Outshined_One

Well, it doesn't look like he was hurt. But it just depends on whether he is pissed off enough. Or greedy enough. Also, quick show of hands. For those of you who know the minor league systems around baseball, how many of you were surprised that Delmon Young did this and not Elijah Dukes? *Raises hand*

That requires serious bodily injury. Unless the ump had his arm broken or something, I don't think he'll get charged with it. Also, Tree, I am not arguing for a lifetime ban. As I mentioned earlier in this thread, I'm expecting between 50-100 games in terms of a suspension, especially considering the media is picking up on it and also considering Young won't have the MLBPA protecting him.

The game was in Pawtucket. I'm going to go digging for some criminal codes...

For the purposes of assaulting someone, a bat is a deadly weapon. So is your leg by the way. And, as Ricky Manning taught us in California, your shoe can constitute a deadly weapon.

And yes, a bat is considered a deadly weapon. Although, in all fairness, different states can have different definitions of various laws. Some follow the Model Penal Code to the letter, others look to different sources. I know the Florida Criminal Code has provisions in it regarding aggravated assault and battery of sports officials/umpires/refs. Was this played in Pawtucket or Durham?

Depends on said player's past performances. If the guy is historically a second half player, then it'd be harder to judge early in the season. If the guy is a career .300/.380/.450 player and he's hitting .220/.240/.330 and he's putting up those numbers around the All Star Break, then it probably would be time to write him off. However, if he has an established history of being mediocre, then I'd say somewhere around the end of May would be reasonable.

Perhaps. If someone really wanted to go for Delmon's blood they could charge him with aggravated assault, which usually has a max of twenty years. Aggravated assault? He flipped a bat at him! Not only that, but it hit the dude square in a chest protector and he didn't even flinch. The overreaction to this is getting out of hand. There were probably plenty of people saying the same things about lawsuits and permanent bans when Alomar and Everett made their stupid decisions, and we'll probably see something similar here in terms of punishment, and that's fair. He's talking about the potential for it. The umpire would definitely have a case. The law doesn't tend to make special exceptions for sporting events with regards to these kinds of activities (although athletes tend to get preferential treatment, which is another matter altogether). If two guys on the street got into a heated argument, then one of the guys chucked a bat and hit the other guy with it, he could very well be charged with assault with a deadly weapon or aggravated assault. That said, if there are criminal charges, I predict Young ends up getting probation and community service. A lawsuit, however, is another matter altogether. Considering that there is video tape of the incident and that Young is on record as saying that he intended to hit the umpire with the bat, there could be interesting penalties awaiting Mr. Young for his actions.

:-s

Correct, and the same applies in the common definition. I could intend to run 20 miles tomorrow, but I know there's a really, really good chance that I will not reach that mark. However, that still won't stop me from intending to try and do it (and coming up short after about two miles). I could order an extra large pizza, intending to eat the entire thing, even though there's almost no chance I could do it in one sitting. That doesn't stop me from my intentions. I end up eating all but two slices because I'm too full. Again, I'm seeing a disconnect here.

Actually, the law is quite relevant given the fact that contracts basically allow baseball to exist. It's why labor lawyers represent the Player's Association. It's why almost all sports agents have law degrees. I'm sure there's plenty of language in the CBA and various other codes in baseball that has to do with actions like these, accidents, and intent. That's how punishments are decided upon and meted out. Baseball has a legal governing structure; it's reasonable to bring this "jargon" into the equation. you really think they're going to use the legal definition of intent when determining how long to suspend him? and that they'll ignore the common definition of intent? I fail to see how the legal definition and common definition of intent are different. I'd like to see how you separate the two.

Actually, the law is quite relevant given the fact that contracts basically allow baseball to exist. It's why labor lawyers represent the Player's Association. It's why almost all sports agents have law degrees. I'm sure there's plenty of language in the CBA and various other codes in baseball that has to do with actions like these, accidents, and intent. That's how punishments are decided upon and meted out. Baseball has a legal governing structure; it's reasonable to bring this "jargon" into the equation.

Here's something to think about regarding intent. Let's say, for the purposes of argument, that you legally own a firearm. One day, you go out to an empty field, check the nearby area for people, find no one, set up some targets on a fence, and then shoot at the targets with your gun. However, one of your bullets misses the target, goes through the field, and strikes some one in the chest, killing them. You could not see or hear the person from your vantage point and had absolutely no intent of hurting that person. It was an accident. That's one example. Here's another. Instead of going to an empty field, you walk up to some train tracks and wait for a train. When the train is speeding by you, you open fire on it, not intending to hit anyone. However, one of your bullets hits a man and kills him, even though you did not intend for it to happen. All you intended to do was just shoot at the train for the heck of it, maybe because you were bored. Yet, you killed a man because of it. Should you receive the same penalties in the second example as in the first example? Here's another, which is even more extreme. You think you're getting really good at the whole target practice thing and decide to take your act to the mall. You find a large crowd of people and open fire on them, intending to miss all of them. You open fire on these people and kill a man in the process. You never intended to hit him, quite the opposite. The man simply had the bad luck of being in front of one of your bullets. Should you receive the same penalties for this act as the others? Even if Young had no intent of hurting the umpire, oftentimes that won't mean a thing if reckless and potentially dangerous (or even lethal) behavior is involved. A baseball bat is a weapon that could either seriously maim or even kill a person. No matter what you think of his intent, he threw the bat in the umpire's general direction. If he didn't intend to hit the ump, it seemed as if he intended for the bat to get really close to him. Considering that people move quite a bit, the umpire could well have walked or even turned into the bat as it was buzzing by him. Delmon should have known that. If he didn't, he's a petulant fool.

The key difference is that a minor league player doesn't have the PA to protect him. This is true. Typically, they can knock suspensions down by a few games and make seemingly stiff penalties a bit less harsh. Young doesn't have that kind of protection, which means he might have to serve his suspension in full. Does anyone know if his suspension would count for both minor and major league games?

Box Scores Iowa won 2-1 Box Score CF F. Pie 1/3, 2B (5) SS R. Theriot 2/3, BB RF B. Coats 1/4, 2B (3) 3B C. McGehee 1/3, BB 2B M. Fontenot 1/3, BB, R, K, CS (1) 1B B. Sing 1/4, R, 2 RBI, HR (2), K SP JK Ryu 7 scoreless, 3 H, 5/2 K/BB, 11-5 GO-FO RP M. Wuertz 2 Ip, 2 H, 1 R, 0 ER, 2/1 K/BB, 3-1 GO-FO West Tenn won 3-2 Box Score CF C. Walker 0/4, K 2B E. Patterson 1/3, CS (4) LF N. Jackson 2/3, R, 2B (1), K 1B M. Hoffpauir 0/2, BB, R, E (1, fielding) RF L. Montanez 0/3, K 3B S. Moore 1/3, R, 2 RBI, HR (2) C J. Reyes 0/2, BB PH T. Richie 0/1, K SP C. Marmol 7 IP, 5 H, 1 ER, 6/1 K/BB, 7-6 GO-FO RP R. Cherry 1 IP, 1 H, 1 ER, 1/0 K/BB, HR, 2-0 GO-FO RP C. Rapada 1 scoreless, 1 H, 1/1 K/BB, 2-0 GO-FO Daytona lost 3-2 in the 11th Box Score CF S. Fuld 1/5, R, RBI, 3B (1), CS (2) 2B N. Spears 1/4, BB RF R. Harvey 0/5, K C J. Fox 0/5, K, E (3, throw) SP J. Berg 5 IP, 3 H, 1 ER, 5/1 K/BB, 8-2 GO-FO RP M. Phelps 1.1 IP, 3 H, 1 ER, 1/0 K/BB, 0-3 GO-FO Peoria won 8-6 Box Score CF D. Gregg 2/4, BB, 2 R, K, 3 SB (7) LF J. Valdez 1/3, 2 BB, 2 R, RBI, K 1B S. Norwood 1/3, BB, R, K 3B B. Taylor 2/4, 2 R, 2 RBI, HR (2), E (5, fielding) C J. Muyco 0/3, K, E (2, fielding) SS J. Mota 0/4, RBI, E (1, throw) SP T. Blackford 5 IP, 8 H, 4 ER, 1/2 K/BB, 2 HR, 4-9 GO-FO RP M. Billek 2.1 IP, 2 H, 1 R, 0 ER, 1/1 K/BB, 3-3 GO-FO RP E. Campusano 1 hitless, 1 R, 0 ER, 1/1 K/BB, 0-1 GO-FO OVERALL: 3-1

Also toss Hunter Wendelstedt on the list of terrible umpires. Blech. Who are the good umps that have consistent zones and don't actively antagonize players?

The Ron Artest Experience will forever be burned into America's collective sports memory. Between the riot it caused, the sheer number of surreal moments that happened during the incident, and the fact that it completely destroyed the Pacers, there was just so much that came out of it that anything less than a year-long suspension would have seemed soft. This isn't on the same level as that. However, Young did attack an umpire. That is one of the biggest no-nos in ANY sport. Cripes, there are even times when athletes are justified in attacking fans (such as when those idiots in Detroit wandered out onto the court looking for a fight). Unless the umpire is freaking Robert De Niro in The Fan, there is NEVER justification for attacking an umpire. He threw a dangerous object at the umpire. Moreover, he threw it at a fast velocity. He hit the ump. He could have seriously injured the umpire. Anything between a 50-100 game suspension wouldn't surprise me.

Even though he is supposed to be The Next Big Thing, he does play for the D-Rays and is still in the minors. I think MLB will come down hard on him.

Box Scores Iowa lost 3-2 Box Score RF F. Pie 0/5 2B R. Theriot 1/3, BB, R CF B. Coats 2/3, BB, 2B (2) 3B C. McGehee 2/4, RBI 1B B. Sing 0/3, BB, K C G. Soto 0/4, 2 K PH A. Greenberg 0/1, K PH M. Fontenot 0/0, BB SP J. Williams 7 IP, 6 H, 3 ER, 2/0 K/BB, 2 HR, 6-12 GO-FO West Tenn lost 6-4 Box Score CF C. Walker 1/4, BB, R, 2B (5), K, SB (7) 2B E. Patterson 1/5, K RF L. Montanez 2/5, R, 2 RBI, 2B (4), K 1B M. Hoffpauir 1/4, RBI, 2B (5), 2 K LF N. Jackson 1/3, HBP 3B S. Moore 0/3, K, E (3, throw) C J. Reyes 1/4, R, K SS C. Rojas 1/4, E (4, throw) SP JR Mathes 5 IP, 5 H, 3 R, 2 ER (1 inherited), 6/0 K/BB, 6-3 GO-FO RP C. Pignatiello 1 IP, 3 H, 3 ER, 0/0 K/BB, 1-2 GO-FO Daytona lost 8-6 in the 10th Box Score CF S. Fuld 2/5, RBI, K RF R. Harvey 0/5, 2 K DH J. Fox 1/5, R, RBI, HR (5), 2 K, CS (1) 1B M. Craig 3/4, BB, 2 R, RBI, 2B (6), HR (1) SS J. Simokaitis 0/2, BB, K SP M. Weber 5 IP, 6 H, 4 R, 3 ER, 0/0 K/BB, 3 HR, 11-4 GO-FO Peoria won 6-2 Box Score CF D. Gregg 2/5, 2 R, RBI, K, E (2, throw) RF/LF J. Valdez 2/4, RBI, 2B (3), SB (5) 1B R. Norwood 1/4, R, 2 RBI, HR (2) LF A. Garcia 0/4 2B K. Reynolds 1/4 3B B. Taylor 3/4, R, 2B (4), PO C M. Reed 1/4, R, 2 K SP D. Veal 5 IP, 7 H, 2 R, 1 ER, 5/3 K/BB, 2-7 GO-FO OVERALL: 1-3

That was nice to see.

Excellent inning!

That strike three pitch was pretty hilarious.

Did anyone else see Ronny's splits against lefties? Ewwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww.

Ugly pitch to swing at, Slappy.

Was it me or did Willingham duck into it?

Ah yes, I remember when Marshall got the rookie treatment. Come on blue, knock it off already!