B.J. Ryan to Blue Jays

[MeatampPotatoesMan]

It seems likely that Hendry saw that deals like this were on the horizon and that is the reason he moved quickly on Eyre and Howry at slightly higher money and years than most here anticipated.

 

It's more likely that Hendry help set the market by giving ridiculus money and years to two mediocre middle relievers.

 

There was a quote from one agent suggesting as much.

 

An agent said it? OMG it must be true!

 

So Hendry giving 3 year deals for $4M or less pressured the Jays into giving Ryan 5 years at over twice as much per year? If true, that seems like quite an exaggerated response. More likely is that the Mets flirting with Wagner is what pushed the Jays into that offer.

 

All three pitchers received 200-300% raises over their 2005 salaries.

[Illini Iceman]

It seems likely that Hendry saw that deals like this were on the horizon and that is the reason he moved quickly on Eyre and Howry at slightly higher money and years than most here anticipated.

 

It's more likely that Hendry help set the market by giving ridiculus money and years to two mediocre middle relievers.

 

There was a quote from one agent suggesting as much.

 

An agent said it? OMG it must be true!

 

So Hendry giving 3 year deals for $4M or less pressured the Jays into giving Ryan 5 years at over twice as much per year? If true, that seems like quite an exaggerated response. More likely is that the Mets flirting with Wagner is what pushed the Jays into that offer.

 

All three pitchers received 200-300% raises over their 2005 salaries.

 

OK, then based on your theory Wagner will also receive a 200-300% raise since that is the "market" Hendry has set. Let me know when that happens.

[MeatampPotatoesMan]

It seems likely that Hendry saw that deals like this were on the horizon and that is the reason he moved quickly on Eyre and Howry at slightly higher money and years than most here anticipated.

 

It's more likely that Hendry help set the market by giving ridiculus money and years to two mediocre middle relievers.

 

There was a quote from one agent suggesting as much.

 

An agent said it? OMG it must be true!

 

So Hendry giving 3 year deals for $4M or less pressured the Jays into giving Ryan 5 years at over twice as much per year? If true, that seems like quite an exaggerated response. More likely is that the Mets flirting with Wagner is what pushed the Jays into that offer.

 

All three pitchers received 200-300% raises over their 2005 salaries.

 

OK, then based on your theory Wagner will also receive a 200-300% raise since that is the "market" Hendry has set. Let me know when that happens.

 

When did I offer up a theory? Eyre, Howry, and Ryan all received 200% + raises from their 2005 salaries. That is a fact.

[Illini Iceman]

It seems likely that Hendry saw that deals like this were on the horizon and that is the reason he moved quickly on Eyre and Howry at slightly higher money and years than most here anticipated.

 

It's more likely that Hendry help set the market by giving ridiculus money and years to two mediocre middle relievers.

 

There was a quote from one agent suggesting as much.

 

An agent said it? OMG it must be true!

 

So Hendry giving 3 year deals for $4M or less pressured the Jays into giving Ryan 5 years at over twice as much per year? If true, that seems like quite an exaggerated response. More likely is that the Mets flirting with Wagner is what pushed the Jays into that offer.

 

All three pitchers received 200-300% raises over their 2005 salaries.

 

OK, then based on your theory Wagner will also receive a 200-300% raise since that is the "market" Hendry has set. Let me know when that happens.

 

When did I offer up a theory? Eyre, Howry, and Ryan all received 200% + raises from their 2005 salaries. That is a fact.

 

You seemed to imply that it supported the notion that Hendry set the market for Ryan by the signings of Eyre and Howry.

If that is not what you were implying then I don't see the relevance of posting those numbers in response to my post.

In any case, my original opinion hasn't changed. The Hendry signings of Eyre and Howry IMO did not influence the Jays to give this kind of contract to Ryan. More likely is that word of this type of offer caused Hendry to give a little more in years and dollars to Eyre and Howry than he may have originally planned in order to make sure that the bullpen was addressed to his satisfaction.

I can understand the comments of people that do not feel Eyre and Howry are worth the money and it is possible they will be right. However, those that feel that the signings were good but that he should have gotten them for less I feel are not quite appreciating the difficulty of negotiations of this magnitude. Of course in a perfect world you get all the guys you want for $1.00 more than the next best offer. However, in the real world you sometimes have to extend beyond what you think might be necessary if completing a deal is very important to you.

[CubinNY]

It seems likely that Hendry saw that deals like this were on the horizon and that is the reason he moved quickly on Eyre and Howry at slightly higher money and years than most here anticipated.

 

It's more likely that Hendry help set the market by giving ridiculus money and years to two mediocre middle relievers.

 

There was a quote from one agent suggesting as much.

 

An agent said it? OMG it must be true!

 

So Hendry giving 3 year deals for $4M or less pressured the Jays into giving Ryan 5 years at over twice as much per year? If true, that seems like quite an exaggerated response. More likely is that the Mets flirting with Wagner is what pushed the Jays into that offer.

 

It is one thing to debate a point and quite another to take a point and run. Keep running you might get somewhere someday.

 

As to my post. Agent's use figure to establish market value. Those figuers are know because of the collective bargining agreement. I do not know for certian that Hendry's overpaying of Howry and Erye led to Ryans outrageous contract, but here is what I do know.

 

Scott Eyre was so intent on becoming a Cub he accepted their three-year, $11 million offer without trying to find out if he could get more elsewhere.

 

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/cs-051118cubseyre,1,6706818.story?coll=cs-cubs-headlines

 

This leads me to believe that Hendry's offer was so far beyond what anyone else was going to give Eyre he did even need to look for other offeres.

 

The best free-agent relievers, behind [billy] Wagner and [b.J.] Ryan, are Eyre and Howry," one talent evaluator said. "The other two [Wagner and Ryan] are closers and the Cubs already have [Ryan] Dempster for that."

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/cs-051123cubshowry,1,7027563.story?coll=cs-cubs-headlines

 

Now Howry signed for 3 years for 12 million. I'd expect that these two signing had something to do with Ryan's contract. But that is just me. I like to form my opinions on evidence. I'm kind of crazy like that.

 

How do you form yours?

[Illini Iceman]

It seems likely that Hendry saw that deals like this were on the horizon and that is the reason he moved quickly on Eyre and Howry at slightly higher money and years than most here anticipated.

 

It's more likely that Hendry help set the market by giving ridiculus money and years to two mediocre middle relievers.

 

There was a quote from one agent suggesting as much.

 

An agent said it? OMG it must be true!

 

So Hendry giving 3 year deals for $4M or less pressured the Jays into giving Ryan 5 years at over twice as much per year? If true, that seems like quite an exaggerated response. More likely is that the Mets flirting with Wagner is what pushed the Jays into that offer.

 

It is one thing to debate a point and quite another to take a point and run. Keep running you might get somewhere someday.

 

As to my post. Agent's use figure to establish market value. Those figuers are know because of the collective bargining agreement. I do not know for certian that Hendry's overpaying of Howry and Erye led to Ryans outrageous contract, but here is what I do know.

 

Scott Eyre was so intent on becoming a Cub he accepted their three-year, $11 million offer without trying to find out if he could get more elsewhere.

 

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/cs-051118cubseyre,1,6706818.story?coll=cs-cubs-headlines

 

This leads me to believe that Hendry's offer was so far beyond what anyone else was going to give Eyre he did even need to look for other offeres.

 

The best free-agent relievers, behind [billy] Wagner and [b.J.] Ryan, are Eyre and Howry," one talent evaluator said. "The other two [Wagner and Ryan] are closers and the Cubs already have [Ryan] Dempster for that."

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/cs-051123cubshowry,1,7027563.story?coll=cs-cubs-headlines

 

Now Howry signed for 3 years for 12 million. I'd expect that these two signing had something to do with Ryan's contract. But that is just me. I like to form my opinions on evidence. I'm kind of crazy like that.

 

How do you form yours?

 

These two articles are your evidence?

 

Eyre said he spoke with Rusch and liked what he heard about the team chemistry. What about that leads you to believe "that Hendry's offer was so far beyond what anyone else was going to give Eyre he did even need to look for other offers". Sounds like that was your opinion so you chose to read that into his comments even though he never said anything like that.

 

A talent evaluater (on a side note, what the hell is that, the fancy name for a scout?) said that Eyre and Howry are the next best relievers on the market after Wagner and Ryan? Big deal. I hardly think that Ryan and Wagner were waiting around for Eyre and Howry to sign to set their market. It works the other way around. The big name guys set the market for the lower level free agents. Just because deals haven't been finalized doesn't mean that the word is not getting about how much teams are offering. I am pretty sure that the market had already realized that Ryan and Wagner were going to get close to 5/$50M and the dominoes start falling from there.

 

All my opinion, since I am not part of the inner circle. However, neither are you, so don't pretend that you have any more insight into the process than anyone else. Get me a quote from the Jays saying that they offered this much to Ryan because of the Eyre and Howry deals and that will be evidence. Everything else is just opinion and conjecture.

[oldcubsfan]

I think Hendry was sharp in signing these guys before the market was set. I think if he waited the cost would have been higher with more competition for them. These guys fill a substantial need for the Cubs and he got them.

[oldcubsfan]

It seems likely that Hendry saw that deals like this were on the horizon and that is the reason he moved quickly on Eyre and Howry at slightly higher money and years than most here anticipated.

 

It's more likely that Hendry help set the market by giving ridiculus money and years to two mediocre middle relievers.

 

There was a quote from one agent suggesting as much.

 

An agent said it? OMG it must be true!

 

So Hendry giving 3 year deals for $4M or less pressured the Jays into giving Ryan 5 years at over twice as much per year? If true, that seems like quite an exaggerated response. More likely is that the Mets flirting with Wagner is what pushed the Jays into that offer.

 

It is one thing to debate a point and quite another to take a point and run. Keep running you might get somewhere someday.

 

As to my post. Agent's use figure to establish market value. Those figuers are know because of the collective bargining agreement. I do not know for certian that Hendry's overpaying of Howry and Erye led to Ryans outrageous contract, but here is what I do know.

 

Scott Eyre was so intent on becoming a Cub he accepted their three-year, $11 million offer without trying to find out if he could get more elsewhere.

 

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/cs-051118cubseyre,1,6706818.story?coll=cs-cubs-headlines

 

This leads me to believe that Hendry's offer was so far beyond what anyone else was going to give Eyre he did even need to look for other offeres.

 

The best free-agent relievers, behind [billy] Wagner and [b.J.] Ryan, are Eyre and Howry," one talent evaluator said. "The other two [Wagner and Ryan] are closers and the Cubs already have [Ryan] Dempster for that."

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/cs-051123cubshowry,1,7027563.story?coll=cs-cubs-headlines

 

Now Howry signed for 3 years for 12 million. I'd expect that these two signing had something to do with Ryan's contract. But that is just me. I like to form my opinions on evidence. I'm kind of crazy like that.

 

How do you form yours?

Exactly what in the articles provides your evidence other than conjecture by unnamed sources?

[CubinNY]

It seems likely that Hendry saw that deals like this were on the horizon and that is the reason he moved quickly on Eyre and Howry at slightly higher money and years than most here anticipated.

 

It's more likely that Hendry help set the market by giving ridiculus money and years to two mediocre middle relievers.

 

There was a quote from one agent suggesting as much.

 

An agent said it? OMG it must be true!

 

So Hendry giving 3 year deals for $4M or less pressured the Jays into giving Ryan 5 years at over twice as much per year? If true, that seems like quite an exaggerated response. More likely is that the Mets flirting with Wagner is what pushed the Jays into that offer.

 

It is one thing to debate a point and quite another to take a point and run. Keep running you might get somewhere someday.

 

As to my post. Agent's use figure to establish market value. Those figuers are know because of the collective bargining agreement. I do not know for certian that Hendry's overpaying of Howry and Erye led to Ryans outrageous contract, but here is what I do know.

 

Scott Eyre was so intent on becoming a Cub he accepted their three-year, $11 million offer without trying to find out if he could get more elsewhere.

 

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/cs-051118cubseyre,1,6706818.story?coll=cs-cubs-headlines

 

This leads me to believe that Hendry's offer was so far beyond what anyone else was going to give Eyre he did even need to look for other offeres.

 

The best free-agent relievers, behind [billy] Wagner and [b.J.] Ryan, are Eyre and Howry," one talent evaluator said. "The other two [Wagner and Ryan] are closers and the Cubs already have [Ryan] Dempster for that."

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/cubs/cs-051123cubshowry,1,7027563.story?coll=cs-cubs-headlines

 

Now Howry signed for 3 years for 12 million. I'd expect that these two signing had something to do with Ryan's contract. But that is just me. I like to form my opinions on evidence. I'm kind of crazy like that.

 

How do you form yours?

Exactly what in the articles provides your evidence other than conjecture by unnamed sources?

 

It is pretty simple.

 

Erye signs for x amount- Market set for Howry

Howry signs for x amount- Market set for Ryan

Ryan signs for x amont- Market set for Wagner

Wagner will sgin for x amont based on what the others signed for.

 

I don't say there is a direct proportional arrangement to the contracts. But that is how things work. Each agent knows exactly how much the last guy got and they base their proposal on president.

 

They don't work on chemistry or magic. They work on money. Hendry has set the market for relivers. You two can choose to believe what you want. But every year we see the same thing. The little fish sign, the medium size fish sign, the big fish sign. Their are always exceptions but that is generally how it works.

[frostwyrm]

I fully do not understand some posters in this thread. How can anyone not see that Hendry has influenced the market for relievers? It's so incredibly obvious. Eyre had all 30 teams interested and he never even bothered negotiating. Howry had lots of suitors too, but he accepted Hendry's offer immediately. I also don't get this "big names set the market" crap. If 30-something mediocrities like Eyre and Howry get huge contracts how can that possibly not drive up the prices of everyone else too?

[CubinNY]

If 30-something mediocrities like Eyre and Howry get huge contracts how can that possibly not drive up the prices of everyone else too?

 

It's easy if one takes logic and the realities of the baseball business out of the equation.

[RockTheIvy]

For frost:

 

http://img351.imageshack.us/img351/6205/il26qb.jpg

[MeatampPotatoesMan]

I fully do not understand some posters in this thread. How can anyone not see that Hendry has influenced the market for relievers? It's so incredibly obvious. Eyre had all 30 teams interested and he never even bothered negotiating. Howry had lots of suitors too, but he accepted Hendry's offer immediately. I also don't get this "big names set the market" crap. If 30-something mediocrities like Eyre and Howry get huge contracts how can that possibly not drive up the prices of everyone else too?

 

don't big names tend to sign later than their counterparts? that seems to lend weight to your argument. i'll buy it.

[frostwyrm]

For frost:

 

http://img351.imageshack.us/img351/6205/il26qb.jpg

 

Team America, f*** yeah! I was watching that movie and decided to create a North Korea themed profile. I may put some panthers in soon.

[RockTheIvy]

hahaha!

 

You're breakin my balls, Hans.

[Illini Iceman]

If 30-something mediocrities like Eyre and Howry get huge contracts how can that possibly not drive up the prices of everyone else too?

 

It's easy if one takes logic and the realities of the baseball business out of the equation.

 

I hope someday I can be as smart as you think you are.

[RockTheIvy]

If 30-something mediocrities like Eyre and Howry get huge contracts how can that possibly not drive up the prices of everyone else too?

 

It's easy if one takes logic and the realities of the baseball business out of the equation.

 

I hope someday I can be as smart as you think you are.

 

Man this board used to be like Cheers! Now it's the dirt bar!! Ease up everybody!!

[MeatampPotatoesMan]

If 30-something mediocrities like Eyre and Howry get huge contracts how can that possibly not drive up the prices of everyone else too?

 

It's easy if one takes logic and the realities of the baseball business out of the equation.

 

I hope someday I can be as smart as you think you are.

 

Man this board used to be like Cheers! Now it's the dirt bar!! Ease up everybody!!

 

NORM!!!

[Illini Iceman]

If 30-something mediocrities like Eyre and Howry get huge contracts how can that possibly not drive up the prices of everyone else too?

 

It's easy if one takes logic and the realities of the baseball business out of the equation.

 

I hope someday I can be as smart as you think you are.

 

Man this board used to be like Cheers! Now it's the dirt bar!! Ease up everybody!!

 

NORM!!!

 

It's a dog eat dog world and I am wearing Milkbone underwear. Classic line.

[RockTheIvy]

"Women, can't live with 'em... Pass the beer nuts."

- Norm

[MeatampPotatoesMan]

If 30-something mediocrities like Eyre and Howry get huge contracts how can that possibly not drive up the prices of everyone else too?

 

It's easy if one takes logic and the realities of the baseball business out of the equation.

 

I hope someday I can be as smart as you think you are.

 

Man this board used to be like Cheers! Now it's the dirt bar!! Ease up everybody!!

 

NORM!!!

 

It's a dog eat dog world and I am wearing Milkbone underwear. Classic line.

 

:lol:

 

"Hey Norm, what's up?"

 

"My blood-alcohol level." :D

[RockTheIvy]

If 30-something mediocrities like Eyre and Howry get huge contracts how can that possibly not drive up the prices of everyone else too?

 

It's easy if one takes logic and the realities of the baseball business out of the equation.

 

I hope someday I can be as smart as you think you are.

 

Man this board used to be like Cheers! Now it's the dirt bar!! Ease up everybody!!

 

NORM!!!

 

It's a dog eat dog world and I am wearing Milkbone underwear. Classic line.

 

:lol:

 

"Hey Norm, what's up?"

 

"My blood-alcohol level." :D

 

:lol: WINNER!

[CubinNY]

If 30-something mediocrities like Eyre and Howry get huge contracts how can that possibly not drive up the prices of everyone else too?

 

It's easy if one takes logic and the realities of the baseball business out of the equation.

 

I hope someday I can be as smart as you think you are.

 

Let me try this on you:

 

I grow tomatos. I've been growing them for five years. Three of those years my crop was not tasty but the last two of them my tomatos were sweet and juciy. My neighbor has been growing tomatoes for five years as well. Every year his tomatos are plump, sweet, and juicy. My neighbor and I go to the market. We meet wholesalers who knows our growing histories. One says to me I'll give you $1.50 per pound. Another says I'll give you $1.51 per pound. A thrid says I'll give you $1.49 per pound. A fourth says I'll give you $3.00 per pound. I don't need to ask a fifth. Now my neighbor has been watching me. Where do you think he will start the bidding?

 

Look, I'm happy Hendry is upgrading the pen but to suggest that these signings didn't impact what Ryan got is to completely ignore the business side of baseball.

[RynoRules]

Woody: Hey Normy how's the world treating you?

 

Norm: Like a baby treats a diaper.

[Cubfanintheknow]

I think the Cubs had to overspend a little to get Howry and Eyre. I look at it this way; who's going to spend more to get a car: the guy with no car or the guy driving a new Mercedes? The Cubs bullpen was atrocious in '05 and agents negotiating for relievers knew this.