Bears offseason

[davell]

Ryan gets 3/30 from Tennessee lol. Holy hell, are we going to just sit on our asses?

 

Then Biggs says Bouye never even truly considered us, due to being 3-13 and having an unstable coaching staff moving forward lol.

 

Holy horsefeathers, Theo must be looking at Pace and laughing his horsefeathering ass off.

 

We wouldn't have wanted him at that price, he's a slot corner that's heavily protected by safeties.

 

I have a feeling that Pace will draft Lattimore and another CB high now, and run with them as the starters.

 

Maybe if there's a trade down or 2. With the holes we have, I really don't see us staying at 3 if there's even a remotely fair offer to move down.

 

And with the injury concerns Lattimore has with his hamstrings, I kind of doubt Pace takes that gamble, at this point.

[Guest]

Ryan gets 3/30 from Tennessee lol. Holy hell, are we going to just sit on our asses?

 

Then Biggs says Bouye never even truly considered us, due to being 3-13 and having an unstable coaching staff moving forward lol.

 

Holy horsefeathers, Theo must be looking at Pace and laughing his horsefeathering ass off.

 

We wouldn't have wanted him at that price, he's a slot corner that's heavily protected by safeties.

 

I have a feeling that Pace will draft Lattimore and another CB high now, and run with them as the starters.

 

Maybe if there's a trade down or 2. With the holes we have, I really don't see us staying at 3 if there's even a remotely fair offer to move down.

 

And with the injury concerns Lattimore has with his hamstrings, I kind of doubt Pace takes that gamble, at this point.

 

From what i've read, no one is concerned with the hamstring, and he's the best man corner in the draft.

[jumbo]

Ryan gets 3/30 from Tennessee lol. Holy hell, are we going to just sit on our asses?

 

Then Biggs says Bouye never even truly considered us, due to being 3-13 and having an unstable coaching staff moving forward lol.

 

Holy horsefeathers, Theo must be looking at Pace and laughing his horsefeathering ass off.

 

We wouldn't have wanted him at that price, he's a slot corner that's heavily protected by safeties.

 

I have a feeling that Pace will draft Lattimore and another CB high now, and run with them as the starters.

 

Maybe if there's a trade down or 2. With the holes we have, I really don't see us staying at 3 if there's even a remotely fair offer to move down.

 

And with the injury concerns Lattimore has with his hamstrings, I kind of doubt Pace takes that gamble, at this point.

 

Definitely a disappointing FA no matter what happens in day 2.

 

Alshon signing for one year makes me wonder if he is representing himself.

 

The lame FA signings have to signal that the rebuild is continuing in a more "long term draft based" approach (which I realize should be non-existent int he NFL). Signing Glennon and only mid tier FAs means next year's team is not a leigt playoff contender in Pace's eyes, meaning Fox is gone after next season. To me that puts the QB selection in the 2nd or 3rd round, not the 1st. If no QB at #3, then I think you trade down and let someone else jump ahead of the Jets for their choice of QBs. Or maybe a team that wants to jump the Jaguars for a defender.

[Guest]

Your logic is strange. You're assuming Pace planned this? He didn't, he just missed on his targets. His signing of Demps instead of Swearinger was a mistake, but not a "long-term" decision at all.

 

I think it's also pretty evident that Pace is going to have to draft a CB first. However, now he has more holes than he antucipated heading into the draft, so i wouldn't be surprised by anything.

[WrigleyField 22]

Your logic is strange. You're assuming Pace planned this? He didn't, he just missed on his targets. His signing of Demps instead of Swearinger was a mistake, but not a "long-term" decision at all.

 

I think it's also pretty evident that Pace is going to have to draft a CB first. However, now he has more holes than he antucipated heading into the draft, so i wouldn't be surprised by anything.

Lattimore could obviously make his own argument as BPA, but I really don't think Pace has the luxury of a need pick. He just needs to bring in the best guy at each slot, and he'll have a chance to make an impact (unless its a RB who can't split out into the slot- thats the one position a guy will end up buried).

[Guest]

Your logic is strange. You're assuming Pace planned this? He didn't, he just missed on his targets. His signing of Demps instead of Swearinger was a mistake, but not a "long-term" decision at all.

 

I think it's also pretty evident that Pace is going to have to draft a CB first. However, now he has more holes than he antucipated heading into the draft, so i wouldn't be surprised by anything.

Lattimore could obviously make his own argument as BPA, but I really don't think Pace has the luxury of a need pick. He just needs to bring in the best guy at each slot, and he'll have a chance to make an impact (unless its a RB who can't split out into the slot- thats the one position a guy will end up buried).

 

Fangio's defense can work well if the CB's are there, the defense could potentially carry the Bears. Even with the issues at WR, the Bears have enough talent to score points. Do they have a lot of holes? Yes, but with strength up front, they can get by with deficiencies elsewhere.

if you get Lattimore and potentially another CB that can start on the outside - Claiborne is still out there - then you're dangerous.

[WrigleyField 22]

Your logic is strange. You're assuming Pace planned this? He didn't, he just missed on his targets. His signing of Demps instead of Swearinger was a mistake, but not a "long-term" decision at all.

 

I think it's also pretty evident that Pace is going to have to draft a CB first. However, now he has more holes than he antucipated heading into the draft, so i wouldn't be surprised by anything.

Lattimore could obviously make his own argument as BPA, but I really don't think Pace has the luxury of a need pick. He just needs to bring in the best guy at each slot, and he'll have a chance to make an impact (unless its a RB who can't split out into the slot- thats the one position a guy will end up buried).

 

Fangio's defense can work well if the CB's are there, the defense could potentially carry the Bears. Even with the issues at WR, the Bears have enough talent to score points. Do they have a lot of holes? Yes, but with strength up front, they can get by with deficiencies elsewhere.

if you get Lattimore and potentially another CB that can start on the outside - Claiborne is still out there - then you're dangerous.

You could also probably get a CB as late as round 3 in this draft and find a starter.

 

So Lattimore is probably one of a half dozen guys at #3 for me, with not a lot of separation, yet. If one guy can separate himself a bit more we still have upgrades needed all over.

[WrigleyField 22]

Anyone have access to PFF scores. Reading some commentary, it sounds like its the blocking scores that are making up Sims poor PFF scores, but I cant find the raw broken out scores. If thats the case I really hope PFF is missing something and this guy can actually block, at least.

[WrigleyField 22]

Day two wish list.

 

Cap - After seeing the Sims number I'm also bumping up my Wheaton estimate and saying 34M in cap remaining, with about 10 due for draft pool. So 24M (could find another 10 by waiving Royal and/or Houston at about 5M savings a piece)

 

1. Pryor. He may end up being flash in the pan, with only one year of production to his name, but as long as the guaranteed and length is set up right, I want to see them take that chance. Either a one year prove it contract ala Jeffery or a 3/30-36 with up front roster bonuses. Est. Cap $11M. Cut Eddie Royal.

 

2. Either Amukamara or Claiborne. I'd give them either 1-2 yr deals with a high AAV or a longer deal in the 7-8M range. I'll set aside 10 as a conservative estimate.

 

3. DL depth. Names to consider, Lawrence Guy, BAL. CJ Wilson CHI. Jarvis Jenkins, KC. Stephen Paea, CLE. If there is a Cornelius Washington double out there who doubles as ST, that too.

 

4. Swing OT/RT This is probably either Reiff or Beachum. At too high of a cost you could make an argument to just stick with Mike Adams. Massie could also be cut for $5M savings if you felt one was just a pure upgrade and required that cap space.

 

5. Position to watch -OLB. Still some young, intriguing names, and with the formentioned $5M savings from Houston available you could effectively swap out for the same cap hit at the right price. Not a market that has shaken out totally yet.

[UMFan83]

Your logic is strange. You're assuming Pace planned this? He didn't, he just missed on his targets. His signing of Demps instead of Swearinger was a mistake, but not a "long-term" decision at all.

 

I think it's also pretty evident that Pace is going to have to draft a CB first. However, now he has more holes than he antucipated heading into the draft, so i wouldn't be surprised by anything.

Lattimore could obviously make his own argument as BPA, but I really don't think Pace has the luxury of a need pick. He just needs to bring in the best guy at each slot, and he'll have a chance to make an impact (unless its a RB who can't split out into the slot- thats the one position a guy will end up buried).

 

Fangio's defense can work well if the CB's are there, the defense could potentially carry the Bears. Even with the issues at WR, the Bears have enough talent to score points. Do they have a lot of holes? Yes, but with strength up front, they can get by with deficiencies elsewhere.

if you get Lattimore and potentially another CB that can start on the outside - Claiborne is still out there - then you're dangerous.

 

I don't see where they have the talent to score points. Howard and Kyle Long if healthy are their only above average players on offense, with Whitehair and Kevin White the only 2 with the potential to grow into above average players. The talent on offense sucks right now and a decent line will only make it average at best.

[WrigleyField 22]

Lattimore could obviously make his own argument as BPA, but I really don't think Pace has the luxury of a need pick. He just needs to bring in the best guy at each slot, and he'll have a chance to make an impact (unless its a RB who can't split out into the slot- thats the one position a guy will end up buried).

 

Fangio's defense can work well if the CB's are there, the defense could potentially carry the Bears. Even with the issues at WR, the Bears have enough talent to score points. Do they have a lot of holes? Yes, but with strength up front, they can get by with deficiencies elsewhere.

if you get Lattimore and potentially another CB that can start on the outside - Claiborne is still out there - then you're dangerous.

 

I don't see where they have the talent to score points. Howard and Kyle Long if healthy are their only above average players on offense, with Whitehair and Kevin White the only 2 with the potential to grow into above average players. The talent on offense sucks right now and a decent line will only make it average at best.

Well Whitehair already is above average, as is Sitton, but yea the point stands that a offense built around a one dimensional RB and the three interior line spots, likely will have trouble scoring points, especially since last years version of the O had the same issue.

 

Serious White growth/health, Glennon being average, and a repeat Meredith performance are all needed. Maybe Langford turning into a utility guy too (needs to catch the ball).

[Guest]

Lattimore could obviously make his own argument as BPA, but I really don't think Pace has the luxury of a need pick. He just needs to bring in the best guy at each slot, and he'll have a chance to make an impact (unless its a RB who can't split out into the slot- thats the one position a guy will end up buried).

 

Fangio's defense can work well if the CB's are there, the defense could potentially carry the Bears. Even with the issues at WR, the Bears have enough talent to score points. Do they have a lot of holes? Yes, but with strength up front, they can get by with deficiencies elsewhere.

if you get Lattimore and potentially another CB that can start on the outside - Claiborne is still out there - then you're dangerous.

 

I don't see where they have the talent to score points. Howard and Kyle Long if healthy are their only above average players on offense, with Whitehair and Kevin White the only 2 with the potential to grow into above average players. The talent on offense sucks right now and a decent line will only make it average at best.

 

Whitehair, Sitton, and Long are all above average, with Leno and Massie being average. If Long is injury-plagued again, Kush is actually pretty decent as well.They allowed the same amount of sacks as the Cowboys and PFO reports that their pass protection was better. if Glennon is a capable QB, they will score points.

[UMFan83]

 

Fangio's defense can work well if the CB's are there, the defense could potentially carry the Bears. Even with the issues at WR, the Bears have enough talent to score points. Do they have a lot of holes? Yes, but with strength up front, they can get by with deficiencies elsewhere.

if you get Lattimore and potentially another CB that can start on the outside - Claiborne is still out there - then you're dangerous.

 

I don't see where they have the talent to score points. Howard and Kyle Long if healthy are their only above average players on offense, with Whitehair and Kevin White the only 2 with the potential to grow into above average players. The talent on offense sucks right now and a decent line will only make it average at best.

 

Whitehair, Sitton, and Long are all above average, with Leno and Massie being average. If Long is injury-plagued again, Kush is actually pretty decent as well.They allowed the same amount of sacks as the Cowboys and PFO reports that their pass protection was better. if Glennon is a capable QB, they will score points.

 

Fair enough, I considered Sitton but ultimately didn't add him because of age related decline fears. And Whitehair I considered promising but not quite there yet. But I didn't base anything off PFF grades or even much of an eye test since I drank enough to black out the last half of the Bears season.

 

I still think the offense as a whole lacks impact skill players, but overall I think the judgement of the Bears offense rests on your opinion of Glennon. He might have a better completion percentage with a better line but its not like his accuracy in college was any good so while I don't think its impossible that he works out, I'm not overly optimistic.

[David]

 

I don't see where they have the talent to score points. Howard and Kyle Long if healthy are their only above average players on offense, with Whitehair and Kevin White the only 2 with the potential to grow into above average players. The talent on offense sucks right now and a decent line will only make it average at best.

 

Whitehair, Sitton, and Long are all above average, with Leno and Massie being average. If Long is injury-plagued again, Kush is actually pretty decent as well.They allowed the same amount of sacks as the Cowboys and PFO reports that their pass protection was better. if Glennon is a capable QB, they will score points.

 

Fair enough, I considered Sitton but ultimately didn't add him because of age related decline fears. And Whitehair I considered promising but not quite there yet. But I didn't base anything off PFF grades or even much of an eye test since I drank enough to black out the last half of the Bears season.

 

I still think the offense as a whole lacks impact skill players, but overall I think the judgement of the Bears offense rests on your opinion of Glennon. He might have a better completion percentage with a better line but its not like his accuracy in college was any good so while I don't think its impossible that he works out, I'm not overly optimistic.

 

please tell me you didn't care enough to do this as a result of the games and that it was more just you normally enjoy getting very drunk on football sundays

[UMFan83]

 

Whitehair, Sitton, and Long are all above average, with Leno and Massie being average. If Long is injury-plagued again, Kush is actually pretty decent as well.They allowed the same amount of sacks as the Cowboys and PFO reports that their pass protection was better. if Glennon is a capable QB, they will score points.

 

Fair enough, I considered Sitton but ultimately didn't add him because of age related decline fears. And Whitehair I considered promising but not quite there yet. But I didn't base anything off PFF grades or even much of an eye test since I drank enough to black out the last half of the Bears season.

 

I still think the offense as a whole lacks impact skill players, but overall I think the judgement of the Bears offense rests on your opinion of Glennon. He might have a better completion percentage with a better line but its not like his accuracy in college was any good so while I don't think its impossible that he works out, I'm not overly optimistic.

 

please tell me you didn't care enough to do this as a result of the games and that it was more just you normally enjoy getting very drunk on football sundays

 

I was trying to sound cool (because getting blackout drunk is cool right??). In reality I half watched the games while kids distracted me and because the games were of no importance I completely forgot about them after they ended, so really wasn't evaluating the performance of guys like Massie or Leno.

[David]

Bowen on Glennon for those who have Insider

 

http://www.espn.com/nfl/insider/story/_/id/18858747/what-bears-expect-qb-mike-glennon-2017-nfl-free-agency

 

 

 

PFF's thoughts on some of the relevant FA deals (ours or guys we were looking at)

 

https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-grading-every-deal-of-2017-nfl-free-agency/?utm_content=buffer0791c&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=nfl

 

CB Stephon Gilmore to New England Patriots

Actual: Five years, $65 million, $40 million guaranteed

 

PFF play-earned contract: Five-years, $22.8 million, $12.1 million guaranteed

 

Grade: C

 

Gilmore is one of the few corners in this free-agent crop capable of manning a No. 1 role for a defense, so he was always going to get big money, but his PFF play-earned contract figure shows just how far short of his reputation his play has been at times over the past few seasons. In 2016, Gilmore allowed 60.3 percent of passes thrown his way to be caught, and was beaten for 15.6 yards per catch.

 

WR Alshon Jeffery to Philadelphia Eagles

Alshon Jeffery Eagles

 

Actual: One-year, $14 million

 

PFF play-earned contract: Four years, $35 million, $11.6 million guaranteed

 

Grade: A

 

There are a lot of question marks surrounding Alshon Jeffery, and so a short-term, prove-it deal makes a lot of sense for all concerned. The Eagles managed to get that deal done at a significantly lower than the price of the franchise tag figure that the Bears were balking at. This could be a good move for all parties.

 

CB A.J. Bouye to Jacksonville Jaguars

A.J. Bouye to Jaguars

 

Actual: Five years, $67.5 million, $20 million guaranteed

 

PFF play-earned contract: Five years, $68.9 million, $25.1 million guaranteed

 

Grade: A

 

A year ago, A.J. Bouye was an unknown quantity, but he finished the season as PFF’s third-ranked CB with an overall grade of 90.9. Bouye allowed just 54.5 percent of passes thrown his way to be caught for only 9.8 yards per catch, and showed legitimate No. 1 corner upside.

 

QB Mike Glennon to Chicago Bears

Actual: Three years, $45 million, $18.5 million guaranteed

 

PFF play-earned contract: Three years, $21 million, $8.3 million guaranteed

 

Grade: B

 

The QB market doesn’t really behave like any other market in the NFL. It’s effectively a binary state of starters earning upwards of $15 million, and everybody else, not. The Bears think Glennon has a shot to be that guy, but aren’t betting more than a year and a bit of that money on it.

[UMFan83]

Well there's something:

 

 

12th highest rated FA CB according to PFF

[minnesotacubsfan]

"well, ya gotta field a team somehow" - Ryan Pace

[Guest]

 

I don't see where they have the talent to score points. Howard and Kyle Long if healthy are their only above average players on offense, with Whitehair and Kevin White the only 2 with the potential to grow into above average players. The talent on offense sucks right now and a decent line will only make it average at best.

 

Whitehair, Sitton, and Long are all above average, with Leno and Massie being average. If Long is injury-plagued again, Kush is actually pretty decent as well.They allowed the same amount of sacks as the Cowboys and PFO reports that their pass protection was better. if Glennon is a capable QB, they will score points.

 

Fair enough, I considered Sitton but ultimately didn't add him because of age related decline fears. And Whitehair I considered promising but not quite there yet. But I didn't base anything off PFF grades or even much of an eye test since I drank enough to black out the last half of the Bears season.

 

I still think the offense as a whole lacks impact skill players, but overall I think the judgement of the Bears offense rests on your opinion of Glennon. He might have a better completion percentage with a better line but its not like his accuracy in college was any good so while I don't think its impossible that he works out, I'm not overly optimistic.

 

at this point, there is potential there, among the offensive skill players. Howard is excellent, Meredith broke out, White has potential. Need more production out of the tight end position and slot. Pace addressed the slot need, but I don't see much upside with Sims, Miller, Brown, Paulsen, etc.

 

Pace has work to do yet in FA in getting another WR, and I've advocated for Gordon. I'd like him to pick Engram in the 2nd round as well. If he's able to pull that off, those problems are addressed, tentatively, considering they're unknown at this point.

 

What he's got is a clean pocket for Glennon, who is also an unknown. However, Barkley led the Bears in some competitive games with good pass-protection in front of him, and without Jeffery. so I'm confident that if Glennon can make his progressions, he'll do well, regardless of his skill weapons.

 

Defense is another matter. Maybe Pace is gambling on Fuller starting in man coverage, moving Porter to slot, and drafting Lattimore or Humphrey. At least for next year, the safety play is stable, if not deep. If they do intend to depend upon Fuller opposite Lattimore, it could go several ways, but Fuller has at least had success in ball-hawking in the past.

 

if the Bears have the same injuries to their front 7 that they had last year, nothing will save them. There's no possible way that anyone could recover from the injuries and suspensions that they had last season. They will need Goldman to stay on the field, they will need Kwiatkowski to develop in Trevathan's absence. Hicks is solid, Freeman is still elite, Floyd will need to take another step. Bullard will have to improve as well, but he showed flashes. Sutton provides depth, and Pace has his work cut out for him finding more depth there in the later rounds.

 

The Bears cannot have the injuries that they had last year, if they do, they will be bad. if they stay healthy, they can compete for a playoff spot depending upon Pace's draft.

[Guest]

Well there's something:

 

 

12th highest rated FA CB according to PFF

 

well, he grades out at 81, which is above average. Depending on dollars, good signing considering what's left.

Edited March 10, 2017 by Stannis

[davell]

"well, ya gotta field a team somehow" - Ryan Pace

 

 

Amukamara is an excellent signing.

[David]

Well there's something:

 

 

12th highest rated FA CB according to PFF

 

well, he grades out at 81, which is above average. Good signing considering what's left.

 

Him and Lattimore (not saying I'm committed to that idea) and that secondary looks pretty damn solid all of a sudden as long as Demps doesn't completely fall off a cliff.

 

Fuller might still be a competent guy in that mix as well.

[WrigleyField 22]

1 year deal. I'm gonna guess its 9M.

[davell]

You've got to go find an actual WR at this point. It'd be nice to upgrade Massie too, but I'm not sure that player exists in FA now. I'd take a flyer on Kelvin Beachum though. Nice upside play that I bet would wind up taking a starting spot, if he's healthy and motivated.

[WrigleyField 22]

You've got to go find an actual WR at this point. It'd be nice to upgrade Massie too, but I'm not sure that player exists in FA now. I'd take a flyer on Kelvin Beachum though. Nice upside play that I bet would wind up taking a starting spot, if he's healthy and motivated.

Would Pryor take a Alshon deal? I'm guessing the multi year deals wont give him the AAV he wants. Worth a gamble?