CubinNY

You are making far too much sense for this discussion. uh huh

My guess Marshall, Murton, and Cedeno.... though it could be Marmol, Murton, Cedeno....or Patterson, Marmol Cedeno. I sure hope Marmol isn't in the deal. Marshall, Cedeno, and Murton? And I think it is a bad trade, but Cedeno and Murton are done for with the Cubs so they might as well get someone for them.

Am I thinking of a different Brian Roberts? That's awfully steep. Done without a second thought. I must be thinking of a different Brian Roberts too, because that is one lopsided trade. He's basically Matt Murton playing 2nd. That is basically a ridiculous statement. .281 .351 .409 Roberts .296 .365 .455 Murton Sorry, a tad bit worse than Murton.

Am I thinking of a different Brian Roberts? That's awfully steep. Done without a second thought. I must be thinking of a different Brian Roberts too, because that is one lopsided trade. He's basically Matt Murton playing 2nd.

Getting caught up myself. Listened to our old friend Dusty this morning. Had a lunch session with Lou. Lou then did his media thing. Chased down the Murton-Teahen thing for you guys. :lol: And we'll see Jim at 5:30. So in other words, no. I know it's not the Cubs, but what do you think about the Det. Florida trade? Pretty amazing.

Wow, that's an interesting story. Especially, the "different type of cat" comment. I stand corrected. Even so the Barrett that Hendry got wasn't the established player that he traded away. It was good trade. Thanks Bruce.

You have got to be kidding me? Beane traded garbage for Barrett so he could get Damien Miller to handle his young pitching staff. Stole Barrett, that's a good one. Yes, nobody is a bigger believer in how a catcher "handles pitchers" than Billy Beane. Obviously Miller made a huge impression, considering he let Miller walk after one year. Barrett proceeded to hit .800+ OPS for us for a couple of more years while Miller was "handling pitchers" in Milwaukee. Are you kidding? Seriously, Barrett spent all of two days on the A's roster during the off-season before he was traded to the Cubs. It was almost like a three-way deal. He was then released by the Cubs and resigned at a lower rate than he would have gotten during arbitration. The Cubs didn't have anything the nationals wanted. Beane knew exactly what he was doing and who he was getting. You are obviously trying to play devil's advocate here. Actually, the real story is that Hendry initiated this trade and used Beane as the conduit because Hendry couldn't get a deal done one on one with Minaya, who was the Expos GM at the time. Hendry had tried for two years to get Barrett, to no avail. Did Beane not care who he was getting, or did he want Miller?

You have got to be kidding me? Beane traded garbage for Barrett so he could get Damien Miller to handle his young pitching staff. Stole Barrett, that's a good one. Yes, nobody is a bigger believer in how a catcher "handles pitchers" than Billy Beane. Obviously Miller made a huge impression, considering he let Miller walk after one year. Barrett proceeded to hit .800+ OPS for us for a couple of more years while Miller was "handling pitchers" in Milwaukee. Are you kidding? Seriously, Barrett spent all of two days on the A's roster during the off-season before he was traded to the Cubs. It was almost like a three-way deal. He was then released by the Cubs and resigned at a lower rate than he would have gotten during arbitration. The Cubs didn't have anything the nationals wanted. Beane knew exactly what he was doing and who he was getting. So Beane "knew" he had a catcher who had three future seasons of .800+ OPS, and the best he could get in return was Damian Miller and a little cash? Wow, now that's a stupid trade. No, he wanted Miller to handle his pitching staff. It is not rocket science here. And yes Beane values defense. Not just defense, but "handling pitchers" to the point where he'll knowingly give up three consecutive seasons of .820+ OPS from the catcher just for one year of "handling pitchers". That's absolutely Dusty-Bakerian. How did he "knowingly give up...". That statement is just moronic as. Up to the point that Barrett was traded he'd never put up number like that as a catcher. He was a washed out 3rd baseman when Hendry got him.

You have got to be kidding me? Beane traded garbage for Barrett so he could get Damien Miller to handle his young pitching staff. Stole Barrett, that's a good one. Yes, nobody is a bigger believer in how a catcher "handles pitchers" than Billy Beane. Obviously Miller made a huge impression, considering he let Miller walk after one year. Barrett proceeded to hit .800+ OPS for us for a couple of more years while Miller was "handling pitchers" in Milwaukee. Are you kidding? Seriously, Barrett spent all of two days on the A's roster during the off-season before he was traded to the Cubs. It was almost like a three-way deal. He was then released by the Cubs and resigned at a lower rate than he would have gotten during arbitration. The Cubs didn't have anything the nationals wanted. Beane knew exactly what he was doing and who he was getting. So Beane "knew" he had a catcher who had three future seasons of .800+ OPS, and the best he could get in return was Damian Miller and a little cash? Wow, now that's a stupid trade. No, no one knows what the future holds. He wanted Miller to handle his pitching staff. It is not rocket science here. And yes Beane values defense.

You have got to be kidding me? Beane traded garbage for Barrett so he could get Damien Miller to handle his young pitching staff. Stole Barrett, that's a good one. Yes, nobody is a bigger believer in how a catcher "handles pitchers" than Billy Beane. Obviously Miller made a huge impression, considering he let Miller walk after one year. Barrett proceeded to hit .800+ OPS for us for a couple of more years while Miller was "handling pitchers" in Milwaukee. Are you kidding? Seriously, Barrett spent all of two days on the A's roster during the off-season before he was traded to the Cubs. It was almost like a three-way deal. He was then released by the Cubs and resigned at a lower rate than he would have gotten during arbitration. The Cubs didn't have anything the nationals wanted. Beane knew exactly what he was doing and who he was getting. You are obviously trying to play devil's advocate here.

You have got to be kidding me? Beane traded garbage for Barrett so he could get Damien Miller to handle his young pitching staff. Stole Barrett, that's a good one.

Anyone could have made those trades. Baltimore failed to come to terms on a long term contract for Lee after he was traded by the Marlins. I supposed Hendry gets credit for the first person to say, "I'll take him". Aramis was traded after questions about his "make up" and ability to play defense. Two things that still haunt him today. Hendry should get credit for the Nomar deal, but again Boston couldn't get rid of him fast enough. But all that is beside the point, Hendry has demonstrated repeatedly that he's real good at putting together mediocre to terrible teams, year in and year out. Frankly, I want more. Funny how those deals became hindsight "no brainers" that anyone could have made, but the board nearly melted down when they were made going on and on about how badly we were fleeced. Because we gave up Bobby Hill and Hee Seop Choi who were "just as good, but cheaper". Who gives a crap about what "the board" thinks? I wasn't here when Lee was traded. I think the Aramis trade was not universally panned. But it is all completely beside the point.

Anyone could have made those trades. Baltimore failed to come to terms on a long term contract for Lee after he was traded by the Marlins. I supposed Hendry gets credit for the first person to say, "I'll take him". Aramis was traded after questions about his "make up" and ability to play defense. Two things that still haunt him today. Hendry should get credit for the Nomar deal, but again Boston couldn't get rid of him fast enough. But all that is beside the point, Hendry has demonstrated repeatedly that he's real good at putting together mediocre to terrible teams, year in and year out. Frankly, I want more. Huh? Aramis Ramirez was one of the best defensive 3B in MLB last season. We think that, and it probably is true, but ask Barry Rozner and the average fan about that.

Anyone could have made those trades. Baltimore failed to come to terms on a long term contract for Lee after he was traded by the Marlins. I supposed Hendry gets credit for the first person to say, "I'll take him". Aramis was traded after questions about his "make up" and ability to play defense. Two things that still haunt him today. Hendry should get credit for the Nomar deal, but again Boston couldn't get rid of him fast enough. But all that is beside the point, Hendry has demonstrated repeatedly that he's real good at putting together mediocre to terrible teams, year in and year out. Frankly, I want more.

Good to have the voice of sanity check in every once and a while. :D I agree, however at the same time I think it shows how piss poor of a GM Hendry is.

I agree. If not better, just as good. But I think the same thing about Murton too.

Jim is playing chess while they're playing checkers. Step 1: Increase Fuld's trade value by making him "untouchable". Step 2: Step 3: Reap the rewards.

But only the Golden Dome gets ****** star players.

This entire off-season has been about that, so far. It makes absolutely no friggen' sense what-so-ever.

Teahan has a higher ceiling. That and two-fiddy gets you a Java Chip Frappuccino at Starbucks.

3/4 of Old Prior > 2/3 of all pitchers in the bigs, and he's relatively cheap. $3MM for no production is not cheap. The Cubs are no desperate for starting pitching this year, there is no need to potentially throw $3MM down the drain on wishful thinking. Wow, just... wow.

3/4 of Old Prior > 2/3 of all pitchers in the bigs, and he's relatively cheap.

I figured Ohman would be traded after his demotion and comments. By why Infante both for a RP I've never heard of?

what's the point in getting him unless we move Pie for starting pitching/SS help? He'll probably hit lefties better than Pie but he certainly won't hit righties as well. McLouth for a crappy reliever is a really good value move. If the organization is high on Colvin, dealing Pie and using McLouth as a bridge to him makes a lot of sense. I'd rather the Cubs not count on Colvin for anything at this point in his professional career, but I get what you are saying.

um..no its not, and that is the dumbest analogy I have read on this board to date. cancer isn't a performance under stress. I hope this helps: Not that I necessarily agree with this but here it goes, Clutch is simply performing at "typical" levels in "pressure situations". The player doesn't get better, he simply performs at or near expected levels Anti-clutch is the player performing at significantly worse levels in "pressure situations". I don't know how they would measure drop-off and how to control for opportunities, but I think that is the logic. It makes sense at some level.