UMFan83

This is the kind of stuff that's redundant: of course everyone here at least had reservations ovet the deal. Nobody was happy he got 8 years at his age for that kind of money. The arguments are against the stupid overractions when people act like he's useless or horrible or, like the thread says, "sucks." Does that mean he doesn't have his flaws and he's not frustrating? Of course not...but nobody who wasn't thrilled over his contract was any kind of savant that has been "proved" right. NOBODY liked that deal. I think people would have been able to live with an 8 year deal if he was a legit superstar, instead of mearly a good player. But when a large chunk of his value was due to his speed, and his power was offset by his mediocre OBP, and he had no real position to play those factors made Soriano's signing just awful off the bat. Again, if it was 31 year old Pujols, ARod, M. Ramirez, etc etc it's a different story because if it takes that to get an elite player here so be it.

As I was mentioning in the previous post, look at some of these quotes on the first page or two of the Soriano signing thread from people just hearing about the signing: Here is the thread: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=36777 And that was only page 1. I guess the biggest complaint was about the length of the deal, and rightfully so. But a lot had to do with the fact that no one perceived Soriano has an elite player.

I don't know why people think Soriano is a disapointment. This year year he's been below average but this is exactly the type of play you should have expected when we signed him. First of all, Washington in 2006 was a career year. His HR, OBP, SLG, BB were all career highs. 2006 was the only year in his career where he put up a .900 OPS or better. We weren't getting a elite superstar when we signed him, we were getting a good/very good player with glaring deficiencies. Since then he's put up an .897 OPS in 07, and a .876 OPS in 2008, great but not superstar numbers. This year has kinda been a disappointment, but you also have to remember that he's going on 34 years old. People who grew up i the mid to late 90s don't realize this but you can expect severe performance regression anywhere from 33-37 years old (just making that number up I don't know the exact stats). People don't stay productive until their 40's anymore, except for extremely rare exceptions. His legs are already gone, again that should have been expected, anyoe who liked the Soriano signing because of his speed/power combo was fooling theirselves. They say speed is the first thing to go. Well that ship has sailed. Oh and as for the lazy defense, the staring at singles off the wall...guess what? He's been doing that his whole career. Nothing has changed...Soriano has been the exact player that anyone with half a brain would have expected when we signed him in 2006. Go back to the Soriano signing thread in Transactions, see how many people were less than thrilled immediately after the deal was signed. A lot of people had serious reservations about giving Soriano 8 freaking years, and they were right.

I just heard on NFL Live that the Broncos led the NFL in turnovers in the Red Zone last year. That sounds a big concerning, but I guess that's definitely not all on Cutler, there are a number of factors that lead to turnovers. Also I'd like to see how many were INTs and how many were fumbles lost.

What wasn't random?

I love reading good things about the Bears, but I fear this much fluff. For instance, its nice hearing that Cutler/Olsen is the best thing Mortenson's seen in training camp or whatever was said, but I remember before the 2007 season, Clayton said the most fascinating thing he saw was the Bears offense, and we know how that turned out. Grossman was benched by week 4 and Benson had an awful season as the offense struggled. In my life it seems like every team that I like that has big expectations and hype surrounding it has fallen flat on its face. The Cubs in 04 and 09, the 04 team didn't even make the playoffs, and the 09 team is acting like its not going either. The 07 Bears, coming off a Super Bowl everyone expected more of the same, they finished 7-9. The 07-08 Bulls, coming off a second round playoff performance, many people were picking them as the Eastern Conference's Finals participant that year, and they completely flopped, Skiles was fired in December and the team finished 33-49. So while I'm excited, I'm taking a "see it to believe it" approach to the season as I can't handle being burned again.

I understand some people have this irrational fear/hatred of Hendry, but do you honestly belive that given the limited money available and the circumstances that if he did trade Zambrano his only move would be to then overpay for someone as historically bad as Aaron Miles? The odds of some whiz kid being hired who can make magic with the very limited resources the Cubs will likely be facing this offseason and next season aren't pretty slim to nil. I'm not at all opposed to Hendry being replaced, but I'd rather it be when someone new coming in would actually have something to work with. Well he traded Mark DeRosa and added Aaron Miles, so yes I imagine he could do something pretty foolish again if given the chance. He values crap. Neifi Perez, Jose Macias, Aaron Miles, etc. Anyone willing to go with those guys over your own roster filler needs to be gone. Why is that so hard to accept? I think we might need to accept that due to the current payroll structure of the team and the finite resources we are expected to have we might need to accept that what you see is what you get for awhile. Granted if this team stayed above average healthy instead of below average we would still be up there with the Cardinals. Bad starting pitching early is the biggest reason we are in this slide and I find it hard to believe if we had Z and Lilly in the rotation 3 out of the last 7 games we would still be in this dire situation.

Just think, a exactly a week ago, the Cubs had a chance to win and end the day in first place by a game. Instead, we lost that game and 7 games later we are looking at being 4.5 out. When you go 1-7 and the opponent goes 5-1 that will happen.

it's really funny you say that because the last few years all I hear from cards fans is that the cards never make any moves and despite hendrys shortcoming at least he wants to win.

The Howard home run was the first pitch I saw of todays game. I decided to forego watching the first part of the game and watch Game 2 of the 89 NLCS. After feeling happy about the Cubs I flip to the game and see that it's still 0-0. Then bam back into present day Cub gloom. No more hiding in one of a handful of truely happy Cubs memories. Btw it's really hilarious that they make an 8 game box set of great Cubs games. In it they include: -The first Cubs playoff game in 39 years, a victory in a series that ultimately ends in epic collapse -The Sandberg game (a worthy edition) -A random regular season game in 1987 meant to showcase the first MVP to play on a last place team. -The only playoff victory in a series where we got destroyed in 5 games -Kerry Woods 20k game (another worthy game) -A disgraced slugger cheating his way into a record tying hr, a chase that he would ultimately finish 2nd in, and later 3rd -The 300th victory for a pitcher who is beloved by Cubs fans although he spent more years with another team and will wear that teams hat in the HOF -Finally a random regular season game meant to showcase the great season by Derrek Lee. The game though is more enjoyable to watch because of John Koranka starting it, and Enrique Wilson and Neifi Perez batting 1-2 in the order. Hilarious How many other teams could put together an 8 disc set of worse Memorable Games than that?

Is anyone a member of baseball reference Play Index? The reason I am asking, is that I would like to find out how historically bad Aaron Miles season is. Right now he's on pace for just about 275 PAs and has a .492 OPS. I looked it up, and without being a member, I can only get the top result. I searched from 1970-2007, and found that the lowest OPS during that time frame (having at least 275 PAs) is Rich Morales, who in 1973 had a .438 OPS for the White Sox and Padres. I want to see where .492 would rank among the worst OPS seasons of recent times.

I don't expect everyone to be positive in this thread, but chins up guys. Baseball is a beautiful sport, and if you can't enjoy it because your favorite team is an epic failure, I feel bad for you. There will be cold days in January where you wish you could watch just one baseball game, and as much as you want to, you can't. So watch and enjoy this game, win or lose because some time in the near future, it won't be available to you. What the hell am I talking about? I'm drunk. Cliff Lee pitches for the Phillies. The Cubs got 3 runs in 7 IP off him when he was still on the Indians in June. If you recall, that was the game the Cubs made a big comeback capped off by Lee's HR off Wood in the 9th to tie it, and (I think) a Soriano single to win it. Demp pitches for the Cubs, and he's probably been our best pitcher over the last 2 weeks give or take (Harden has his moments though). This feels like one of those games where the Cubs somehow get a weeks worth of hits with RISPs and everyone feels warm and fuzzy until Kevin Hart or someone shuts down the Cubs the next day. Go Cubs.

I thought Marshall was supposed to get outs va. Lefties. They are 3-3 with 2 HR and a BB

Ron is basically conceding the season on the radio. I'm not but doubt is creeping into my head.

One of the most unqualified players in the major leagues vs. a pitcher with probably the best numbers over his career than any other active pitcher. This should be fun.

Well Marmol has 2 great years under his belt, as opposed to 1 pretty good year for Hill. Even this year is above average when you consider ultimate results. Unless you are referring to complete loss of control, which I'm starting to think you are.

IIRC, the downfall of the 2004 team was not being able to beat bad teams. I remember a very unpleasant series against Montreal in early September of 2004 that pissed me right the [expletive] off. That's so crazy you mention that series. I was just thinking back to that series the other day. I remember Lee blasting a home run in the 1st, then Wood giving up like 8 ER's against the Expos. We ended up losing that series. :banghead: What year was it when we were facing the Mets and they hit 2 grand slams in 2 innings? and then another vs. the Mets when then closer Dempster had something like a 6 or 7 run lead in the 9th and it slipped away like nothing? Bother were between 2004-2006 I want to say that game where the Mets scored like 5 in the 9th was actually 2007. That was one hell of a painful loss, though. We were cruising right along, then couldn't do anything right in the 9th. Santo just about keeled over in the booth. I don't know about the 2 grand slam game, though. I will forever remember the game that LaTroy blew in New York in 2004, though. One of those games where I'll never forget where I was when the season died. After that game I knew we didn't have a chance. The 2 grand slam game was 2006. Sean Marshall started and hit a HR that game.

That about sums it up. They are an extremely mediocre team who takes advantage of the teams below them and gets beat up by the teams above them. Haven't they only won 2 series' against teams with winning records this season? Mediocrity at its finest right there Out of curioisty, how many series have the Phillies won against teams with winning records? No idea cause i'm not a Phillies fan and i could care less to try to look it up right now they have 8 series wins vs. Teams .500 or better.

lol are you really implying that his outing wasn't awful just because he didn't give up any hits? I'm guessing he is being sarcastic.

2 series wins vs. Teams over .500 all season. Yes they split with the Dodgers and had a couple of 2 game splits but that is pathetic.

On the plus side we are going to throw a 3 hitter tonight

He just got a cortizone shot like 3-4 hours ago.

Who else is available? Kosuke is already in, then its Miles, Koyie Hill, Aramis Ramirez (hurt). Am I missing anyone on this horrid bench of ours? Fontenot Ah yes, so a SH with no power, a SH with a marginal level of power, someone who just got a cortizone shot a few hours ago, or a lefty. I would have went with Font. First pitch swinging. God you suck Miles

Who else is available? Kosuke is already in, then its Miles, Koyie Hill, Aramis Ramirez (hurt). Am I missing anyone on this horrid bench of ours?

Marmol was used in the 8th. Marshall could go a couple innings I would think.