NorthsideAvenger

And what makies Duncan and Mazzone so special as PC? Mazzone lived off of Smoltz, Maddux, and Glavine for atleast 14 yrs. Outside of those three HOFers, Mazzone was pretty much an average pitching coach. And outside of Carpenter, Duncan hasn't done much in St. Lou. He has had more talented pitchers lost then pitchers he help. I mean Smith, Ankiel, Al. Benes, etc, etc. So again...why are Mazzone and Duncan the end all to all pitching coaches?

And if MLB finds that Boston did not negotiate in "Good faith" with Boras/Mats, then they would allow the 2nd highest bid to negotiate with Mats. Personally, if MLB does find that Boston only made the bid to keep Mats away from NYY(as much as I dislke the Yanks), then baseball should santioned Boston, by banning Boston from bidding on a Japanese import for atleast 3 yrs. Boston has to sign Mats, or prove they bid on him, not out of bitterness towards NYY, but because he was an upgrade over what they got.

You put Zumaya in the rotation? Are ya nuts? His value to the Tigers would diminished, and with Bonderman/Verlander/Miller/Robertson/Rogers already in the rotation and "rumor" to have a rotation, there is no room for Zoom in the rotation. Besides, Zoom has more value to the Tigers at the back end of the staff, not the front end.

Now to get back on topic that was started by vance, I think the solution is simple.........Hill is kept and in the rotation. Here is the guarantee rotation to start 2007: Zambrano Lilly Hill The final two spots will be battled by Guzman/Marshall/Mateo/Marmol/Miller/Prior/Marquis My guess is...Guzman/Marshall/Mateo and Marmol will be the foundation of the Iowa pitching staff, which leaves Miller/Marquis/ and Prior for the final two spot. In Miller, I believe there is a gentleman's handshake that that if there is not a spot in the rotation for Miller, Hendry would trade Wade to a team that has a spot (and Hendry is good at keeping his word). So the final two spots in the rotation will be Marquis and whoever is healthier Miller or Prior. So, IMO, Hill with the way he pitched when he was called up the last time in 2006, all but gurantee a spot in the rotation. It's up to Miller/Prior and Marquis to settle the final two spots in the rotation.

A little pessamistic aren't we? I think he is stating the facts. Lilly + Marquis = 17+ Million. Why not just overpay for Zito with that $$$? Zambrano + Zito is a pretty good 1-2 punch. You don't have to turn your head far to find pessimism on this board. That's fine you say that, all I gotta do is twitch my head to see someone else say Zito will suck at Wrigely since he's such a flyball pitcher. BTW, you are not arguing his case. He said an ace and 4, #5's. Which is absolutely ridiculous. Hill has the potential to be a bonified #2, probably an ace in a couple of years. Miller is already a solid #4 by the way he was already pitching TWO MONTHS ago, while still rehabbing. Lilly is atleast a #4, and Marquis could also be a #4, #3. I'm no stat guru, but I THINK the average for "number 5 pitchers" ERA was probably just above 5.0. Last time I checked Marquis and Lily have carreer ERA's close to 4.5. I know alot of us love to be pessamistic about EVERYTHING cubs. But statements like that are absolutely silly. A #1 and 4 #5's. Please. :roll: The Cards seem to get the breaks when it comes to turning around pitchers, but they've missed, also. I believe Marquis will be a pitcher that simply was not a fit in St. Lou. I hope Marquis comes into ST and with "chip on his shoulder" and wants to prove to St. Lou that he is the pitcher they thought he was when they trade JD Drew for. I expect a great season out of Marquis in 2007. I know some people will laugh at me, go head (wait for the laughing to subside), but I honestly believe Marquis will be a surprise hit for the Cubs.

wolf stansson; As Jericho mention, would you believe Chicago papers on rumors dealing with the Cardinals? For example if the DailyHerald is reporting...the Cards are planning to extend Braden Looperi ( hypothetically speaking) 5 yrs at nearly $11 mill per, would you believe Chicago papers, or St. Louis papers who have them extended 2 yrs at $8 mill? You see where we are getting at? Not saying St. Lou papers aren't legit, but they aren't totally reliable when it comes to rumors about the Cubs. Besides Bruce Miles over at DailyHerald is saying there is a offer on the table that is for 1 yr with an vesting option, which totally blows St. Lou "rumors" out of the water.

I don't buy the STLTODAY.com report that the Cubs are EVEN considering a 3 yr $28 mill deal. That "report" seems so Phil Rogers, is not even funny. Bruce Miles in the Dailyherald is saying the Cubs are considering a 1 yr deal with "vesting options." So, I don't know stltoday.com is getting 3 yrs $28 mill, but I doubt that's true.

I like it, if it is one yr with a vesting option. I know Mazzone and Duncan are two of the better pitching coaches in baseball, but BOTH are known to have some misses with their hits. So, I think the talent is there for Marquis, but can Rothschild fix what Mazzone (who is OVERRATED, btw) and Duncan couldn't? Who knows.

Ouch....BURN Kelso, is that you?

That has to be the most positive sounding post I have ever seen from you about the Cubs! :lol: Ok, people, we need to start an investigation leading into gooney's whereabouts. (CSI themes plays)

Cubs are stacked in the bullpen. They don't need more bullpen arms. I would be very cautious dealing Marshall. Not too many 6'7 left-handers can throw with control. I love how he keeps himself cool and calm under pressure. First: Just because the Cubs are "stacked in the bullpen" doesn't mean the Cubs bullpen is any good. Outside of Howry/Erye/Ohman, the Cubs bullpen is full of ??? and crappy pitchers. So I think the upside of Wagner is greater then that of guys like Novoa/Wuertz, etc. And I like Marshall, but if the Cubs can fill two needs with one stone, then you do it. Marshall may never be anything more then a 4/5 starter in the majors, and those are expendable.

About Church's "attitude", that's nothing a change of scenery can't fixed. I mean if Carl Everett can keep landing a job, or Milton Bradley, keeps landed on his feet, then Church is a walk in the part. I still like to see a Mateo/Marshall for Church/Wagner deal, tho.

Heck, if the Cubs could've kept Josh Hamilton, included him in a deal for Kearns/Church would have been a no-brainer.

I fully expect Wainwright to be a starter for you next year. Not that it is a bad thing. Personally, they need to keep him as a closer. He was nasty as closer. I think Wainwright loses value as a starter.

Don't know if this is been posted already, if it has, I apologize, and delte it: http://www.newsday.com/sports/baseball/ny-spbbnotes075006003dec07,0,2085755.story?coll=ny-sports-headlines Extra bases

Jones for Newhan? Baltimore better be offering either Hayden Penn, Nick Markakis, or Adam Loewen along with Newhan (not that I want Newhan, anyways). But Jones for Newhan, Hendry should have just busted out laughing.

I wonder if the Cubs could possibly get Zach Grienke? :-k

That's a pretty old report. It is because Meche's "heart" has him leaning towards the Cubs. Wasn't there a report that said that Meche would decided by tonight?

Wait...didn't the White Sox trade him to Philadelphia for Jim Thome?

Maybe I am still living off the hype of Gavin Floyd, but I like this deal for the Sox. I think the Phillies are going to regret trading Floyd.

Awww....memories.

(Doing the jerk dance) IN YOUR FACE, sucka............. 8-)

So, some people enjoy Randall Simon watching him and swing at everything, yet somebody like Darlye Ward becomes available for the bench, and people are going....yuck? I don't get it. Ward is a fine signing, and I believe he will make people forget the Cubs had John Mabry (if people have already forgotten). Again this is a fine signing, if true.

Carl Spackler would agree.

LaRouche for Gonzalez? Good move for both teams. Braves get their closer (with a nice set up man in Soriano) and the Pirates get a young first baseman to help protect Jason Bay. But don't look know but...the Pirates have Bay/Castillo/Sanchez/Paulino, and if the Gonzalez for LaRouche deal happens, the Pirates are building a very nice young stable of hitters. Why would Atlanta trade for another pitcher when they have fat man and now Soriano? Why don't you ask the Braves that?