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You aren't following. I'm saying they knew of his as a big-time draft prospect. Which you apparently didn't. How can you exaggerate and use the word literally in a sentence. Think about that for a minute. Quinn being No. 1 before the draft proves that pre-work out draft boards are meaningless. Because Russell wasn't on them at some arbitrary point during the season doesn't mean that scouts were sleeping on him and he just skyrocketed out of nowhere.

There is a HUGE difference between Russell and Navarre, to even use him as any sort of comparison to Russell is ridiculous. You're just digging yourself deeper and deeper here. You're right that Russell wasn't a No. 1 guy before the Sugar Bowl. But he was leagues ahead of "literally nowhere".

Is this the first draft you've ever watched? That's the way these things work, that's the way they're supposed to work. The point remains, you said he was "literally nowhere" before his last couple games, and that's completely false. Anyone who follows college football knew who he was and could see his talent when he stepped on the field his freshman year. That kind of arm doesn't go unnoticed. I like how you've changed your point from "completely nowhere" to "not a top-10 pick" by the way. I like how you keep harping on it, even though I explained what I meant. Plenty of QBs have a 10-ton arm, doesn't mean they're the #1 pick. There will be great players drafted on the 2nd day, that's not even the subject of the discussion. Nothing that you just said has anything to do with our discussion at all. He's been a big time prospect for a long time, of course he wasn't the No. 1 pick before the Sugar Bowl, no one was, these things take time to get decided. You're proving complete ignorance here. Define "Big Time Prospect" then. Are you serious? He was a big, strong quarterback with a huge arm that played at a big-time SEC school since his freshman year. He was no one's No. 1 pick at the beginning of the year, but guess who was? Brady Quinn. Draft boards in August mean nothing. Quinn was the top pick in the draft up until the Sugar Bowl. Nobody though he would get past the Raiders at #1 or #2 (since at the time the Raiders and Lions were tied for the worst record). Have you been following the discussion at all? He said that Russell was "literally nowhere" before the sugar bowl. Saying that Quinn was No. 1 then means nothing. You guys need to face facts, people who follow college football and draft prospects have known about Russell for a long time now.

Is this the first draft you've ever watched? That's the way these things work, that's the way they're supposed to work. The point remains, you said he was "literally nowhere" before his last couple games, and that's completely false. Anyone who follows college football knew who he was and could see his talent when he stepped on the field his freshman year. That kind of arm doesn't go unnoticed. I like how you've changed your point from "completely nowhere" to "not a top-10 pick" by the way. I like how you keep harping on it, even though I explained what I meant. Plenty of QBs have a 10-ton arm, doesn't mean they're the #1 pick. There will be great players drafted on the 2nd day, that's not even the subject of the discussion. Nothing that you just said has anything to do with our discussion at all. He's been a big time prospect for a long time, of course he wasn't the No. 1 pick before the Sugar Bowl, no one was, these things take time to get decided. You're proving complete ignorance here. Define "Big Time Prospect" then. Are you serious? He was a big, strong quarterback with a huge arm that played at a big-time SEC school since his freshman year. He was no one's No. 1 pick at the beginning of the year, but guess who was? Brady Quinn. Draft boards in August mean nothing.

Is this the first draft you've ever watched? That's the way these things work, that's the way they're supposed to work. The point remains, you said he was "literally nowhere" before his last couple games, and that's completely false. Anyone who follows college football knew who he was and could see his talent when he stepped on the field his freshman year. That kind of arm doesn't go unnoticed. I like how you've changed your point from "completely nowhere" to "not a top-10 pick" by the way. I like how you keep harping on it, even though I explained what I meant. Plenty of QBs have a 10-ton arm, doesn't mean they're the #1 pick. There will be great players drafted on the 2nd day, that's not even the subject of the discussion. Nothing that you just said has anything to do with our discussion at all. He's been a big time prospect for a long time, of course he wasn't the No. 1 pick before the Sugar Bowl, no one was, these things take time to get decided. You're proving complete ignorance here. EDIT I will say this though, he wasn't in anyone's top-10 until late. But draft boards change so much from bowl season to draft day that that is no shock.

Is this the first draft you've ever watched? That's the way these things work, that's the way they're supposed to work. The point remains, you said he was "literally nowhere" before his last couple games, and that's completely false. Anyone who follows college football knew who he was and could see his talent when he stepped on the field his freshman year. That kind of arm doesn't go unnoticed. I like how you've changed your point from "completely nowhere" to "not a top-10 pick" by the way.

I don't get the Losman thing either. Unless Buffalo is just using him as a placeholder until it can get its hands on a QB it likes. They might just not like Quinn, afterall.

You must not pay much attention to college football, Russell has been on people's radars since his freshman year. Not anywhere near where he went. Not even close to that level. Read what you wrote again, please. You said he was "literally nowhere" until his last couple games, which is completely untrue. I don't even know where you pulled that from, unless you just like playing expert. What you said was completely false. He was nowhere in terms of top 10. If you think he would have gone top 10 without the Sugar Bowl and his workout, you are sorely mistaken. So what? No one goes anywhere without a workout. The point is Russell was a bigtime prospect as long ago as his freshman year, not some nobody that popped up the last couple weeks of the season. You keep changing your point, stick to one please.

How does that even make sense? Some NFL teams higher freaking private investigators to tail potential draftees, no one is going to skip a player because of his first name for god's sakes, this is big business, not a video game.

You must not pay much attention to college football, Russell has been on people's radars since his freshman year. Not anywhere near where he went. Not even close to that level. Read what you wrote again, please. You said he was "literally nowhere" until his last couple games, which is completely untrue. I don't even know where you pulled that from, unless you just like playing expert. What you said was completely false.

He definitely ranks up there behind Leinart dropping to #10 last year. You guys do realize that Marques Colston was drafted last year, right? So what? We're talking about draft value. Colston never had the potential to make $40 million guaranteed like Quinn would have. Whoever picks Quinn now will literally be saving millions on top of millions of dollars. Only if he's as good as you think he is, which apparently NFL teams don't. QB's get paid more at their slots, don't they? A team that picks him at 12 or 13 or whatever is going to pay more money for him than they would for another player at the same spot.

You must not pay much attention to college football, Russell has been on people's radars since his freshman year.

He definitely ranks up there behind Leinart dropping to #10 last year. You guys do realize that Marques Colston was drafted last year, right?

Do you ever say anything that isn't completely stupid? Anyway, I'm glad Brady slipped. Gives me more time to look at that blonde next to him. :shock: :shock: :shock: Do you? That was all you could come up with? Quick, before someone tells us to drop it, edit that post and try again, you're embarrassing yourself. 75% chance Detroit picked CJ for Tampa Bay.

Do you ever say anything that isn't completely stupid? Anyway, I'm glad Brady slipped. Gives me more time to look at that blonde next to him. :shock: :shock: :shock:

Obvious? No. But I can certainly make a case for why he would be below average over the next 3 seasons. My dilemma comes in that I can also make a case that he could be pretty good for a couple of those seasons. If both cases can be made, it can't be an obvious conclusion. His bad year was most recent. But he didn't have bad years (plural) recently. Last season was absolutely terrible. But '05 was above average and '04 was well above average. He is certainly up and down, thats for sure. But the question remains, what stats and logic support the notion that his career worst season of '06 is more the norm and than the exception? I say obvious, as in "it's more likely". Marquis is a guy who, outside of 129 innings in 2001, has been slightly above average once, average once, and decidedly below average three times. I don't know why you say bad "year" like he's had only one, he was awful in 2002 and 2003, too. Out of his last five seasons, three of them have been below average, with his last season being the worst. I think the expectation that his 2006 will be closer to the norm than his slightly above average years is the fact that he's really nothing special, even at his best. He's an average player at best, and he was historically awful last year. To look at Marquis numbers and say "I bet he has a good year" would be ridiculous. To say "I think he can have a good year" is less so, and there's the distinction. Think of it in this context. If ARod were to hit .250/.320/.470 next year, people would say "well, it's still ARod, and he's only 32, he'll be better next season". And of course he would be, he's been an amazing player for over a decade. If Marquis has a season where he has a 6.02 ERA with a 73 ERA+, strikes out just 96 and walks 75, people are going to say "well, it's Jason Marquis, he probably lost it." Then when he signs a 3-year, $21 million dollar deal with the most tortured fan base in sports, what kind of reaction do you expect?

I just saw this little outburst on Sportscenter. What's the backstory? Apparently a St. Louis Post Dispatch writer wrote a "cheap shot", as described by LaRussa, at the Cubs and included some quotes by the St Louis manager. LaRussa didn't sound happy and took the guy to task postgame. LaRussa kind of got in the guys face as he was leaving, and the fat guy stood up and started saying "do we have a problem?" over and over. It was hilarious.

Let's see, National TV, against the Cardinals, Zambrano on the mound. Forecast calls for flat, 99mph first inning fastballs.

I think in Marquis' case, you had some good years, and some bad years. The bad years were more recent, (not to mention, in a trend) so concluding that he be a below average pitcher was the obvious conclusion.

I really have no personal affinity for Sammy, but I am definitely rooting for him this year. I mean, if he even manages a remotely decent season, that would be a pretty remarkable comeback, considering his precipitous decline/year off.

Yeah, you pretty much hit the nail on the head. I'm afraid to even credit Marquis at all, for fear that as soon as I do is when he remembers just who he actually is.

I think with Marquis it was his three-year trends (combined with his ridiculously bad year, combined even further with the big money) that freaked everyone out. He went from a good ERA+, to a decent one, to a terrible one, and appeared completely lost last season. It would have been something to laugh at until we guaranteed him three years in a Cub uniform. That's just a melting pot for disaster. His peripherals were getting progressively worse as well (and they still scare me this year). He's pretty much surpassed even the most ardent optimist's expectations so far, but he has 25+ more starts to go, so I don't think you can blame anyone for being skeptical still.

And then Izturis dropped a line drive hit 2 feet to his right and Cedeno struck out and gave Matt Murton cancer without even leaving the bench. I agree that Theriot is no gold glover, but all things considered, unless he is just flat out god awful defensively (and I'm talking Daryle Ward at shortstop bad), he's probably the best overall option.

I agree about the sleeveless jersey's, it should be nothing short of a visual warning to people pining for a Cubs sleeveless.

What happened? I wish i was watching it in the other room and I would rewind to recap, but he basically said something about the sonics issuing a statement saying they wanted to move to las vegas, and stern responded with a "they never said that." Gray then replied "they actually re-iterated that today" and Stern stumbled a bit and said "well, tomorrow they will be retracting that." Gray then asked him a few more questions before Stern awkwardly called for an end to the interview. I normally hate Jim Gray, but that was just hilarious.