Juan Pierre OR Felix Pie

[gflore34]

Keep in mind that if we let Pierre go, we also will get two additional draft picks.

 

So...the choice is Pie + two additional first round picks vs. Pierre.

 

 

Heck, I'd let Pagan play CF for however long is needed until Pie is ready rather than re-sign Pierre.

 

This is what I would do. Offer Pierre arbitration-we would like him to decline, but if he accepts, it wouldn't be that bad to have him play CF for another year. Do not sign him to a multi-year deal.

exactamundo! And make it clear up front in the negotiations that we're only interested in a one year deal since Pie will soon be ready.

 

We have a winner!

[C.C.]

Could Pie project better as a corner OF? With that power, he seems out of place in CF. Sure, you have Carlos Beltran doing it, but are we better served putting Pie in RF?

 

...I don't understand. Is there something wrong with having power if you play CF? Isn't that a good thing? And his power is still developing, so he's definitely better suited for CF in terms of value, especailly with his defensive skills. And it's not as if Beltran is the only power hitting CF in the game--Sizemore? Edmonds? Damon? (how does he have 21 homers already?) Wells? Cameron? Jones? Hunter?

 

Pie could probably use another half season, but he deserves a shot. He had an enomous slump a couple of months ago. In May and June, Pie hit under .230 and struck out 63 times. In July and August, he's figured it out. Only 41 K's in more at-bats over the last two months. In August he's been fantastic, hitting .340/.394/.620 with 12 doubles, two triples, four homers. Since the ASB, Pie is hitting .330/.378/.542. Also, after strugglng badly with stolen base accuracy, he is now 8 for his last 9 steal attempts.

 

If he were putting up his overall numbers in AAA consistently over a season, I wouldn't be so inclined to give him a shot. However, Pie has shown at every level an ability to adjust. As a 21 year old in AAA coming off a half season injury-related layoff, it's not surprising that Pie might struggle, but it's mighty impressve how quickly and drastically he's turned it around.

 

Comparing him to Patterson, keep in mind that Corey was promoted when he was having a bad season at AAA to be a sparkplug or some other bullcrap. He hadn't shown anywhere near the improvement over the course of the season that Pie has this year. Being cautious of rushing is important, but the situations aren't parallel.

 

Yep! You can see him improving in all areas that have always been question marks with him, that's why I say let him keep improving down in AAA. If the Cubs were a good enough team to absorb his struggles (like the Sox did with Anderson) then I would entertain the thought, but obviously we aren't even close to that...

[Warpticon]

Could Pie project better as a corner OF? With that power, he seems out of place in CF. Sure, you have Carlos Beltran doing it, but are we better served putting Pie in RF?

 

...I don't understand. Is there something wrong with having power if you play CF? Isn't that a good thing? And his power is still developing, so he's definitely better suited for CF in terms of value, especailly with his defensive skills. And it's not as if Beltran is the only power hitting CF in the game--Sizemore? Edmonds? Damon? (how does he have 21 homers already?) Wells? Cameron? Jones? Hunter?

 

Pie could probably use another half season, but he deserves a shot. He had an enomous slump a couple of months ago. In May and June, Pie hit under .230 and struck out 63 times. In July and August, he's figured it out. Only 41 K's in more at-bats over the last two months. In August he's been fantastic, hitting .340/.394/.620 with 12 doubles, two triples, four homers. Since the ASB, Pie is hitting .330/.378/.542. Also, after strugglng badly with stolen base accuracy, he is now 8 for his last 9 steal attempts.

 

If he were putting up his overall numbers in AAA consistently over a season, I wouldn't be so inclined to give him a shot. However, Pie has shown at every level an ability to adjust. As a 21 year old in AAA coming off a half season injury-related layoff, it's not surprising that Pie might struggle, but it's mighty impressve how quickly and drastically he's turned it around.

 

Comparing him to Patterson, keep in mind that Corey was promoted when he was having a bad season at AAA to be a sparkplug or some other bullcrap. He hadn't shown anywhere near the improvement over the course of the season that Pie has this year. Being cautious of rushing is important, but the situations aren't parallel.

 

Yep! You can see him improving in all areas that have always been question marks with him, that's why I say let him keep improving down in AAA. If the Cubs were a good enough team to absorb his struggles (like the Sox did with Anderson) then I would entertain the thought, but obviously we aren't even close to that...

 

So if they're not even close to that, then they're not going to compete. If they're not going to complete, then why not give him a shot?

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Pie in a landslide.

 

He wouldn't be damaged by staying in AAA to start next year, but he's clearly made an adjustment and is just raking there right now. He strikes out a bit, but it's no higher than last year(which was better than the year before), and he's walking more than he ever has. Don't put him in a corner OF spot, just put him in CF and leave him there until at least 2011 or so unless he goes through a Pattersonian struggle.

[baseball7897]

PIERRE.

 

Pie has NO major league experience. Untill he gets some AB's in the big leagues, then you can judge him.

[jmajew]

Keep in mind that if we let Pierre go, we also will get two additional draft picks.

 

So...the choice is Pie + two additional first round picks vs. Pierre.

 

 

Heck, I'd let Pagan play CF for however long is needed until Pie is ready rather than re-sign Pierre.

 

This is what I would do. Offer Pierre arbitration-we would like him to decline, but if he accepts, it wouldn't be that bad to have him play CF for another year. Do not sign him to a multi-year deal.

exactamundo! And make it clear up front in the negotiations that we're only interested in a one year deal since Pie will soon be ready.

 

We have a winner!

 

This is clearly the way to go. Pie is going to be a beast. The only question is will he be able to bat leadoff by 2008? Or will his abilities be better suited to bat 3-5?

[Laura]

It's worth noting that Pie missed the second half of the '05 season in AA due to injury. He was not only promoted to AAA this year, but he had to 'shake off some rust' to start the season.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

This is clearly the way to go. Pie is going to be a beast. The only question is will he be able to bat leadoff by 2008? Or will his abilities be better suited to bat 3-5?

 

Pie will never be a leadoff hitter. If he gets the production you want out of a leadoff hitter, then he's going to be doing it with enough power that you want him deeper in the order.

[C.C.]

Could Pie project better as a corner OF? With that power, he seems out of place in CF. Sure, you have Carlos Beltran doing it, but are we better served putting Pie in RF?

 

...I don't understand. Is there something wrong with having power if you play CF? Isn't that a good thing? And his power is still developing, so he's definitely better suited for CF in terms of value, especailly with his defensive skills. And it's not as if Beltran is the only power hitting CF in the game--Sizemore? Edmonds? Damon? (how does he have 21 homers already?) Wells? Cameron? Jones? Hunter?

 

Pie could probably use another half season, but he deserves a shot. He had an enomous slump a couple of months ago. In May and June, Pie hit under .230 and struck out 63 times. In July and August, he's figured it out. Only 41 K's in more at-bats over the last two months. In August he's been fantastic, hitting .340/.394/.620 with 12 doubles, two triples, four homers. Since the ASB, Pie is hitting .330/.378/.542. Also, after strugglng badly with stolen base accuracy, he is now 8 for his last 9 steal attempts.

 

If he were putting up his overall numbers in AAA consistently over a season, I wouldn't be so inclined to give him a shot. However, Pie has shown at every level an ability to adjust. As a 21 year old in AAA coming off a half season injury-related layoff, it's not surprising that Pie might struggle, but it's mighty impressve how quickly and drastically he's turned it around.

 

Comparing him to Patterson, keep in mind that Corey was promoted when he was having a bad season at AAA to be a sparkplug or some other bullcrap. He hadn't shown anywhere near the improvement over the course of the season that Pie has this year. Being cautious of rushing is important, but the situations aren't parallel.

 

Yep! You can see him improving in all areas that have always been question marks with him, that's why I say let him keep improving down in AAA. If the Cubs were a good enough team to absorb his struggles (like the Sox did with Anderson) then I would entertain the thought, but obviously we aren't even close to that...

 

So if they're not even close to that, then they're not going to compete. If they're not going to complete, then why not give him a shot?

 

Because you know how bitter Cubs fans have become. If Anderson was on the Cubs this year he would've been boo(ed) off the field already. He's still improving and growing. No reason to have him do this in the bigs...

[goonys evil twin]

Could Pie project better as a corner OF? With that power, he seems out of place in CF. Sure, you have Carlos Beltran doing it, but are we better served putting Pie in RF?

 

You only put power into the corner OF because usually power hitters cannot field a position like CF effectively. If Pie can do it, than it is a big bonus to get a power hitter at one of the tougher defensive positions.

 

Exactly. You don't move a power hitter CF to corner OF because he hits for power. That makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. If a guy can handle CF, you put him in CF. That's hard to find. It's easier to fill left and right.

[C.C.]

Could Pie project better as a corner OF? With that power, he seems out of place in CF. Sure, you have Carlos Beltran doing it, but are we better served putting Pie in RF?

 

You only put power into the corner OF because usually power hitters cannot field a position like CF effectively. If Pie can do it, than it is a big bonus to get a power hitter at one of the tougher defensive positions.

 

Exactly. You don't move a power hitter CF to corner OF because he hits for power. That makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. If a guy can handle CF, you put him in CF. That's hard to find. It's easier to fill left and right.

 

Right. If they followed that theory AROD would've never played Shortstop.

[goonys evil twin]

PIERRE.

 

Pie has NO major league experience. Untill he gets some AB's in the big leagues, then you can judge him.

 

That's the worst way to come to a decision.

[A New Era]

I want Pierre next year. Let's see how good Pie can do a full year next year at AAA. Don't rush him up next year. Just let him get better and even more confidence at AAA.

[Guest]

PIERRE.

 

Pie has NO major league experience. Untill he gets some AB's in the big leagues, then you can judge him.

So...

 

Nobody should ever play a rookie because they don't have any major league AB's. And they can't get any major league AB's because nobody should ever play them.

 

 

Got it.

[baseball7897]

Pie would benefit with another 1/2 season in AAA.

 

I could see him being a call-up after the all-star game next year, and making a huge impact on the Cubs playoff hopes. Miguel Cabrera, made a huge impact on the Marlins winning the World Series in 03.

[Guest]

I want Pierre next year. Let's see how good Pie can do a full year next year at AAA. Don't rush him up next year. Just let him get better and even more confidence at AAA.

Pierre is going to get a multi-year contract offer from someone. I hope it isn't the Cubs. If he accepts arby and plays here one more year, then I'm fine with him sticking around. But I really don't want him signed to a multi-season deal.

[Wheelimus]

How about we send both Angel Pagan and Matt Murton to winter ball this year to play center field. Yeah yeah yeah, I know, Murton doesn't have what it takes to play center or whatever. How about we actually substantiate that with results instead of just saying that because he isn't the fastest guy on earth.

 

In this scenario, you could let Angel and Matt share righties with Matt getting the lions share but taking guys off who you just don't think he's going to hit well. Angel takes every single lefty start from Jacque. Sign a big bat in left, and Soriano for second.

 

Soriano

Barrett

D-Lee

Aram

C-Lee

Jones

Murton/Pagan

Izturis

 

Yeah, not a bad lineup. We could afford it too.

[C.C.]

I want Pierre next year. Let's see how good Pie can do a full year next year at AAA. Don't rush him up next year. Just let him get better and even more confidence at AAA.

Pierre is going to get a multi-year contract offer from someone. I hope it isn't the Cubs. If he accepts arby and plays here one more year, then I'm fine with him sticking around. But I really don't want him signed to a multi-season deal.

 

Yep! I can't see Hendry signing Pierre to a multi-year deal knowing Pie is getting very close...

[Guest]

I'd probably be happiest if the Cubs started the season with Jacque Jones in CF (meaning they signed/traded for a big bat in RF). When Pie is ready to push Jones out of center, trade him.

 

In the meantime, to the arby thing and get draft picks when Pierre signs elsewhere.

[baseball7897]

PIERRE.

 

Pie has NO major league experience. Untill he gets some AB's in the big leagues, then you can judge him.

So...

 

Nobody should ever play a rookie because they don't have any major league AB's. And they can't get any major league AB's because nobody should ever play them.

 

 

Got it.

 

When did I say that no team should play a rookie?

 

It would be easier to judge Pie with some at-bats in the big leagues. Big leagues compared to AAA, well, there is no comparison.

[C.C.]

Matt Murton to winter ball this year to play center field.

 

 

:shock:

[Warpticon]

Because you know how bitter Cubs fans have become. If Anderson was on the Cubs this year he would've been boo(ed) off the field already. He's still improving and growing. No reason to have him do this in the bigs...

 

I haven't gotten to watch a lot of games, but has there been a lot of booing of Ronny Cedeno?

 

When did I say that no team should play a rookie?

 

It would be easier to judge Pie with some at-bats in the big leagues. Big leagues compared to AAA, well, there is no comparison.

 

But there is some comparison. It's not a parallel comparison, but you can determine some things. If there was absolutely NO comparison, there'd be no point in having minor leagues.

[A New Era]

I want Pierre next year. Let's see how good Pie can do a full year next year at AAA. Don't rush him up next year. Just let him get better and even more confidence at AAA.

Pierre is going to get a multi-year contract offer from someone. I hope it isn't the Cubs. If he accepts arby and plays here one more year, then I'm fine with him sticking around. But I really don't want him signed to a multi-season deal.

 

So offer arb, or sign for 3-years. I mean if he does good next year (which I beleive he will). . Offer him a decent offer nothing like 9mil a year. More like a slight raise. From interviews he has always said he loves playing for the Cubs. So he should accept it. And it wouldn't be that hard to trade a 2 year contract of a speedy lead-off hitter who is hitting well.

[gflore34]

I want Pierre next year. Let's see how good Pie can do a full year next year at AAA. Don't rush him up next year. Just let him get better and even more confidence at AAA.

Pierre is going to get a multi-year contract offer from someone. I hope it isn't the Cubs. If he accepts arby and plays here one more year, then I'm fine with him sticking around. But I really don't want him signed to a multi-season deal.

 

Yep! I can't see Hendry signing Pierre to a multi-year deal knowing Pie is getting very close...

 

I disagree, I can readily see Hendry being doped by Pierre' recent success and his "hard working" approach into signing him to a multi-year deal. Maybe no Baker next season will keep Pierre from re-signing but, I believe Hendry' going to offer a multi-year deal, see Rusch and Perez.

[baseball7897]

I want Pierre next year. Let's see how good Pie can do a full year next year at AAA. Don't rush him up next year. Just let him get better and even more confidence at AAA.

Pierre is going to get a multi-year contract offer from someone. I hope it isn't the Cubs. If he accepts arby and plays here one more year, then I'm fine with him sticking around. But I really don't want him signed to a multi-season deal.

 

Yep! I can't see Hendry signing Pierre to a multi-year deal knowing Pie is getting very close...

 

I disagree, I can readily see Hendry being doped by Pierre' recent success and his "hard working" approach into signing him to a multi-year deal. Maybe no Baker next season will keep Pierre from re-signing but, I believe Hendry' going to offer a multi-year deal, see Rusch and Perez.

 

Hendry is a huge Juan Pierre fan. I could see him signing Pierre to a 2yr extension.

 

I also could see Hendry trading for Vernon Wells. Specially since Tim Wilken has spent some years in the Toronto organization. I believe Wilken drafted Vernon Wells also.

 

The hiring of Tim Wilken as the Cubs Amateur and Professional scout, has been one of the smartest moves they have made in a long time.