SLG% question

[rocket]

A lot of people say that a problem with SLG is that it doesn't take walks into account.

 

So why couldn't you just add walks into the equation?

(BB + h + d + 2t +3hr)\(AB + BB)?

 

Wouldn't it give a more accurate description of how many bases a player reaches per plate appearance? Is this stat already used and I don't know about it? Or (more likely), am I missing some obvious flaw in this where it makes the stat practically worthless?

 

Thanks.

[Drew Doughty]

Well, I can't remember, is it TB/AB or TB/PA?

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Well, I can't remember, is it TB/AB or TB/PA?

 

AB

[Fred Hornkohl]

Slugging percent is TB/AB.

[Drew Doughty]

Okay. Why should walks be involved in SLG% anyways?

 

Anyways, if you want to include walks, do BB+TB/PA and that should be pretty good, unless I'm missing something.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Isn't that roughly how OPS came to be?

[MarkPrior]

Isn't that roughly how OPS came to be?

 

Correctomundo!

[USSoccer]

Isn't that roughly how OPS came to be?

 

Correctomundo!

 

Wait, Rocket invented OPS?

[rocket]

Isn't that roughly how OPS came to be?

 

Correctomundo!

 

Wait, Rocket invented OPS?

 

no, i invented something BETTER than ops

[USSoccer]

Isn't that roughly how OPS came to be?

 

Correctomundo!

 

Wait, Rocket invented OPS?

 

no, i invented something BETTER than ops

 

OPS+?

[rocket]

yes, that's what i'll call it.

[USSoccer]

yes, that's what i'll call it.

 

You're the truth, Rocket. The truth.

[bmkhawk]

Isn't that roughly how OPS came to be?

 

No, not at all.

 

For example, last year Derrek Lee's OPS was 1.080. (SLG= 662; OBP=418)

 

His TB+BB/PA = .704.

 

I agree, this should be a relevant statistic.

[MarkPrior]

A lot of people say that a problem with SLG is that it doesn't take walks into account.

 

So why couldn't you just add walks into the equation?

(BB + h + d + 2t +3hr)\(AB + BB)?

 

Wouldn't it give a more accurate description of how many bases a player reaches per plate appearance? Is this stat already used and I don't know about it? Or (more likely), am I missing some obvious flaw in this where it makes the stat practically worthless?

 

Thanks.

 

Why walks aren't included in SLG was the questiion. And OPS is the closest average that does that combining SLG and OBP.

[bmkhawk]

No, I think the question was why aren't walks considered when computing slugging percentage and whether their direct addition into the equation wouldn't create a relevant statistic to consider.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

For what purpose though?

 

Juan Pierre walks 55 times, has 185 singles, 32 doubles, 13 triples, and 3 HR in 700 PA. That's 355 TB in 700 PA or a .507.

 

Aramis walks 36 times, has 125 singles, 35 doubles, 0 triples, and 31 HR in 700 PA. That's 355 TB in 700 PA or a .507.

 

These numbers are all hypothetical, of course, but what exactly does this new statistic tell me about these 2 players?

[Transmogrified Tiger]

For what purpose though?

 

Juan Pierre walks 55 times, has 185 singles, 32 doubles, 13 triples, and 3 HR in 700 PA. That's 355 TB in 700 PA or a .507.

 

Aramis walks 36 times, has 125 singles, 35 doubles, 0 triples, and 31 HR in 700 PA. That's 355 TB in 700 PA or a .507.

 

These numbers are all hypothetical, of course, but what exactly does this new statistic tell me about these 2 players?

 

Exactly, Slugging is undoubtedly flawed as is, and adding walks would improve it's accuracy most likely. Problem is, that improvement would still leave the metric flawed, and it would no longer give you the focused look at power that it does now.

[Guest]

Actually, I don't thnk walks should be included in slugging percentage. The main application SLG is as a quick approximiation for how good a batter is at moving runners along the bases. Walks don't contribute much towards runner advancement, so there isn't much point in including them. If you really want to include them in a measure that includes their effect on runner advancement it's best to use a linear weights measure.

[MarkPrior]

No, I think the question was why aren't walks considered when computing slugging percentage and whether their direct addition into the equation wouldn't create a relevant statistic to consider.

 

I know and that was why my post talked about, the fact that OPS does combine OBP (walks) and SLG.

[MarkPrior]

Actually, I don't thnk walks should be included in slugging percentage. The main application SLG is as a quick approximiation for how good a batter is at moving runners along the bases. Walks don't contribute much towards runner advancement, so there isn't much point in including them. If you really want to include them in a measure that includes their effect on runner advancement it's best to use a linear weights measure.

 

I always took SLG as a fine measure of a players capacity for extra-base hits. There are many ways to advances runners outside of extra base hits.

[Guest]

Actually, I don't thnk walks should be included in slugging percentage. The main application SLG is as a quick approximiation for how good a batter is at moving runners along the bases. Walks don't contribute much towards runner advancement, so there isn't much point in including them. If you really want to include them in a measure that includes their effect on runner advancement it's best to use a linear weights measure.

 

I always took SLG as a fine measure of a players capacity for extra-base hits. There are many ways to advances runners outside of extra base hits.

IsoP is a better measure of a player's ability to gain extra bases. SLG counts singles, so a high-average, low-power player can maintain a decent slugging percentage even when he doesn't get many XBH.

 

I agree that there are many events that advance baserunners, but for quick calculations it's cumbersone to properly weight them all. For simple estimates (which is more or less what OBP/SLG/OPS should be used for) SLG is just fine.

[MarkPrior]

I'll be damned. I guess I was always under the impression SLG was just extra-base hits.

[rocket]

But could it be a relevant statistic for how many bases a player reaches per plate appearance? That's at least how I always interpreted SLG, and I think adding walks would give a better number for that purpose.

[MarkPrior]

But could it be a relevant statistic for how many bases a player reaches per plate appearance? That's at least how I always interpreted SLG, and I think adding walks would give a better number for that purpose.

 

Yea, but including walks kind of takes the effect out of the meaning of slugging, eh? lol

[ConstableRabbit]

Actually, I don't thnk walks should be included in slugging percentage. The main application SLG is as a quick approximiation for how good a batter is at moving runners along the bases. Walks don't contribute much towards runner advancement, so there isn't much point in including them. If you really want to include them in a measure that includes their effect on runner advancement it's best to use a linear weights measure.

 

Yeah.