Can the starting pitching be fixed for 2012?

[dew1679666265]

I guess I find it hard to believe the Cubs could bring in a first baseman and a top of the rotation pitcher.

 

I think the general idea is that we'll have somewhere around $35-45 million to spend after arb raises, etc. If we could get Fielder for $25 million and Wilson for $15, that falls right into the range of money we should have to spend.

 

I am a bit worried Wilson could regress too. Not worried enough to the point I would complain if signed to a Dempster-esque contract ($52M/4 years), but worried enough to not want him signed to a Zambrano type contract($91.5M/5 years). Plus, he'll be 31 at the end of the season. I guess it depends on how much attention he draws in the off season.

 

Wilson is 31, but he's largely been a reliever most of his career. He has less mileage than most 31 year old starters and should have a longer shelf life.

[KingKongvs.Godzilla]

I guess I find it hard to believe the Cubs could bring in a first baseman and a top of the rotation pitcher.

 

I think the general idea is that we'll have somewhere around $35-45 million to spend after arb raises, etc. If we could get Fielder for $25 million and Wilson for $15, that falls right into the range of money we should have to spend.

 

I am a bit worried Wilson could regress too. Not worried enough to the point I would complain if signed to a Dempster-esque contract ($52M/4 years), but worried enough to not want him signed to a Zambrano type contract($91.5M/5 years). Plus, he'll be 31 at the end of the season. I guess it depends on how much attention he draws in the off season.

 

Wilson is 31, but he's largely been a reliever most of his career. He has less mileage than most 31 year old starters and should have a longer shelf life.

 

Not to mention that really good pitchers nowadays seem to do alright in their early and even mid-30's.

[questionmarkgrace]

I guess I find it hard to believe the Cubs could bring in a first baseman and a top of the rotation pitcher.

 

I think the general idea is that we'll have somewhere around $35-45 million to spend after arb raises, etc. If we could get Fielder for $25 million and Wilson for $15, that falls right into the range of money we should have to spend.

 

I am a bit worried Wilson could regress too. Not worried enough to the point I would complain if signed to a Dempster-esque contract ($52M/4 years), but worried enough to not want him signed to a Zambrano type contract($91.5M/5 years). Plus, he'll be 31 at the end of the season. I guess it depends on how much attention he draws in the off season.

 

Wilson is 31, but he's largely been a reliever most of his career. He has less mileage than most 31 year old starters and should have a longer shelf life.

 

Not to mention that really good pitchers nowadays seem to do alright in their early and even mid-30's.

 

Wow. I did not know he was that old. I was thinking 28. what kind of contract do you think he will command? 4 - 5 years? No sure if I would be comfortable with them going that long.

[Sammy Sofa]

I guess I find it hard to believe the Cubs could bring in a first baseman and a top of the rotation pitcher.

 

I think the general idea is that we'll have somewhere around $35-45 million to spend after arb raises, etc. If we could get Fielder for $25 million and Wilson for $15, that falls right into the range of money we should have to spend.

 

I am a bit worried Wilson could regress too. Not worried enough to the point I would complain if signed to a Dempster-esque contract ($52M/4 years), but worried enough to not want him signed to a Zambrano type contract($91.5M/5 years). Plus, he'll be 31 at the end of the season. I guess it depends on how much attention he draws in the off season.

 

Wilson is 31, but he's largely been a reliever most of his career. He has less mileage than most 31 year old starters and should have a longer shelf life.

 

Not to mention that really good pitchers nowadays seem to do alright in their early and even mid-30's.

 

Wow. I did not know he was that old. I was thinking 28. what kind of contract do you think he will command? 4 - 5 years? No sure if I would be comfortable with them going that long.

 

Why not? You seem to be missing half of what you bolded.

[questionmarkgrace]

I guess I find it hard to believe the Cubs could bring in a first baseman and a top of the rotation pitcher.

 

I think the general idea is that we'll have somewhere around $35-45 million to spend after arb raises, etc. If we could get Fielder for $25 million and Wilson for $15, that falls right into the range of money we should have to spend.

 

I am a bit worried Wilson could regress too. Not worried enough to the point I would complain if signed to a Dempster-esque contract ($52M/4 years), but worried enough to not want him signed to a Zambrano type contract($91.5M/5 years). Plus, he'll be 31 at the end of the season. I guess it depends on how much attention he draws in the off season.

 

Wilson is 31, but he's largely been a reliever most of his career. He has less mileage than most 31 year old starters and should have a longer shelf life.

 

Not to mention that really good pitchers nowadays seem to do alright in their early and even mid-30's.

 

Wow. I did not know he was that old. I was thinking 28. what kind of contract do you think he will command? 4 - 5 years? No sure if I would be comfortable with them going that long.

 

Why not? You seem to be missing half of what you bolded.

 

Wegotwood98 bolded that. I get that he has been a reliever and that he has had less miles. but I would be much more comfortable with 3 years and options for 4 and 5.

[Sammy Sofa]

He's not signing for 3 years.

[questionmarkgrace]

He's not signing for 3 years.

 

thats kind of what I figured.

[Sammy Sofa]

So why would 4 years be a deal-breaker? It's just one more season and he has a lot less wear and tear on his body than most pitchers of his ability.

[davearm2]

"It's just one more season" is how the Cubs landed Soriano.

[Sammy Sofa]

Stellar analysis there. Yes, they should pass on signing C.J. Wilson to 4 years because they signed Alfonso Soriano to an 8-year contract. Magnificent deduction.

[Sammy Sofa]

Just for some non-davearm2 perspective, C.J. Wilson will turn 31 this fall, but will only have approx. 700 innings pitched under his belt. By contrast, CC Sabathia also turned 31 this year, and he will have approx. 2400 innings pitched to his name. Carlos Zambrano will turn 31 next year and will likely have nearly 2100 innings pitched. C.J. Wilson has not had anywhere near the typical workload a starting pitcher of his age usually has.

[TruffleShuffle]

Stellar analysis there. Yes, they should pass on signing C.J. Wilson to 4 years because they signed Alfonso Soriano to an 8-year contract. Magnificent deduction.

 

if you don't go a little longer than you want sometimes, you're not going to get good free agents to come play for you (unless you're lucky like the phillies and cliff lee has trash thrown on her by yankee fans, so he doesn't want to sign with them). who's the last top-flight free agent between 27 and 32 years old who only signed a 3 year deal?

 

and as for the soriano contract, nobody would really give a [expletive] if he sucked for year 8 and wasn't that great in year 7. the problem is that he sucked in year 3, wasn't too good in year 4, sucks again in year 5, and probably won't be any good years 6 to 8. but that's what you get when you sign a free swinger to an 8 year deal when he's coming off a career year at age 30.

[Sammy Sofa]

I never thought the most annoying thing about the Soriano contract would be the meatballs who blanch at the idea of any contract for more than 3-4 years and $50 million as being some kind of millstone that's going to sink the Cubs for years.

[KingKongvs.Godzilla]

I guess I find it hard to believe the Cubs could bring in a first baseman and a top of the rotation pitcher.

 

I think the general idea is that we'll have somewhere around $35-45 million to spend after arb raises, etc. If we could get Fielder for $25 million and Wilson for $15, that falls right into the range of money we should have to spend.

 

I am a bit worried Wilson could regress too. Not worried enough to the point I would complain if signed to a Dempster-esque contract ($52M/4 years), but worried enough to not want him signed to a Zambrano type contract($91.5M/5 years). Plus, he'll be 31 at the end of the season. I guess it depends on how much attention he draws in the off season.

 

Wilson is 31, but he's largely been a reliever most of his career. He has less mileage than most 31 year old starters and should have a longer shelf life.

 

Not to mention that really good pitchers nowadays seem to do alright in their early and even mid-30's.

 

Wow. I did not know he was that old. I was thinking 28. what kind of contract do you think he will command? 4 - 5 years? No sure if I would be comfortable with them going that long.

 

I'm thinking AJ Burnett or maybe Carlos Zambrano money/years.

 

I'd be happy to have him for that much too, because I think Wilson will be a coup.

 

I never thought the most annoying thing about the Soriano contract would be the meatballs who blanch at the idea of any contract for more than 3-4 years and $50 million as being some kind of millstone that's going to sink the Cubs for years.

 

I hate this effect too. Not so much here, where I don't post so much, but Cubs fans seem awfully scared to spend money this offseason, no matter who the money is spent on. Everyone will be finished in a matter of 3-4 years, if that.

 

Soriano, if the Trib minded their own business, could be gone as early as next year....That irks me.

[abuck1220]

yeah, i hate to break to you, but you will never sign a single good free agent if you're not going to give them more than 3 years. so you better hope brooks raley or whoever ends up being super awesome.

[TruffleShuffle]

yeah, the focus should be on signing the right players to long-term deals, not being afraid that some guy will turn into a pumpkin 5 minutes after you sign him. any contract can be a terrible one - soriano's is terrible, but so was jason schmidt's... that was basically $0 worth of production for $47 million worth of payment. if we sign, say, pujols to a $250 million contract and we get $220 million worth of production, who gives a [expletive]? the problem is if you get $50 million of production, then the contract is a disaster.

[davearm2]

yeah, i hate to break to you, but you will never sign a single good free agent if you're not going to give them more than 3 years. so you better hope brooks raley or whoever ends up being super awesome.

Who said that?

 

I'm opposed to offering guys 25%+ more years and/or dollars than everyone else. Such as they did for Soriano. And such as folks apparently want to do for CJ Wilson.

[seanhopper]

Hendry should be one of the more active Gm's during this deadline. They clearly need more MLB ready pitching (as we saw this year) and should be willing to part with players like Byrd to make it happen. The Braves have a number of pitchers in the upper level that could be ready by 2012 that Hendry should be going after. The Rangers are now in need of outfield help and could be an option or at least be used as leverage to get the Braves to give up one of their better minor league arms.

[dew1679666265]

Hendry should be one of the more active Gm's during this deadline. They clearly need more MLB ready pitching (as we saw this year) and should be willing to part with players like Byrd to make it happen. The Braves have a number of pitchers in the upper level that could be ready by 2012 that Hendry should be going after. The Rangers are now in need of outfield help and could be an option or at least be used as leverage to get the Braves to give up one of their better minor league arms.

 

If we trade Byrd, who takes his place next year? There's also the issue that the other team needs to have an interest in the player you're shopping and have enough interest to give up one or more of those upper level arms that you're coveting.

[seanhopper]

Hendry should be one of the more active Gm's during this deadline. They clearly need more MLB ready pitching (as we saw this year) and should be willing to part with players like Byrd to make it happen. The Braves have a number of pitchers in the upper level that could be ready by 2012 that Hendry should be going after. The Rangers are now in need of outfield help and could be an option or at least be used as leverage to get the Braves to give up one of their better minor league arms.

 

If we trade Byrd, who takes his place next year? There's also the issue that the other team needs to have an interest in the player you're shopping and have enough interest to give up one or more of those upper level arms that you're coveting.

 

Of course there has to be interest from the other side. The Braves have come out and said they don't want a rental and want a player that will be on the team in 2012 (hence their run at Pence). Byrd's contract is a perfect fit for the Braves. What he is not, is a lead-off hitter that they're supposedly looking at now --like Crisp or Bourn.

[SouthSideRyan]

yeah, i hate to break to you, but you will never sign a single good free agent if you're not going to give them more than 3 years. so you better hope brooks raley or whoever ends up being super awesome.

Who said that?

 

I'm opposed to offering guys 25%+ more years and/or dollars than everyone else. Such as they did for Soriano. And such as folks apparently want to do for CJ Wilson.

 

I'm floored that people think CJ Wilso will get something like 3/30 on the FA market.

[Guest]

yeah, i hate to break to you, but you will never sign a single good free agent if you're not going to give them more than 3 years. so you better hope brooks raley or whoever ends up being super awesome.

Who said that?

 

I'm opposed to offering guys 25%+ more years and/or dollars than everyone else. Such as they did for Soriano. And such as folks apparently want to do for CJ Wilson.

 

I'm floored that people think CJ Wilso will get something like 3/30 on the FA market.

 

I'm floored that davearm is interpreting people as saying "Give CJ Wilson 5/75 even if he's only going to get 4/40 from anywhere else". Well, maybe it's not that surprising.

[Elwood]

In case there were any doubts about the Cubs spending some money. Jimbo thinks we can compete next year.

 

‘‘A couple of new acquisitions, and for the first time in a few years, there’s significant dollars coming off the books,’’ Hendry said. ‘‘All’s you need is your young people to keep getting better, and you make the right moves with the money that now will be available, and why couldn’t you be right back in it?

 

And he also had this to say.

 

‘‘You always need some kind of rebuilding when you’re in fifth place, absolutely,’’ Hendry said. ‘‘But you certainly don’t look at it like, ‘We’re not going to compete for a few years.’ When somebody says, ‘Blow the place up and start over and do it right,’ well, OK, does that mean we should get rid of the people who are very young and very good?’’

 

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/cubs/6782205-417/gm-jim-hendry-doesnt-believe-cubs-need-to-go-boom-to-improve.html

[Sammy Sofa]

yeah, i hate to break to you, but you will never sign a single good free agent if you're not going to give them more than 3 years. so you better hope brooks raley or whoever ends up being super awesome.

Who said that?

 

I'm opposed to offering guys 25%+ more years and/or dollars than everyone else. Such as they did for Soriano. And such as folks apparently want to do for CJ Wilson.

 

BRAVO! Simply spectacular! A master at work!

[KingKongvs.Godzilla]

yeah, i hate to break to you, but you will never sign a single good free agent if you're not going to give them more than 3 years. so you better hope brooks raley or whoever ends up being super awesome.

Who said that?

 

I'm opposed to offering guys 25%+ more years and/or dollars than everyone else. Such as they did for Soriano. And such as folks apparently want to do for CJ Wilson.

 

Yea, you're not going to get CJ Wilson cheap.