Cliff Lee

[Lefty]

He's owed either $52.5 million for two years or $37.5 million for one year. I think we owe Jackson $22 million for the next two years. We were prepared to pay Shields some amount for three years. Assuming Lee has physically recovered, do these facts coalesce into any scenario where we can trade Jackson for Lee as part of a package that leaves us where a Shields signing would have vis-à-vis payroll?

[Guest]

I don't think there's any reasonable outcome where acquiring Lee makes sense. He's coming off an elbow injury so taking on 1/38 in a deal now is a non-starter (never mind that the Phillies would want some level of real player compensation). Waiting til July still leaves you with paying him about 27 million for half a season or 40 million for 1.5 years if you want, and again that's on top of paying the real player cost that Lee would require, especially if he's pitching well. It's basically the Hamels situation to the nth degree, especially since there's no indication that Amaro is willing to eat money or realize that high salaries do diminish a player's trade value.

[squally1313]

I don't think there's any reasonable outcome where acquiring Lee makes sense. He's coming off an elbow injury so taking on 1/38 in a deal now is a non-starter (never mind that the Phillies would want some level of real player compensation). Waiting til July still leaves you with paying him about 27 million for half a season or 40 million for 1.5 years if you want, and again that's on top of paying the real player cost that Lee would require, especially if he's pitching well. It's basically the Hamels situation to the nth degree, especially since there's no indication that Amaro is willing to eat money or realize that high salaries do diminish a player's trade value.

Yeah the Amaro factor really puts a halt on things. Cameron put a decent article up on Fangraphs today basically saying that the Phillies should be using the money committed to Lee as a way of 'buying' young talent. There's nothing in Amaro's history to show he would be willing to think outside the box like that, or make reasonable valuations on what everything is worth, but if he was willing to pick up a good chunk of that contract for the purpose of acquiring talent, it could be worth a discussion.

[Backtobanks]

I don't think there's any reasonable outcome where acquiring Lee makes sense. He's coming off an elbow injury so taking on 1/38 in a deal now is a non-starter (never mind that the Phillies would want some level of real player compensation). Waiting til July still leaves you with paying him about 27 million for half a season or 40 million for 1.5 years if you want, and again that's on top of paying the real player cost that Lee would require, especially if he's pitching well. It's basically the Hamels situation to the nth degree, especially since there's no indication that Amaro is willing to eat money or realize that high salaries do diminish a player's trade value.

Yeah the Amaro factor really puts a halt on things. Cameron put a decent article up on Fangraphs today basically saying that the Phillies should be using the money committed to Lee as a way of 'buying' young talent. There's nothing in Amaro's history to show he would be willing to think outside the box like that, or make reasonable valuations on what everything is worth, but if he was willing to pick up a good chunk of that contract for the purpose of acquiring talent, it could be worth a discussion.

 

From MLBTR:

Cameron thinks the Phillies should bite the bullet and swallow the entire $25MM owed to Lee this season, leaving an acquiring club to cover the $12.5MM buyout or $27.5MM club option for next season. If the Phillies eat enough money, they should receive at least one notable prospect in exchange for the ace.

[Post Count Padder]

Phillies training camp is delightfully awkward, from Hamels saying he wants to win somewhere else, to Papelbon saying he needs to talk to the front office, to Amaro saying he shouldn't have said the club would be better off without Ryan Howard to this:

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/mlb-big-league-stew/cliff-lee-answers--tough--phillies-questions-with-magic-8-ball-231936890.html

 

So, your team president (Pat Gillick) said this team isn't likely to contend in the next 2-3 seasons. And Cole Hamels basically said the same thing yesterday.

So what's your take, Cliff?

 

"Hold on a second," Lee said, picking up the 8-ball and giving it a shake.

"Most likely," he said, relaying the 8-ball's message.

What do you think about Hamels' comments? You signed here to win.

"Yes, definitely," Lee said, again relying on his new toy.

Yes, definitely as in you want to be traded?"

"Let me see. That’s another tough one," Lee said. "I don’t know if I want to answer that. [Lifts up magic eight-ball] Very doubtful."

[dew1679666265]

That's pretty awesome.