guy when his time arrives. It makes little sense for a big market team.