Source: Zito to The Giants

[fromthestretch]

That's alot of money for a guy who hasn't topped 88 in many of the games i've watched him.

 

Would anyone really be surprised if Zito @ 17 per and Lilly@ 10 per both put up ERA's right around 4, give or take a few?

 

I would. Zito will play his home games at AT & T Park, Lilly at Wrigley. Zito will be in the NL West with its share of pitcher's parks, Lilly in the NL Central.

 

Petco is the only true pitcher's park in that division. LA has been well below average, but that's a reflection of the crappy offensive teams they've assembled lately. Dodger Stadium was top 10 last year, and Juan Pierre aside, it should stay that way with the influx of good young offensive talent. AT&T is about average, but Coors and Chase are still 2 of the premier hitter's parks in the game.

 

Is Coors still a premier hitter's park with the humidor (I haven't looked at the numbers)?

 

Interestingly enough, yup.

 

Considering how large the outfield is there, it will probably always play as a hitter's park. Even if the ball isn't going out at a high rate, there's a ton of room for hits to drop in.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

That's alot of money for a guy who hasn't topped 88 in many of the games i've watched him.

 

Would anyone really be surprised if Zito @ 17 per and Lilly@ 10 per both put up ERA's right around 4, give or take a few?

 

I would. Zito will play his home games at AT & T Park, Lilly at Wrigley. Zito will be in the NL West with its share of pitcher's parks, Lilly in the NL Central.

 

Petco is the only true pitcher's park in that division. LA has been well below average, but that's a reflection of the crappy offensive teams they've assembled lately. Dodger Stadium was top 10 last year, and Juan Pierre aside, it should stay that way with the influx of good young offensive talent. AT&T is about average, but Coors and Chase are still 2 of the premier hitter's parks in the game.

 

Is Coors still a premier hitter's park with the humidor (I haven't looked at the numbers)?

 

Interestingly enough, yup.

 

Thanks.

[goonys evil twin]

Is Coors still a premier hitter's park with the humidor (I haven't looked at the numbers)?

 

Interestingly enough, yup.

 

Considering how large the outfield is there, it will probably always play as a hitter's park. Even if the ball isn't going out at a high rate, there's a ton of room for hits to drop in.

 

I always wanted to see them bring in the fences, and raise them higher. Cut down on the singles and the gap shots, even though you might get a few more HR. If you allow the OFers to cover less ground, it might help a lot.

[nilodnayr]

Is Coors still a premier hitter's park with the humidor (I haven't looked at the numbers)?

 

Interestingly enough, yup.

 

Considering how large the outfield is there, it will probably always play as a hitter's park. Even if the ball isn't going out at a high rate, there's a ton of room for hits to drop in.

 

True, it still is a hitters park, just not as much as it was. I think the humidor affect is probably overblown due to the fact that it was probably the first time they actually had a decent rotation. Does the humidor have an affect on the motion of curveballs or just how far you can hit the ball?

[nilodnayr]

Is Coors still a premier hitter's park with the humidor (I haven't looked at the numbers)?

 

Interestingly enough, yup.

 

Considering how large the outfield is there, it will probably always play as a hitter's park. Even if the ball isn't going out at a high rate, there's a ton of room for hits to drop in.

 

I always wanted to see them bring in the fences, and raise them higher. Cut down on the singles and the gap shots, even though you might get a few more HR. If you allow the OFers to cover less ground, it might help a lot.

 

Could be worse, they could have a hill and poles in play in CF.

[A New Era]

Can we just call up Zambrano right now and offer him an identical contract before people start talking 8 years?

 

NOT WORTH IT.

 

Z is great and all and a fabulous Cub and pitcher but no pitcher is worth this kind of contract.

 

Mr. MacPhail, is that you?

 

No, it's a rational cubs fan. The ONLY players that are worth that kind of mone are an A-rod, Manny Ramirez calibur offensive player. And yes by saying that I'm saying Soriano ain't worth that. But alteast with him I think we are overpaying by a few mil a year, and we had to. With Zito you are overpaying about $7 mil a year.

[nilodnayr]

That's alot of money for a guy who hasn't topped 88 in many of the games i've watched him.

 

Would anyone really be surprised if Zito @ 17 per and Lilly@ 10 per both put up ERA's right around 4, give or take a few?

 

I would. Zito will play his home games at AT & T Park, Lilly at Wrigley. Zito will be in the NL West with its share of pitcher's parks, Lilly in the NL Central.

 

ZiPS projected him at 4.37 ERA as an A.

 

Updated projection. Love the analogy :D

[fromthestretch]

Is Coors still a premier hitter's park with the humidor (I haven't looked at the numbers)?

 

Interestingly enough, yup.

 

Considering how large the outfield is there, it will probably always play as a hitter's park. Even if the ball isn't going out at a high rate, there's a ton of room for hits to drop in.

 

I always wanted to see them bring in the fences, and raise them higher. Cut down on the singles and the gap shots, even though you might get a few more HR. If you allow the OFers to cover less ground, it might help a lot.

 

Agreed. The way it's built now, it would still most likely be a hitter's park at sea level.

[Soul]

The only hope I have is that maybe Lilly just never had to learn to pitch more for the ground ball because he was playing in that cavernous dome.

 

I know. Pretty thin.

 

The Rogers Centre inflates home runs more than Wrigley.

 

Also, I don't see how 328ft foul lines, 375 ft power alleys, and 400 ft CF really qualifies as "cavernous". Thats pretty much the same as the Great American Smallpark.

 

You're right, Rogers isn't all that huge. I must have been confusing it with the Expos' old place.

 

Still, the wind never blows out at the dome. That's what I'm hoping for----Wrigley will turn a fly ball pitcher into a quick loser on those days. He'll have to learn how to pitch with that wind or it's going to be rough. Is it possible Lilly could progress just out of necessity, learn a few new tricks? Pretty slim hope, but hey I'm allowed to dream.

 

And if he doesn't, he's just going to suck on those days which is going to be pretty frustrating.

[Prior4CyYoung]

I know the market is high this year and I really like Zito but thats a retardly high amount of money. They could have resigned Schmidt for less than that. Plus didnt Boras say they wanted 100 mill? If thats the case why would you pay that much money. I dont know what the other offers for him where but I doubt they were really that high so its overpaying for no reason really.

[nilodnayr]

The only hope I have is that maybe Lilly just never had to learn to pitch more for the ground ball because he was playing in that cavernous dome.

 

I know. Pretty thin.

 

The Rogers Centre inflates home runs more than Wrigley.

 

Also, I don't see how 328ft foul lines, 375 ft power alleys, and 400 ft CF really qualifies as "cavernous". Thats pretty much the same as the Great American Smallpark.

 

You're right, Rogers isn't all that huge. I must have been confusing it with the Expos' old place.

 

Still, the wind never blows out at the dome. That's what I'm hoping for----Wrigley will turn a fly ball pitcher into a quick loser on those days. He'll have to learn how to pitch with that wind or it's going to be rough. Is it possible Lilly could progress just out of necessity, learn a few new tricks? Pretty slim hope, but hey I'm allowed to dream.

 

And if he doesn't, he's just going to suck on those days which is going to be pretty frustrating.

 

 

Ehh, Olypic Stadium had nearly the same dimensions and on average was a hitters park as well.

 

The wind is definitely a problem, but it all depends on luck, if he pitches on a day the wind blows in, allowing FBs is going to help him.

[Fro]

One of the most ridiclous contracts ever :shock:

[NorthsideAvenger]

One of the most ridiclous contracts ever :shock:

 

Apparently the Giants didn't learn from the Dodgers/Rockies mistakes (Brown/Hampton) are on dued to experience there version of "buyer's remorse" within 3 yrs.

 

Under no circumstance SHOULD ANY PITCHER---healthy or not---shoudl get more then 5 yrs or said team is severely risking finicancial suicide. I know the pros and cons on the Zito deal, but the Giants screwed themselves.

[davearm]

Is Coors still a premier hitter's park with the humidor (I haven't looked at the numbers)?

 

Interestingly enough, yup.

 

Considering how large the outfield is there, it will probably always play as a hitter's park. Even if the ball isn't going out at a high rate, there's a ton of room for hits to drop in.

 

I always wanted to see them bring in the fences, and raise them higher. Cut down on the singles and the gap shots, even though you might get a few more HR. If you allow the OFers to cover less ground, it might help a lot.

 

Agreed. The way it's built now, it would still most likely be a hitter's park at sea level.

This whole conversation strikes me as bizarre.

 

If I'm reading this right, part of what makes Coors such a hitter's park are the *deep* fences/large OF?!?

 

If you put Coors Field at sea level, wouldn't you simply get Petco, or RFK, or Dolphins Stadium, or original Comerica (before they moved the fences in)? Those are all parks with deep(ish) fences/large(ish) OFs, and they're universally considered pitcher's parks.

[Careless]

I think the humidor affect is probably overblown due to the fact that it was probably the first time they actually had a decent rotation. Does the humidor have an affect on the motion of curveballs or just how far you can hit the ball?

I've heard that it causes the stitches to stand out more, so there's more spin. No idea if anyone has measured/tested it, though.

[nilodnayr]

Is Coors still a premier hitter's park with the humidor (I haven't looked at the numbers)?

 

Interestingly enough, yup.

 

Considering how large the outfield is there, it will probably always play as a hitter's park. Even if the ball isn't going out at a high rate, there's a ton of room for hits to drop in.

 

I always wanted to see them bring in the fences, and raise them higher. Cut down on the singles and the gap shots, even though you might get a few more HR. If you allow the OFers to cover less ground, it might help a lot.

 

Agreed. The way it's built now, it would still most likely be a hitter's park at sea level.

This whole conversation strikes me as bizarre.

 

If I'm reading this right, part of what makes Coors such a hitter's park are the *deep* fences/large OF?!?

 

If you put Coors Field at sea level, wouldn't you simply get Petco, or RFK, or Dolphins Stadium, or original Comerica (before they moved the fences in)? Those are all parks with deep(ish) fences/large(ish) OFs, and they're universally considered pitcher's parks.

 

Its gigantic...

 

Left Field - 347 ft

Left-Center - 390 ft

Center Field - 415 ft

Right-Center - 375 ft

Right Field - 350 ft

 

 

Its asymmetrical with the deepest part of the parking being 424 ft in Right-Center. Plus the out of town scoreboard in RF is 17 feet high.

 

Doubles and triples are inflated in Coors significantly as well.

[Sweet Swinging Billy]

With the money that it costs the Giants to sign Zito, I'm glad the Cubs have a cheaper version in Rich Hill. I think it will be interesting to see how Zito performs when he first comes to Wrigley.